Thanx for all your infor ,yes i did download the demo ringbearer and had a fiddle with it. It does seem an easy interface to use and it should give me an extra dimension to my photoshop and bryce images and i will more than likely buy it soon. But having said that i have heard of poser5 now, it may be better for me to wait for that but i've know idea when its to be released, can anyone answer this. thanx again.