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Subject: 3D Commune shut its doors for good...


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ThunderStone ( ) posted Wed, 04 November 2009 at 5:58 PM · edited Sun, 01 December 2024 at 2:34 PM

Just wanted to give  the heads up... Mark has shut down 3D Commune. You can read the information here.


===========================================================

OS: Windows 11 64-bit
Poser: Poser 11.3 ...... Units: inches or meters depends on mood
Bryce: Bryce Pro 7.1.074
Image Editing: Corel Paintshop Pro
Renderer: Superfly, Firefly

9/11/2001: Never forget...

Smiles are contagious... Pass it on!

Today is the tomorrow you worried about yesterday

 


StaceyG ( ) posted Wed, 04 November 2009 at 6:04 PM

I just saw that about 30 minutes ago. I hate that this happened and wish Mark all the best


AnnieD ( ) posted Wed, 04 November 2009 at 6:20 PM

I hate to see it too...
I remember when Daz shut down PoserPros...  sad  :(

 

“For those who believe, no proof is necessary. For those who don't believe, no proof is possible.”

[Stuart Chase]


Jumpstartme2 ( ) posted Wed, 04 November 2009 at 6:36 PM

:ohmy: :sad:

~Jani

Renderosity Community Admin
---------------------------------------




SAMS3D ( ) posted Wed, 04 November 2009 at 6:42 PM

I am so sadden by this loss.  Mark has been around as long or even longer then we entered the scene.  3DCommune has been a part of Poser for so long it is a loss.  You will be truly missed, and always a part of our lives.  Thank you for your efforts.  Mike and Sharen


gillbrooks ( ) posted Wed, 04 November 2009 at 7:03 PM

I am saddened.  I worked with Mark for a couple of years.  Nice chap - didn't deserve this
:crying:

Gill

       


ForbiddenWhispers ( ) posted Thu, 05 November 2009 at 3:59 AM

It is sad, and i'm disappointed coz i did get a trickle of sales thru there. However i am angry in the way this was handled. You'd have thought vendors monies would have been put to one side and they'd have been paid. But this wasn't so.

I do sympathise with him, but i'm really peeved about how he's handled all this,


FutureFantasyDesign ( ) posted Thu, 05 November 2009 at 11:43 AM

I have a balance owed me too... seems the site never really could get itself together totally. Is there word on repaying vendors that had sales due?

Ariana

Is there water in your future or is it being shipped away to be resold to you?
Water, the ultimate weapon...

www.futurefantasydesign.com


Schurby ( ) posted Fri, 06 November 2009 at 7:00 AM

 I've made 13 sales since Oct 22 thru Nov 2, but the way it sounds, I'm not expecting payment anytime soon if ever.

 Mark said this:

Vendors Payments Due

The only thing I can do right now today is offer to sell Alexa and our other characters, parts and pieces I own.

I will pay the vendors off somehow, someway. As I said I will do my best to pay all of you what you are owed.

As I said I would gladly sell 3DC to someone that could take over the costs and pay the vendors what's owed but I doubt anyone would want it.

I have so little left to offer, it's a mere pittance and a pitiful attempt at any type of offer or payment for what you've all done and given to the site.

This site was my dream and I had SO many plans for it and it was just getting some speed back up... Unfortunately that light at the end of the tunnel and that elusive corner never seemed to appear.

It is more than a shame, it is a damn crime this is happening and there is Nothing I can do to prevent it other than winning the lotto which I can't afford to play or finding $20,000 laying on the ground.

As one very wise person said to me, "this will be a new chapter in your life and it was meant to happen". Hard to accept but I know it to be true.

I'm sure I'll go down in history now as a lying, thief who stole from everyone and gave up. .... .sigh, I certainly hope that is not the case and that people do remember me as a stand up guy who did all he could to help people achieve a little higher level or a bit of fun and happiness in their lives.

I wish you all the best in everything you do and pray that you find you way in this crazy mixed up world we're living in right now.

I don't want anyone to feel sorry for me - or whatever,... I did the best I could, I made some bad business decisions and tried to fight the machine and lost.

Goodbye and Good Luck to all,

Mark

Schurby

 


markschum ( ) posted Fri, 06 November 2009 at 10:17 AM

Any vendors left with payments due should check with their tax preparer on claiming the bad debt. I believe its a valid deduction but you want to check. Not as good as being paid but at least its something.


fitzy ( ) posted Fri, 06 November 2009 at 8:37 PM

I am personally very sad to see any 3D related site close, but in particular the closure of 3D Commune has come as a great shock.

I am the owner of planit3d.com and I know personally how much effort, time and expense it takes to run a community site, and I can imagine how upset Mark must be feeling at the moment, at having to close something that has taken so much of his time and energy over the years.

It was a market place based site, but there was also a strong community spirit and for all the admins and mods who were involved with the site I send my sympathies at losing your "home" so suddenly.

Although I agree a notice period should have been communicated it must have been a very difficult decision for Mark to close the site and I would ask folks to take this into consideration.

During the difficult times we are all experiencing I would kindly urge you all to support the various online communities you are associated with. I know in the case of planit3d.com, where there is no store or market place it is important that folks pop in and say hi and get involved as this builds the community aspect which is so important.

I do hope 2010 is a better year for everyone, but for now I think we should all thank Mark, and all those involved at 3D Commune for all their hard work and efforts in supporting this community so well over the last 9 years. I personally wish you all the best in the future.

Regards

Fitzy

www.planit3d.com


taoz ( ) posted Fri, 13 November 2009 at 7:52 AM

Quote -

It was a market place based site, but there was also a strong community spirit and for all the admins and mods who were involved with the site I send my sympathies at losing your "home" so suddenly.

How my members were there? Let's say 2000 - if everyone donated say $10, he'd be up running again. That's what community spirit is about...


Grincho ( ) posted Fri, 13 November 2009 at 9:22 PM

Do any of you remember Kammemer, and EdARSEnal, who both founded the 3DCommune?
I can't remember their exact names but they were the ones who started the 3DCommune. They kept the site running for a few years, and then they sold it. There last parting comment was something like, "It's a crap, anyway"
There were no stores for many years at the 3DCommune, or even at Renderosity if I remember right.. All the models made by members were free.
I remember the store idea started creeping into the websites about 9 years ago, or so. I never liked the store idea. The "free models era" created a different atmosphere than the current "market frenzy, commodity mad" era.
Anyway, Mark pushed the store idea. There was a member named Schabbler, I believe, who used to post FREE model sets evey week, or so, at the Commune.
Now Schabbler sells most of his sets.
I, for one , feel it is ridiculous to sell pose sets, and especially for 9 dollars a set. Come on, man. Talk about greed and ripp-off.
Well, I better leave these store critiques and return to general comments about the 3DCommune, before I am flayed alive by some of you. The store idea is rarely, rarely, criticized now and has become a sacred cow, sadly.

The 3DCommune had some very interesting members who constantly wrestled with each other in the Forums, over opinons on this and that, resulting often in giant flamewars which were fun to read. It kept the place interesting.
But, all of those vocal members left for one reason or another and the last 3 or 4 years of the 3DComme became the era of the lobotomized Forums.

Anyone remember hotheads like Ironbear, and the gun crazy atheist Brit, Questor who killed rats in his yard.
How about RCrook, oops, I mean RCook? Wasn't there some troublemaker named Grouchy who was always politcally incorrect in the Forums and got flamed and kicked out for it.
What happened to him? (hee Hee)
 

 


Miss Nancy ( ) posted Sat, 14 November 2009 at 12:07 AM

yes, jack kammerer (previous owner of this site as well) - those were the days!
there were hundreds of troublemakers, but they finally gentrified them all :lol:
nothing but happiness and good cheer nowadays.



Grincho ( ) posted Sat, 14 November 2009 at 2:48 AM

Miss Nancy wrote,

*"there were hundreds of troublemakers, but they finally gentrified them all
nothing but happiness and good cheer nowadays"

*Actually, I think they all  just left in disgust and what remained behind, for the most part. were the conformists, the kind of persons who follow the leader unthinkingly, who follow the trends no matter how dumb the trends may be.
The general I,Q of  these CG websites has sunk to the "village idiot" level over the last 5, or so, years.
This is what happens when "commercialization" becomes predominant; everything sinks to the lowest common denominator. It is the dark side of the "free market", the leveling down of everything.
The best of times were the times before the stores caught on, when all the models were free, and the level of debate, and argument, in the Forums was high. It was a time of real sharing, and not a time like now, of huckstering buyers and sellers, pretending to be a caring community. It is not a community any longer, but rather a drive-in flea market where hype rules the day.
Whatever quality still remains on these websites will continue to fade away. There is still enough, barely enough, quality remaining at the present time to keep me here for the time being.

 


Hawkfyr ( ) posted Sat, 14 November 2009 at 6:35 AM

So…those whom devoted their time and efforts (even for free) are somehow “Unthinking Followers”?

 

Bottom line is…unless YOU want to absorb the overhead costs of bandwidth, servers, site maintenance and a host of other costs…the stores were and are the solution to keeping the sites alive AT ALL..

 

The past several years that folks have enjoyed these resources (including the FREE items) is a direct result of the online markets.

 

They not only keep these sites in existence…but provide a platform for artists to sell their wares and feed their children.

 

Much of the success of these artist/vendors are due to the existence of the sites…the existence of the sites are due to the existence of the stores.

 

As one of the “Unthinking Followers”…I happen to know that Mark personally absorbed costs in an effort to keep the 3DC alive. But one man (or even a team) can not do it alone for long…the expenses must come from somewhere. (The Stores).

 

So…the next time any of you log in…Thank the marketplace…otherwise…it wouldn’t be here at all.

 

Wassup Grincho…Long time no see amigo.

 

Tom

“The fact that no one understands you…Doesn’t make you an artist.”


AnnieD ( ) posted Sat, 14 November 2009 at 10:42 AM

Quote - *
*Actually, I think they all  just left in disgust and what remained behind, for the most part. were the conformists, the kind of persons who follow the leader unthinkingly, who follow the trends no matter how dumb the trends may be.

They are all in the Daz forum....

I've been online since '95 and I just got sick of the "debates" and flame wars etc...people here seem to be easier to get along with and we do have "debates' from time to time but the mods here are on top of everything and I, for one, appreciate it.

 

“For those who believe, no proof is necessary. For those who don't believe, no proof is possible.”

[Stuart Chase]


StaceyG ( ) posted Sat, 14 November 2009 at 12:55 PM

Are my eyes deceiving me??? Is that Hawkfyr I see up there posting?  Good to see ya man:)


CaptainJack1 ( ) posted Sat, 14 November 2009 at 1:05 PM

**Hawkfyr: **> Quote - So…

Dude-- there you are! I was sure you were around here someplace. I want you to know, I never did buy the alien abduction theories, m'self.

:biggrin:


Pommerlis ( ) posted Sat, 14 November 2009 at 2:02 PM

 I'm not so worried about the little bit that is due to me.
It will get there when it will get there and if it doesn't, it won't kill me.
I've seen to much in real-life to let these kind of things become to big or important, and that included debates. And I had a few in my teenage-years when I was storming the barricades with political correctness trying to improve the world. :biggrin:
Gosh,...I'm getting old......:biggrin:,......or is that,....more realistic.....:biggrin:

I don't know Mark personally but I do hope he'll be able to get himself back on his feet again and I wish him all the best of luck.


Grincho ( ) posted Sat, 14 November 2009 at 8:37 PM · edited Sat, 14 November 2009 at 8:41 PM

Hey Hawkfyr, surprised to hear from you, but glad anyway.
You didn't read my post carefully enough. I wrote, "for the most part"....I didn't say that everyone is, or was, an "unthinking follower".
I wouldn't be posting, or hanging out here, if I felt everyone here was an "unthinking follower", or a "village idiot", or a "free market fanatic"

I disagree with you on the essentialness of stores. There are websites that use a monthly subscription method wherein the models are free, or relatively free if you consider the subscription price as the price for the models. textures, etc.
Those websites haven't caught on as much as websites such as Renderosity, but that is not an argument against them, or proof that they don't work well.

We have been living, since Reagan, in a society that has been conditioned, and brainwashed, to seig heil a kind of Milton Friedman "free market evangelism" that looks on existence itself as a marketplace and everything within existence as commodities, and items for sale, and purchase.
It is just a philosophy, a bad philosophy, that has been hammered into the heads of Amercians, and the rest of the world, for decades now by the priesthood of Milton Friedman's Chicago Boys free market evangelists
The store frenzy here at Renderosity, and the 3DCommen, etc, is a direct result of a bunch of people accepting that philosophy as a way of living in the world. Buy, sell, buy, sell, buy, sell, on into infinity.

These websites, in my opinion, have been ruined by market place greed; almost everyone hopes to make a big profit.
But, in actuality the total number of customers on these websites offers a small market that is quickly saturated with products.
I have talked to some big timers on these websites, whose names I will not expose, whose total yearly sales are chickenfeed; not even monthly welfare money.
No one can live on what they make on sales here.

Another silly thing about the stores and the small number of buyers is that the whole sales thing becomes incestuous. I buy your 15 dollar model, and you return that 15 dollars to me by buying my model. No profit on both sides. Why not just give the models away free.
Yeah, some of that 15 dollars the website keeps, but why not use the subcription method instead.

If the models were given away free you would not have the outlandish number of models being sold, many of which are stinko, and which Renderosity has to offer discounted during it's sales gimmicks because no one is buying those models.
The store philosophy promotes a flood of stinko models, textures, etc., because the item makers are hoping to make money, and come on, let's be honest, lots of money.
If the models, etc, were free, you would not have the "big money profit" motivation lurking in the minds of the item creators, and so less models would be made.

Bottom line is that the way the website is run merely depends of what your philosophy of life is, "is everything reduced to a commodity, is life nothing but buying and selling, becoming a businees, selling yourself......"
or, .....

 

 


Grincho ( ) posted Sun, 15 November 2009 at 1:01 AM · edited Sun, 15 November 2009 at 1:06 AM

I forgot to mention donations.
As well as using a subscription method to keep a website running, in place of a store, a website can be helped too by donations from it's members, or even non-members.
There is a website with tons of useful freebies by some British artist, and he asks for donations.
What if Mark sent an email to all the 3DCommune members and asked them to consider a subscription system, instead of the store system, and to consider offering donations.
Or is it too late.
I mean if the 3DCommune was really a sharing community, and not just a bunch of sellers and buyers each hording his/her little stake of land so to speak and pretending to be a warm caring community, then surely the members could each cough up 25 dollars to help Mark pay off the debt.
How about if the 3DCommune vendors who are owed money practice some chariity and just write off the amount owed to them to help Mark.

But considering that the free market system is dog eat dog, and that quoting Thatcher, " there is no such thing as society", charity hasn't a chance.

Any predictions when Renderosity will bite the dust?

 


scanmead ( ) posted Sun, 15 November 2009 at 7:14 AM

3DC had it's good points and bad points. It was a great place for absolute beginners to test the waters, because rudeness was not tolerated at all. It was a bad place if you felt like venting for the same reason. The code they used for the site made makeovers an absolute nightmare, and it just would not display properly for some browsers, no matter what you did. The last time I was there, the appearance was shockingly distracting.  

It does feel odd to know the Commune isn't out there anymore. But it was sort of built in to the site philosophy that, if you wanted to be pushed to improve, you had to move on to a more liberal home, where constructive criticism isn't seen as anathema. 

Stores are not an issue for me. They are there if I get stuck on something I can't do myself, but no one forces me to buy things. If they keep a site going, they're good. It sure beats having dozens of flashing ads for "tooth-whitening secrets", and dating sites littering every page. 


AnnieD ( ) posted Sun, 15 November 2009 at 9:13 AM

Quote -   

Any predictions when Renderosity will bite the dust?

Another site that really changed with its new make-over is RDNA.  I don't go there anymore and I'm sure I'm not the only one.  I came here from AZ because its make-over just isn't "friendly" either....and I know several who did the same.

I think as long as Renderosity doesn't change "drastically"....it will be ok.  Its still quite user friendly and easy to find your way around basically.  One nice thing about 'rosity is that they do surveys and ask people before they do major changes...not that they do what everyone says...but at least they know what most want and it serves as a guideline.

 

“For those who believe, no proof is necessary. For those who don't believe, no proof is possible.”

[Stuart Chase]


kawecki ( ) posted Sun, 15 November 2009 at 11:06 AM

Money is useful,to sell is nice, but lack of debates and discussions is boring!!
Unless you like to live in a land ruled by greedy bankers served by crowds of zombies......

Stupidity also evolves!


Miss Nancy ( ) posted Sun, 15 November 2009 at 11:48 PM

that's a good idea about him changing 3dcommune to a subscription site, as I think that worked for the porno site.  somebody should ask him if he likes that.  but they've been predicting the demise of this site every 3 - 6 months for the last 11 years.  they leave in disgust, then come back.  usually the precipitating event is a warning from one of the mods about TOS violations, but now there's an element of economic turmoil.  can't say what will happen in future, but currently in silicon heaven it's acquisition time, everywhere I look.



Grincho ( ) posted Mon, 16 November 2009 at 1:24 AM · edited Mon, 16 November 2009 at 1:29 AM

As long as this website can pay for the bandwidth costs it will stay in existence, and by dumbing down the site to pander and cater to the large market of horny half-witted  teenagers, the site is in no trouble of dying at all.  Another whore model, another suit of whore clothes, another bunch of squirmy, soft-porn poses, and all is well and all manner of things shall be well at Renderosity.

But, my sources say a depression is on the horizon, although the media says we are out of the recession. Yeah sure, I've got some beachfront property out here in the Mojave Desert for sale.

Americans are maxed out with their credit cards, they won't buy much because of that, the banks won't give loans to most small busineses, the banks and big business have fleeced Americans with unmerited bailouts, a barrel of oil will rise in price again to over 100 dollars, China's economy may collapse, one real major terrorist event is bound to happen... on and on and on.
When the crash comes Renderosity won't be the only place that bites the dust.

The human race either evolves upward to a higher level, pronto, or the human race will annihilate itself pronto, probably with a nuclear war. I do not look forward to 2012 as any kind of happy face entrance to biblical paradise; rather it will be an entrance into Dante's Inferno.

Only a decade ago there was talk of nanotechnology creating a utopia on Earth, but now 75 percent of nanotechnology is being developed by the military and much of the research is classified. I have read one report on what the military is developing with nanotech. It is horrifying. So much for Utopia, and enter World War Three.

I just can't help making speeches.

Come on, ... send me donations so that I can continue making speeches, or, hey, subscribe to Tim's ranting, frothing at the mouth, speech blogs.

 


AnnieD ( ) posted Mon, 16 November 2009 at 11:01 AM

I love your optimism! 

 

“For those who believe, no proof is necessary. For those who don't believe, no proof is possible.”

[Stuart Chase]


Grincho ( ) posted Mon, 16 November 2009 at 5:42 PM

Why hasn't Mark posted anything here about the 3DCommune, or has he? Where does he live. Can he flee to Switzerland?

 


fitzy ( ) posted Mon, 16 November 2009 at 7:36 PM

Attached Link: http://www.planit3d.com

I think stores are good thing and a great option. However at PlanIt 3D.com we have survived with no stores, no flashing banner ads for dating site etc and we think it is a good thing.

In the current climate not being commercially driven has enabled us to continue as normal and still host freebie items for anyone that wants free hosting, run galleries, forums and do our best to keep you updated on latest industry news and stories. So why do we do this?

We love the 3D / CG industry and it is a passion and almost an obsession by our members to keep the site relevent in todays difficult market. So the reason for this post is just to say there are ways of providing a site based on community even in these difficult times and not reliant on unrelated banner ads or stores. I do hope this community continues to support all those that work so hard providing items for sale or for free.

Finally on the free note, if you want hosting for free items, and maybe want to link back to here at Renderosity just email us at  planit3d.com and we will organise hosting on our servers for free.  


JenX ( ) posted Mon, 16 November 2009 at 7:38 PM

Quote - Why hasn't Mark posted anything here about the 3DCommune, or has he? Where does he live. Can he flee to Switzerland?

Mark doesn't need to post anything here, or elsewhere.  All the information necessary is posted on the letter he posted at 3DCommune.  All the other information you're asking for is a bit stalkerish, don't you think?

Sitemail | Freestuff | Craftythings | Youtube|

Knowledge is knowing a tomato is a fruit. Wisdom is not putting it into a fruit salad.


ariannah ( ) posted Tue, 17 November 2009 at 12:01 AM

Hawkfyr still lives?!  Wow.  How ya doin' man?  Long time no.....whatever.  'Course I've been pretty AWOL myself. Great to see you are still alive & about. ;)

I dare you, while there is still time, to have a magnificent obsession. --William Danforth


Grincho ( ) posted Tue, 17 November 2009 at 3:39 AM · edited Tue, 17 November 2009 at 3:41 AM

"stalkerish"...... pardon me but you sound rather kookishly paranoid, maybe too many looney feminist books.....

The vendors that Mark has stiffed deserve some kind of response from Mark on these Forums, and not just a crummy one time post about how sad he is. He was the captain of the ship, so to speak, and to just vanish into thin air is rather ratty.
Switzerland is too good for him, maybe Tijuana instead.

 


JenX ( ) posted Tue, 17 November 2009 at 5:29 AM

 If the vendors in question want a response from Mark, their best bet is to contact him directly.  Many have, through the help of Bea, one of the 3DC admins.  He stated that he will, eventually, pay the vendors off.  If that is not good enough, they need to get in contact with him and tell him such, not post here that they're pissed off, which is something he may never see.  

The 'stalkerish' comment was in regards to your "where does he live??" comment.  There is NO reason, at all, that you need to know that.  The way you stated it in your post came off as very stalkerish.

Sitemail | Freestuff | Craftythings | Youtube|

Knowledge is knowing a tomato is a fruit. Wisdom is not putting it into a fruit salad.


Grincho ( ) posted Tue, 17 November 2009 at 2:57 PM · edited Tue, 17 November 2009 at 3:00 PM

IT'S HAWKFYR!

 


Jumpstartme2 ( ) posted Tue, 17 November 2009 at 3:00 PM

Alrighty, before this gets out of hand, let's make sure we all remember to respect one another..I don't want to have to lock this down.

Thanks all!

Jani

~Jani

Renderosity Community Admin
---------------------------------------




Kassie ( ) posted Tue, 17 November 2009 at 3:08 PM

Since 3D Commune is down.. so sad. Mark worked really hard as well as everyone committed to that site,
I have started to upload my own products to my site..
nothing fancy, just a simple site with my products from 3D Commune.
Working on trying to get as much uploaded as I can weekly.

Thank you
~alice

http://vision-vault.com/DIGITAL_CONTENT.html


Grincho ( ) posted Tue, 17 November 2009 at 3:25 PM

Adminstrator... this is the last thing I will say on the "stalking" issue. I feel it is important to clear this up.

Jen... you are taking all this way too seriously, to the point of absurdity. I couldn't care less where Mark lives, or where you live, or where anyone else who post's here lives.
You don't take into account that these days it is very easy to find out where anyone lives, and you can even use Google Earthsearch to zoom in on the roof of someones house.
The technology of today is so advanced that privacy is basically a thing of the past. And stalking is a relative term. To one person it means one thing, to another it means something else.
I have known extrememly paranoid women who accuse men of stalking them just by the man looking at them. That is sick, and a sign of serious mental illness.

I live in the Mojave desert in southern California, by the way. You can even see my home from Google Earthsearch, so if I were you I would stop worrying, and accusing people of stalking, and additionaly any serious stalker would not announce to the world, or a Forum, his/her intentions.
I am not one of the vendors. I never sold anything at the 3DCommune by the way so I don't hold a grudge about not being paid.

As for Mark. I really think it is his responsibilty to post on these Forums.He makes things worse by being mysterious and vague, and appearing to hide. It is a bad strategy.
Come on Mark, have a beer here, crack some jokes, and sooth the vendors who may be a bit cranky.

Tim, of Pearblossom, California, USA.

 


Grincho ( ) posted Tue, 17 November 2009 at 3:41 PM

Alice,

For all my store bashing talk I still buy things from the stores when they are on sale. I am glad that you, and other, 3DCommune vendors are posting your stuff here.
FK Design has posted his Durscilla V4 character here, for the first time. I am glad to see that he has reduced the price from the rather steep 22 dolars at the 3DCommune.

For those of you who find me confusing, my argument style is to be both defense attorney, and prosecuter, on an issue. Although I have personal biases of course, I like to argue both sides of the case as best I can.
Overall I am not crazy about the store idea, but it does have it's merits depending on what you consider these kind of websites are all about. For hobbyists it is a great place to hang out, and make a little bit of extra doe, but for others the store empahasis can be a detriment, etc.

Tim

 


kawecki ( ) posted Tue, 17 November 2009 at 8:44 PM

Quote - You don't take into account that these days it is very easy to find out where anyone lives, and you can even use Google Earthsearch to zoom in on the roof of someones house.
The technology of today is so advanced that privacy is basically a thing of the past.

No it is not, only in the movies is "so advanced"

Stupidity also evolves!


wheatpenny ( ) posted Tue, 17 November 2009 at 9:48 PM
Site Admin

with google earth's street view you can even see what the front of their house looks like.




Jeff

Renderosity Senior Moderator

Hablo español

Ich spreche Deutsch

Je parle français

Mi parolas Esperanton. Ĉu vi?





Miss Nancy ( ) posted Tue, 17 November 2009 at 9:57 PM

file_443254.jpg

that's true, ricardo - wheatpenny and groucho are right. see: that's him pulling out the pearblossom post office in his white chevy. 



kawecki ( ) posted Tue, 17 November 2009 at 10:09 PM

No, the technology is no so great and advanced as you think. A simple question: Where is Bin Laden?

PS. With Google you can see my house, much better the roof of my house, as it was some years ago, if you know where is my house......

Stupidity also evolves!


wheatpenny ( ) posted Tue, 17 November 2009 at 10:22 PM
Site Admin

Yeah, the images on google earth are a few years out of date. There's a baseball stadium in my town that does not show on google earth, instead you can see the houses that were later torn down to make room for the stadium. Also the roof of my house  on google earth  appears light grey when 3 years ago I had it redone and it's now black.




Jeff

Renderosity Senior Moderator

Hablo español

Ich spreche Deutsch

Je parle français

Mi parolas Esperanton. Ĉu vi?





Grincho ( ) posted Tue, 17 November 2009 at 10:44 PM · edited Tue, 17 November 2009 at 10:48 PM

**kawecki,

The military, the Intelligence agencies, and even some multi-billion dollar companies have spying and survelliance technology so advanced that no one is sure if they are not being listened to, or watched no matter where they are.
Your not even safe taking a crap, these days.
Big Brother is everywhere.

There is invisibility technology being developed.
An object is covered with micro=sized cameras and micro projections screens. The micro cameras behind the object facing you film the background and then project it to micro screens on the front of the object, presto the object disappears in front of your eyes and blends in with the background.
The military has been experimenting with this technology on tanks. A major British newspaper had photos of a tank disappearing into the background, hence becoming invisible.
A spy could wear a bodysuit covered with these micro cameras/projectors and become invisible.

Satelitte spy cameras can read postage stamps, your conversations can be heard a half mile away by special laser beam listening devices., and ultra sensitive microphones.
Everything you do on the Internet can be watched and listened to, by Intelligence agencies no matter what blocking software you buy.
Everything you purchase can be stored in Intelligence data bases.
All your cell phone activity can be hacked by the Intelligence agencies, or anyone with the right technology.

Also, the Intelligence community did not stop their MKUtra drug and mind control research, so we don't know what they have come up with.

Then there is the far-out stuff like psychic viewing, and remote viewing. The Intelligence agencies have claimed, over, and over, again that their research into psychic viewing, and remote viewing were failures, and that the stuff is nonsense.
Hmmm.... I am not so sure. The Intelligence agencies are expert liars, so maybe the remote viewing technology works but they want us to believe that it doesn't.
If it does work the consequences are horrifying. Someone sitting in a room in Maryland can go into the remote viewing trance and then see and hear you wherever you are on Earth.
You could be taking a crap and that remote viewing guy or gal can be watching you from a thousand miles away, just using his/her mind.

Well, I don't know about that remote viewing stuff, but the other technological surveillance stuff is out there right now.

This is not to say that all Americans are being spyed on all the time, but that the new technological developments have made it extrememly easy for police, military, and Intelligence agencies to watch and listen to you anytime they please, and with very little effort.
Knowing that you can't be sure when you are being watched, and listened too, is not good for democracy. Is it fascism, yet? Who watches the watchers, watching us?**

 


kawecki ( ) posted Tue, 17 November 2009 at 11:10 PM · edited Tue, 17 November 2009 at 11:11 PM

Hollywood is great, any hero knows how to fly a flying-saucer and any kid can hack a Klingon defense computer.
The problem is that militars and politicians believe that all the Hollywood crap is reality and buys all the marvelous and expensive useless and fantasy toys sold by profit over profit greedy companies, meantime soldiers are dying, who cares, the function of a soldier is to die, the country bankrupts and citizens that believe in Hollywood too, pay all the costs.

Quote - Satelitte spy cameras can read postage stamps, your conversations can be heard a half mile away by special laser beam listening devices.

**

**This one was great, now laser turned into an audio device.
Laser audio surround system for $9.99, buy three and get one Mao's poster for free!
**
**

Stupidity also evolves!


kawecki ( ) posted Tue, 17 November 2009 at 11:24 PM

Quote - This is not to say that all Americans are being spyed on all the time, but that the new technological developments have made it extrememly easy for police, military, and Intelligence agencies to watch and listen to you anytime they please, and with very little effort.

**
**Who cares, who will watch all those tera bytes of useless data, you will need to hire a billion police and KGB officers from China to be able to watch all the useless citizen's speech running over the internet and cell phones and forget trafficants and bandits, no time neither resources to watch them.

Stupidity also evolves!


Grincho ( ) posted Tue, 17 November 2009 at 11:45 PM

The laser stuff is old technology.
The laser beam hits your window and bounces back to the receiving truck. The laser beam return signal has picked up the tiny vibrations made on the window by your voice and the computer in the truck deciphers the vibrations into language.
This technology was first used by the Russians to spy on the American Embasy in Moscow, I believe it was. I don't think the Russians got it from Hollywood. Lol

We human beings are pathetically flawed creatures, we are all clinically insane with excesssive fear, excessive mistrust, paranoia, hatred and bigotry. We are obsessed with greed and selfishness. We like to blame others, we refuse to see our own faults and inadequacies and thus project them onto other human beings.
The human brain is a mess, with the modern cortex on top of a mammalian brain, and that on top of a reptilian brain, all three wrestling with each other for control.
Hollywood, and politicians, are just a result, and reflection, of general human insanity. It is a species problem, we are all implicated, all of us.

The whole thing will end in nuclear war eventually. We are a species terrified of itself, and at constant war with itself.
I would recommend a reading of the novel, "A Canticle for Leibowitz" for a sobering view of our collective insanity. There is also an excellent radio drama production of the novel by National Public Radio that you can get on CD  at old radio drama websites.

 


Grincho ( ) posted Wed, 18 November 2009 at 12:08 AM

kawecki wrote,

*"Who cares, who will watch all those tera bytes of useless data, you will need to hire a billion police and KGB officers from China to be able to watch all the useless citizen's speech running over the internet and cell phones and forget trafficants and bandits, no time neither resources to watch them."

*Yup, the whole world is turning into a global police state and the movitating factor today is the mania about terrorism. Every crooked, greedy, power crazed businessman and polilician is shouting TERRORISM.
So, what happens? The security business is booming like rabbits in Australia, we must all buy security systems and spy on our neighbhors, because who knows who may be a terrorist. Maybe your wife is a terrorist, or your mailman, or the gardener, or even your dog.

So half of the American population watches the other half in eight hour relays. We can't trust each other, keep watching your fellow Americans, buy some spy devices and keep a watch on your neighbhorhood.

We don't have to hire a zillion watchers, we will all gladly do the watching for free and as a civic duty to protect the Fatherland from the evil ones. Doesn't the name Homeland Security remind you of a liitle guy with a mustache who wanted to protect his Fatherland from THEM.

 


Grincho ( ) posted Wed, 18 November 2009 at 12:51 AM

OH MY GOD, I AM BEING STALKED BY MISS NANCY.

 


kawecki ( ) posted Wed, 18 November 2009 at 1:00 AM

The media reports on science and technology is flawed, first at all reporters are ignorant, they have no idea about what they are speaking, they have never studied some scientific and many times are complicated subjects, if they have done they never should have been reporters.
In second place comes economical interests, you have a company and want to sell again a forgoten 30 years old product, you make again this product with a new case and name and then you call the reporters, you pay for this, this is not for free and then people watch in their TV the marvelous 21th technological revolution that exist in this products (nobody knows that is 30 years old.
In third place comes the politicians and politics, so you will be amazed, scared or whatever the goverment wants.

Advances do exist, people have new ideas and experiment them some has success other are a fracass, maybe 20 years later be a success or still continue to be a fracass, but in general real advances are very small and many times instead of advance, decadence happens.
What is happening today is that things are becoming more cheaper and so public can become aware of their existence, they think that is something new, but is old and the only difference is that they can purchase it now.
Things are becoming smaller just because is cheaper, a lot of people buy it and you can have a mass production.
I can design an electronic product, but if the sale volume is small (not popular product) the product will be made with discrete components, almost the same as 30 years ago and it will not be small. Until I have not enough demand it will be in this way. When I have a demand of 50,000 or more a month, I can put all the discrete components inside a chip, reduce its size and cost and produce it in China.
Computers are becoming cheaper and powerful, but are better that those 40 years ago? Yes and No.
40 years ago 100K of memory was a lot, it was big and very expensive, to add more 100K was almost economically impossible. Today add one more GB cost very little. WE have much more resources available and accessible to every one than had 40 years ago, also are thousands times more faster, but this is only consequenece of reduction in size and cost. Speed is inverse proportional to size. But today's computer architecture is better than 40 years ago? No!
Some years ago AMD introduced as a great technological advance 64 bits, but forty years ago computers were 64 or 48 bits....
Of course that are tecnological problems to be solved and were solved to reduce the size, there was the one micron barrier that was hard to solve some years ago, once solved, computers become smaller, faster and more powerful.
Today is another barrier, this time more difficult to solve: heat. Heat is proportional to speed that is inverse proportional to size. As more heat is needed to dissipate in a smaller are the heat problem increase with the square of speed, so don't expect to see much increase in speed next years. It's much easier to multiply the processors (cores) than increase its speed.
The other side is decadence: Software.
30 or 40 years ago the available resources were very small and computers slow too and many things were done with very few kilobytes, the software was very well done, efficient and fast.
Today is just the opposite, softwares are huge, very slow, inefficient and very badly done, all is compensated by a faster computer.
With every new Windows release you have a computer that is several times more faster and powerful, but the overall speed and performance remains the same, faster computer compensated by a worst software. Even with Vista Microsoft managed to make a computer top of line much slower than an older computer with an older Windows.

Stupidity also evolves!


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