BTW, LaurieA, I think your Antonia morphs are so pretty! Great work.

Quote -

Well, I don't have Use Binary Morph Targets turned on, and even if I did (as I said in an earlier post), I don't know how to make them injectable anyway ;o). I have them saved in a document AND have exported the morph targets for each one, just in case.

Laurie

If you check out my pose files for Antonia you will easyly detect the way how to inject PMDs and how to group them. It's really easy.

Ulli

Attached Link: PMD/JCM problem

I have posted a thread about a PMD/JCM problem in the Poser Technical forum. See link above.

I don't want this thread to get junked up with posts about that problem, so please post any responses about it to the  thread linked above. Not this thread!

Quote -

If you check out my pose files for Antonia you will easyly detect the way how to inject PMDs and how to group them. It's really easy.

Ulli

Or look at JOELGLAINE's expression morphs (MorphsJGL-INJ.pz2 and MorphsJGL-REM.pz2). Even easier because they are pure head morphs like yours and don't need the extra "create full body morph" lines.

I guess the grouping is a bit of a problem, because every new pz2 loaded with grouping destroys the existing grouping. So if I load two morphs sets, each with its own grouping, I only see the groups from the second one and everything else is flat. Any ideas how to solve that without a cascade of 'readScript' a la DAZ?

Maybe at least we could start prefixing our morphs with the initials of their creators or something like that?

Quote -
Is there still going to be a dedicated Antonia release distribution site for the final figure and contributed textures, morphs, poses, clothing etc.? It would be so nice if Antonia was the occasion for the renewel of the old DYI and sharing that we had back in 1998 with Posette and Eve when this whole Poser thing first got going on-line.

That is my intention, yes. I haven't done much in that direction yet, though.

Does anyone know a good hosting provider for that kind of thing? I will probably use free Google hosting as a start like for the developers site, but that's not exactly a permanent solution.

A seperate group Node with "sub" group Nodes may help.

Thanks! :o). I try. Don't always succeed, but I try...lol.

My internet went down last night so I was doodlin'.... Apologize for the hair...never good at hair post ;o).

Laurie

That image has a nice painterly quality, Laurie. Nothing wrong with that. The only problem I see is that Antonia seems to have inherited my hairline. :D

Quote - That image has a nice painterly quality, Laurie. Nothing wrong with that. The only problem I see is that Antonia seems to have inherited my hairline. :D

It's the hair figure that has that hairline....looked like that on Posette too...lololol.

My stuff always does wind up with a painterly quality to it. I supposed my brain likes it because I don't think it looks right until I get it (note my avatar) ;o).

Laurie

I like that painterly quality actually.  Is that in render or post work?? 

Quote - > Quote - BTW, LaurieA, I think your Antonia morphs are so pretty! Great work.

Thanks! :o). I try. Don't always succeed, but I try...lol.

My internet went down last night so I was doodlin'.... Apologize for the hair...never good at hair post ;o).

Laurie

/decloak

it must be the hair combination, but oddly enough she resembles 70's era "Daisy Duke" AKA Catherine Bach in that render.  

/cloak

Man, that's one great looking figure,  a very nice change of pace from the usual DAZ offerings or the incredibly trite and uninspired figures that come with Poser.
How many times has DAZ called you so far? ;-)

The portrait looks really good Laurie, nice work!

Hey odf how about a banner we can fly around town and other places (the unmentionable sites) ? Can I have one of your excellent pics to promo her with ? (I'm horrible at rendering myself)

Quote - I guess the grouping is a bit of a problem, because every new pz2 loaded with grouping destroys the existing grouping. So if I load two morphs sets, each with its own grouping, I only see the groups from the second one and everything else is flat. Any ideas how to solve that without a cascade of 'readScript' a la DAZ?

The short answer is NO! The DAZ method requires a minimum of two levels of pz2, the one which the readScript calls that contains a list of individual pz2s, and the individual pz2s that contain the grops. It's hard to see how you could improve on two levels. perhaps there is a way but I don't know it.

Quote - I like that painterly quality actually.  Is that in render or post work?? 

It's postwork. I can't "doodle" without doing postwork ;o). I usually only render anymore when I get bored (I'm usually do busy doing/making things FOR Poser to use Poser...lol)

Laurie

For years my computer was too lame to do renders so I just post-worked the preview window after anti-aliasing :) Actually got more work done that way then I do now. Anyway, that render/post by Laurie is really nice.

In the above animation the handles are not being turned on and of by pose files. They are being turned on and off by one dial in the Body. This is geometry swapping, there is an 'alternateGeom' code block plus a hidden 'geomChan' in every handle, these are slaved to a master channel in the Body. The alternate geometry itself is just an empty text file in Runtime:Geometries:Antonia named "blank.obj".

I find it much quicker to use a dial in the Body than to go looking for a pose file.

@ odf,

If you would like details I can IM them to you.

nice idea lespentley

I've done something similar with Nea 2 genitals

That is very nice, les.

 I think odf would be interested.  Him being on the other side of the planet, he'd be asleep right now, I'd think.  Much better than a pose file, IMO.

 Hi,
with Poser 7 and up you can also show / hide body parts via Body dial without alternate geometry. 
I'm currently travelling without access to my main computer, but I can post the cr2 lines in a few days.

Best regards,
  Michael

P.S.: The original post where I learned how to do that was buried with the CP forums :-(

Quote -

Wouldn't this be something.....But it's only Antonia's head on M4 Body...lol...

Looks great but it is still a pretty boy...albeit with a moustache...on a hunky bod!

Quote - More morphs....you know, I never thought to ask how many she was capable of containing, because I've already got quite the few ;o).

Here's one that uses Eyes Apart_Closer, Eyes Up_Down, Eyes Tilt Up_Down, Eye Outer Corner In, Eyes Big, etc. I'm planning some up and downs for the mouth and nose as well as a few other things :o).

Laurie

Cool! What about Eyes Asian & Eyes Alien?

Quote - BTW, LaurieA, I think your Antonia morphs are so pretty! Great work.

I agree. Quite beautiful. If possible can you also make a younger face/head morph for ODF's "extremely Smaller Antonia" for want of calling her anything else.  ;)

Quote - Is this a beter way to hide/show Body Handles?

In the above animation the handles are not being turned on and of by pose files. They are being turned on and off by one dial in the Body. This is geometry swapping, there is an 'alternateGeom' code block plus a hidden 'geomChan' in every handle, these are slaved to a master channel in the Body. The alternate geometry itself is just an empty text file in Runtime:Geometries:Antonia named "blank.obj".

I find it much quicker to use a dial in the Body than to go looking for a pose file.

@ odf,

If you would like details I can IM them to you.

Sounds cool! Pose Files and Injection Morphs are my bane! I would just as soon pose my own figures...best way to get exactly what I am looking for without getting other content creators forgotten characters hidden in the poses and Injection Morphs take up too much Runtime Realestate in my opinion to excite me into using them.

Quote - > Quote - More morphs....you know, I never thought to ask how many she was capable of containing, because I've already got quite the few ;o).

Here's one that uses Eyes Apart_Closer, Eyes Up_Down, Eyes Tilt Up_Down, Eye Outer Corner In, Eyes Big, etc. I'm planning some up and downs for the mouth and nose as well as a few other things :o).

Laurie

Cool! What about Eyes Asian & Eyes Alien?

Well, I'm gonna TRY to do epicanthic eye folds (wish me lots o luck with that'n), but in all honesty I never gave alien eyes a thought...

Laurie

Quote - > Quote - BTW, LaurieA, I think your Antonia morphs are so pretty! Great work.

I agree. Quite beautiful. If possible can you also make a younger face/head morph for ODF's "extremely Smaller Antonia" for want of calling her anything else.  ;)

Some of the morphs I've done so far do make her look quite young, though not as young as a small child; more like a teen ;o).

Laurie

Quote - How many times has DAZ called you so far? ;-)

I see your winkie-smilie, but I'll give you a serious answer, anyway: I've been contacted by one site/company, which was neither DAZ nor Renderosity, and I was really honored that they were thinking about featuring Antonia. But since this is strictly a spare time project and it's life force is in this thread, I decided I'd better stay here where I am.

That is a lovely image, Laurie. Pretty, in a gal next door sorta way. Curious to see the original render, though. :)

Quote - Hey odf how about a banner we can fly around town and other places (the unmentionable sites) ? Can I have one of your excellent pics to promo her with ? (I'm horrible at rendering myself)

I don't think we should have a banner before there's a web site, and one with a decent bandwidth allowance. I'm up to 67% of my file locker bandwidth for this month as it is. :-D

I'll try to think of something, um, suitable for the unmentionable sites... ;-)

Quote - > Quote - I guess the grouping is a bit of a problem, because every new pz2 loaded with grouping destroys the existing grouping. So if I load two morphs sets, each with its own grouping, I only see the groups from the second one and everything else is flat. Any ideas how to solve that without a cascade of 'readScript' a la DAZ?

The short answer is NO! The DAZ method requires a minimum of two levels of pz2, the one which the readScript calls that contains a list of individual pz2s, and the individual pz2s that contain the grops. It's hard to see how you could improve on two levels. perhaps there is a way but I don't know it.

I wouldn't mind using a similar system, but people seem to be having a lot of trouble with the way DAZ does it. If we could come up with something that's equally flexible, relatively robust and easy to user for both creators and users, that would be awesome.

Quote - Is this a beter way to hide/show Body Handles?

In the above animation the handles are not being turned on and of by pose files. They are being turned on and off by one dial in the Body. This is geometry swapping, there is an 'alternateGeom' code block plus a hidden 'geomChan' in every handle, these are slaved to a master channel in the Body. The alternate geometry itself is just an empty text file in Runtime:Geometries:Antonia named "blank.obj".

I find it much quicker to use a dial in the Body than to go looking for a pose file.

@ odf,

If you would like details I can IM them to you.

Excellent idea! That's how I thought it should work, but I never got around to implementing it. In fact, would I'd like even better is keeping the handle geometry out of the main obj file and putting them into the alternate one.

Yes, details would be much appreciated.

Here ya be...

Laurie

Thanks, Laurie - 'tis verry loverly. :)

I'm curious about something with Antonia.
In all figures I've ever seen, rotating the body has been a no-no, as the body always rotates around the origin. That's fine if your figure is at 0,0,0, but really bad if it's away from the origin. I see by loading the obj into Lightwave Modeler that the body origin is in fact what I would expect, just like all Poser figures, origin at 0 on the X and Z, and standing on the ground.
Yet in Antonia's case, the body rotates around its own center, no matter where it is in the scene. How is this possible?

I just noticed that the body handles are UV mapped. I wouldn't have expected that. ;-)

Quote - I just noticed that the body handles are UV mapped. I wouldn't have expected that. ;-)

Yes, it doesn't seem very useful. But some programs get cranky if they find unmapped geometry.

Well, I've nearly got these morphs loaded into Antonia and about to upload to the developers site. I can't think of any other way to transport them than to load them into a .cr2 and upload that because there's just so many of them. I'll also upload the squished and unsquished morph objects. You may do with them what you will ;o).

Laurie

Quote -
Yet in Antonia's case, the body rotates around its own center, no matter where it is in the scene. How is this possible?

Beats me. I don't remember doing anything unusual there. Maybe Phantom3D has when he originally set it up? I'll have a look at the cr2 and see if there's anything unusual in the setup when I get home tonight (if I remember).

Quote - Well, I've nearly got these morphs loaded into Antonia and about to upload to the developers site. I can't think of any other way to transport them than to load them into a .cr2 and upload that because there's just so many of them. I'll also upload the squished and unsquished morph objects. You may do with them what you will ;o).

Laurie

Cool! I'll take it from there.

Quote - I'm curious about something with Antonia.
In all figures I've ever seen, rotating the body has been a no-no, as the body always rotates around the origin. That's fine if your figure is at 0,0,0, but really bad if it's away from the origin. I see by loading the obj into Lightwave Modeler that the body origin is in fact what I would expect, just like all Poser figures, origin at 0 on the X and Z, and standing on the ground.
Yet in Antonia's case, the body rotates around its own center, no matter where it is in the scene. How is this possible?

Mike,

I've never used a figure outside Poser, but in Poser, what you describe is not what I see. I always used Y Rotate on a figure's body to spin the figure, regardless of where it is. Even after applying XTran, YTran, etc. all figures spin around their own center. Does it not do that for you in Poser?

The only time I've seen a prop or figure not spin around its own center is when somebody made it with a "Center Point" that does not correspond with the origin when the figure or prop is actually centered over the origin.

For example, you can load a figure, such as Alyson (but don't look at her or you'll go blind). Then bring up the Joint Editor. Spin her Y Rotate body dial, and observe the rotation. Now enter a new value for the Center X coordinate. Spin her again. She will revolve around some new point.

I just noticed that in Poser 8 at least, you get a green 3D crosshair showing where the figure's Center Point is while the Joint Editor is visible. You can actually grab it and move the Center Point in the pose window.

Quote -
Mike,

I've never used a figure outside Poser, but in Poser, what you describe is not what I see. I always used Y Rotate on a figure's body to spin the figure, regardless of where it is. Even after applying XTran, YTran, etc. all figures spin around their own center. Does it not do that for you in Poser?

Well it's a matter of how you go about it. If you translate the hip, then rotate the body, it will swing in an arc around the center point of where the hip should be. I never translate a body position and always use the hip, so I guess I should have specified that.

Quote -
Well it's a matter of how you go about it. If you translate the hip, then rotate the body, it will swing in an arc around the center point of where the hip should be. I never translate a body position and always use the hip, so I guess I should have specified that.

Yes, how you go about it matters a lot. :laugh: Logically, one would translate the body and rotate the hip, not the other way round. In Antonia, you also have a hip handle, which is very neat. You can make her lie down or crawl using an x rotation of the hip and then use the y rotation of the hip handle to rotate with respect to the scene.

Now, I don't quite see why translating the hip and rotating the body would produce different results in Antonia than in other figures. What you're seeing is what I think should happen. Unfortunately, I can't test it at the moment, being at work and all.

Sorry, I thought you were talking about when you select "body". Yes if you translate the hip, then rotate the body, it orbits the body center, which is still where it was before.

If you translate the hip, and rotate the hip, it doesn't orbit. It spins around the new hip center.

Translating the hip does not move the body center, only the hip center moves. The same is true of any body part. Translate a part, and the center of that part moves as well and is the new rotation center for that part. But translating any part of the figure leaves the body center unmodified.

I wanted to load Antonia into Poser 8 to see if Antonia behaves differently, but it hangs Poser 8. Hmmmmm. Tried it twice.

Are you saying with Antonia, translate hip, then rotate body, it doesn't orbit the original body center? Then it must be that somehow the body center moves with the hip center. I don't know how you tie these two together, but that's the only way it would behave differently.

Quote - I wanted to load Antonia into Poser 8 to see if Antonia behaves differently, but it hangs Poser 8. Hmmmmm. Tried it twice.

That's very weird. I've tested the latest version in my file locker with Poser 8 and didn't have any problems at all. Do you have the same version of Poser 8 that we unwashed masses have? Did you get any messages boxes or any other hints of what might have gone wrong?

Well the only reason I noticed it is because Antonia's hip has no x,y, or z translate dials.

As for how figures should be manipulated in Poser, well, it works for me the way I do it. Then again I primarily use Poser to pose figures for export, so whether I use the body or hip or anything else has never been either a pro or a con for me, as long as I can get it where I need it to be.

All this time I've been under the impression that moving the hip is the "correct" way. Maybe not... who knows, I can't even remember where I ever got that impression, but it began years ago. ;-)

odf: I have a pre-release SR1 of Poser 8, and I have an old copy of Antonia-96. So I'm both newer and older. It's probably nothing.

Mike: I was taught to move the body, the reason being that poses adjust the hip but leave the body translation alone. If you move the figure using the hip, then apply a pose, the hip will zoom back to wherever it was in the pose. If you move the body to where you want it in the scene, not the hip, then when applying a pose, any alteration of the hip will not affect where the figure is.

Probably a basic fundamental difference in how one views using Poser. I've never made my own poses or used anyone else's, aside from mat poses. Everything I do in Poser I do from scratch, at least as far as posing a figure is concerned, so any problems related to poses and hip/body translation have never affected me.

But this thread is about Antonia, not how I use Poser and whether I do it correctly or not. ;-)

Hey I learned something though, which is good. I was genuinely surprised when I saw what I saw and mentioned above, thought it was something unusual, but apparently it's not.