phantom, are you fishing for compliments ?

COME ONE, your rig is vastly superior to anything else out there !

So M4s shoulders are better than M3's ?
Woo---Hoo ! Isn't that GREAT !?

Takes me about an hour to make M3's shoulders look VASTLY better than M4's and that includes morph duplicating and ERC-rigging.

Leg front bend is OK, but leg side bend is horrible.
Proportions are soso (What's up with the Gorilla arms?), but definition is very weak.
He looks very puffy, just like Apollo.
And if you crank up the emacicated and skinny morphs, his joints get REALLY bad.

The face is as bad as V4Male.
Very "Apollo-ish" soft.
Just dieal the jaw down and the nose smaller and he looks like friggin' V4 !

Sorry, I prefer the manly-male (M2) or gaunt (M3) look.

M2 was standalone male-only, and M3 was derived from the UNIMESH, but M4 looks like a reworked V4 male.

But anyway, it's the weak definition and the bad rig that make him a nonstarter for me.

I mean, if I have to rework the joints anyway to get them to an acceptable level, where's the point in using a new figure ?