Warder what is the max ray depth in vue? B5 - max ray per pixel = 256 adjustable B4 - max ray per pixel = 16 depends on AA B5 - max internal reflections = 10 adjustable B5 - max ray depth = 10 adjustable These things have a direct real* and tangable effect on accuracy and final output. I would be more then interested in Vue's abilities in this area. http://www.bryce5.net/images/Gallery/674510813buddahglass.jpg This is what it effects glass and reflections sharpness and realisitic objects. If you can point us in the direction of a higher quality more realistic object rendered in Vue then I will agree with you on the accuracy part. my view on renders of the two applications (comming from a bryce and Lightwave owner) 1. default renders vue wins hands down 2. landscapes with little work vue wins hands down 3. landscapes with a lot of work tie 4. abstracts Vue isnt even in the race 5. surreal images ummmm.... wheres vue? again not even in the race 6. accuracy Bryce wins hands down 7. cheesy lense flares (boy are we in for a treat) Vue wins again I threw that last one in to just be funny :) Anyway that is my view I am sure others may see it differently. As for stability perhaps you have not had a chance to check out the Vue forum (its a mad house in there) but Bryce has not crashed on me in over a year.