I don't have the time to make that many shaders, otherwise I'd be making all of my own all day long. It's nice to have some good shaders to work with, then tweak them till you get exactly what you want. I'm looking forward to some pictures of Shades of Reality Clint, I'm definately interested in getting them, but I want to see them first. That's what sold me on litst's Real World Metals, I took one look at the pictures and I had to have them. Tuck 3D does have a valid point, but I don't have the time and coming up with my own is a pain sometimes. Hey Tuck 3d! Why don't you share some of those recipes with us, we could all use it, and you would be doing us all a service by sharing your knowledge, helping to make the Carrara users better at a skill that a lot of us need help with. Kaom