Pinto I have and have used Bryce 2,3,and 4 and more recently-Lightwave 6.5 and 6.5b. For abstracts? For me Bryce wins HANDS down over Lightwave-which is the "better" program. With bryce you just "get in" and start playing. Lightwave requires constant thought and planning and does not encourage playing as much. THe modeler and "layout" are separate in LW. You dont directly interact on your scene the way you do in Bryce. And yet- Bryce is limited in many, many, ways compared to Lightwave... With sufficient effort a Brycean landscape can be made in LW, with fantastic skies and water. AND either from scratch or importation of a poser figure-LW can animate a character to walk, swim, crawl or fly around the bryce style terrain. I have learned to create such terrains in Lightwave, create realistic water-(more "real" than in Bryce)-but it is NOT as direct in an artists sense of immediate feedback. I would LOVE to see Bryce funtion within LW as a plugin... Eric Walters