I would not make any commercial sense if DAZ let Curious Labs include their most revenue generating products in Poser 5. They know that most Poser users will buy Mike and/or Vicky anyway and they earn more from high priced, individual sales than from a one-time volume deal with Curious Labs. Consider the fact that the price we pay for Mike + Vicky today is close to the price of Poser 4. How much would Curious Labs be prepared to pay to include the models if they want to keep the price of Poser 5 in the same range as Poser 4? Not enough, I suppose. I have no inside knowledge about this, but it would surprise me if it happened.