I seriously doubt if Mike and Vicky will be included in Poser 5. However, the Dragonriders have more morph targets, especially in their faces, and the Costume Shop CD has a male and female figure with more morph targets. These latter are an improvement upon The Dork and Posette as is, and could easily be made into the default figures, complete with ethnic variations. If I were in charge of that, I'd want a few more morphs and the kids done with extra morphs, too, to match. This would be a fair compromise: something better to encourage upgrades, but also something readily accessible for newbies... who'd then have access to all the clothes and props out here for the standard bodies. The other problem with Mike and Vicky (besides the financial neccesity for DAZ to keep them), is that they take a lot of processing power and memory. The basic program should be usable by as wide a range of customers as possible... and not everyone has 200 megs of Ram to allot to the one program. I may be wrong, but I'll be incredibly surprised to see Mike and Vicky in the new package. Carolly