Heyas

I've been wondering if there is any need for content for alyson 2.  I know people love anastasia, and well we all know Blackhearted rocks.  But do people want more stuff for the figure? 

And if so, what do they want?

Thanks for any info,

Lyrra

Well it's been about six months and the clothes for Alyson/Anastasia are almost non-existant.   I'm surprised with the lack of support as I thought she sold well and people liked her.    I'd like to add a resounding YES for more clothes but not more tank top dynamic mini dresses or bikinis.   I have to say that waiting for all this time has kinda put me off Anastasia which is too bad as I was initially very excited with the prospect of replacing Vicky.

I echo Kalypso's sentiments entirely. More clothes, but not more slutwear. So here is my wishlist for Anastasia: 

Some businesswear - tailored suits with skirts or trousers.

Lovely feminine blouses to wear with suits or skirts

Some "high fashion" designer dresses or two piece outfits

A horse riding outfit with jodhpur pants, a jacket, boots and hard hat

Sexy but not sleazy sleepwear - pajamas, dressing gown, peignoir, negligee, whatever you want to call it.

A skating outfit

A skiing outfit

An outdoorsy hiking outfit

Lots of shoes

Any number of ballgowns

Historical outfits for any period that takes your fancy

You get it - basically the girl needs a whole wardrobe.

Also more face morphs to give her different looks. And the key word is different - we need variation. We can't have all our Anastasia characters looking the same.

     Lord of the Rings type elvish dress, and sci-fi gear, and I'll concur with Nanette's list.

     I'll support content makers providing these, but I won't spend money on slutwear.

     For those interested, on my (long) to-do list is a new pixie dress (both conforming and dynamic versions), a ceilidh dancer's dress and shoes, carhop rollerskates, and a general purpose coverall/jumpsuit (first MAT will be for the Ghostbuster proton pack).

Definitely a desire for such content from me.  I don't need any leather underwear for her or any fetish type pieces, but do need pretty much everything else.  My only caveat to a vendor thinking about support, is that they please, please actually support Alyson2.  I love the Anastasia character and use her a lot( but not all females in my renders can be Anastasia),  I also use the Alyson 2 full body morphs and so far, no one has supported those.

I guess if I am going to add my voice I should be a little more specific than I need everything, lol , so :  Not much interest in sci fi here, but historical, some fantasy, jeans, shoes (heels, sandals, sport, low heeled boots), shirts and blouses, shorts, ballgowns and dance and sports clothing, business wear, winter outerwear, you get the idea.  :)

Definitely a whole wardrobe is needed.  I have been using her pretty consistently, experimenting in the face room and snagging character packs for some skin variety, but I am getting worn out shoehorning her into other figure's clothing and dealing with hit or miss conversions.  And very tired of the plain face and shoulders portrait.

I could use futuristic fashion clothes, science-future body armor, space suits, hat's, boots, casual shoes, etc, not only for Anastasia(A2) but also for her new friend "GND: Shae(A2)" Blackhearted just released.

Thank you, I go back to my occasional lurking now. m(_ _)m

Yup, really do need Alyson content.  She is begging...

Definitely more stuff wanted! Yes please!

Like others have said I was hoping more would come out for Anastasia and the lack of goodies has meant I've not really been using her much. More clothes for the girl means I have more inspiration and enthusiasm to render something with her.

I don't need everyday type clothes or flowing dresses as I make my own dynamic stuff for that and it's not a type of render I do much anyway. I want sci-fi and interesting fantasy wear. Preferably with lots of pieces so they can mix and match with other stuff.

Attached Link: http://isikol.deviantart.com

check

isikol.deviantart.com

Mylemonblue: thank you for telling me about Shae - I had missed her arrival too, and she is now in my runtime.

And now my wishlist also includes the whole spectrum of African themed ethnic and fantasy outfits: queen, warrior, priestess, fertility dancer....

Quote - i would love a bodysuit...just like Daz's for v4....then i could use only Anastasia for my hundreds of renders with Female superheroines...

check

i have an idea that may fill this niche, give me a few days to implement it.

got a few other things to take care of as well:  currently working on a low-resource version of the hair for people with slower machines, and just finished repainting the lacrimals (theres a small issue with the base Poser figures' lacrimals, that requires a creative fix).

I prefer dynamic, but quality dynamic with several (or even many) material zones (for trim or embellishments, etc) and good displacement maps.

If I had to choose one clothing model for Anastasia right now it would be a good generic fantasy tunic, pants, and boot set, ready for tons of texture add-ons. [V3's fantasy tunic, MFD, and hooded cloak (plus expansions and tons of texture variations) made up half my runtime at one point.]

Well, actually, Isokol's above mentioned body suit (conforming) for super hero and sci-fi renders would be very good too, especially if there were a matching expansion with a few accessories such as helmet, boots, and belts, holsters, etc.

if you prefer dynamic then you should be able to morph just about any dynamic clothing to her quite easily.  just load it, position it/scale it to fit as close as you can with the dials, then break out the Morph Brush to finish it up.

the Morph Brush is the most underrated/underused tool in Poser.

belts would need to be conformed (but the Poser Weight Map transfer - youtube it, Steve Cooper outlines how to do it - works pretty well for anything from the waist up), but helmets and tools and stuff are 'universal' in that youd just need to scale them/move them into position, parent them to the base figure (Object > Change Parent...) and then save to your Props library as smart props.

Quote - if you prefer dynamic then you should be able to morph just about any dynamic clothing to her quite easily.  just load it, position it/scale it to fit as close as you can with the dials, then break out the Morph Brush to finish it up.

the Morph Brush is the most underrated/underused tool in Poser.

belts would need to be conformed (but the Poser Weight Map transfer - youtube it, Steve Cooper outlines how to do it - works pretty well for anything from the waist up), but helmets and tools and stuff are 'universal' in that youd just need to scale them/move them into position, parent them to the base figure (Object > Change Parent...) and then save to your Props library as smart props.

Thanks for the advice.  I'm pretty awful with the morph brush.  But as with all things, I'm sure it's a matter of practice.  It honestly did not occur to me to do that with the dynamic stuff I already own. :)

As for the accessories, I must have some sort of mental block about this. I've never gotten good results scaling props for other figures. Even hair.  Moving items around is a nightmare.  It takes me forever to figure out how the xyz rotations work on any given item.  If a gun, for instance, isn't smartpropped already for the character I'm using, I'll never get it into a hand.  I usually give up after a few hours.  It's often more efficient for me, at least, to buy brand new products tailored for a specific character.  Poser content is definitely underpriced.

"If a gun, for instance, isn't smartpropped already for the character I'm using, I'll never get it into a hand."

yeah, thats probably the best example of something that is difficult to manipulate with the built-in Poser dials :(
for something like a gun, i usually use the poser manipulator gizmos (rotate, twist, move) while rotating the view around the character to roughly position/rotate an object into place. then once its roughly there, fine tune it with the dials.  it often helps when doing things like this to set the poser workspace to multiple viewports.

get in the habit of saving off hand poses (ones that you make, or ones from figure poses youve loaded) into your own hand pose library. that way when you need a hand gripping an object, or resting flat on a table or thigh you can load a similar one from the library and youll only have to do a bit of tweaking, rather than remake it all from scratch.

I could use a good basic contemporary wardrobe for Anastasia, but then, so could V4.

I am glad I have been giving WW a workout over the past year or so.  That does work.

And I agree with you blackhearted, the morph tool is an awesome tool, once you start using it.

Does anyone know how much quality gain you get in converting clothes manually in a modeling program (I use silo) compared to something like wardrobe wizard or xdresser?

I've been plodding away at a casual/outdoors outfit for antoniaWM, but I'm wondering if I should go through the trouble of fitting it for Alyson 2 as well and releasing to a little bit bigger market.

Thoughts?

it depends on the clothing item. something with a lot of mesh detail like buckles/seams/zippers/etc is best morphed by hand in a modeling app. once you get the hang of it, it goes pretty quick with soft selection tools.  fitting magnets are also a possibility that results in smoother transformations of mesh detail, but usually a less precise fit..

Well I have a bodysuit in dev already, as well as some other things.  Not as super fancy with a zillion options like DAZ's latest, but certainly enough for regular usage. Or irregular usage lol I mostly just needed some fullbody stuff to test magnets on .. and boy there isn't all that much out there!

Alyson's body isn't too bad .. but yeah her face needs some work.  There are a few face morphs for her around, but more is always good.

Good to see how much interest there is!

Lyrra

Most automatic conversion programs tend to 'vacuum fit' clothing.  Good for some things, but often the suction fitted cleavage doesn't look right.

They also often mangle things with tight detail like belts, buckles and chains.

I've had good results with Crossdresser, but in general if you can manually convert in your modeler you will have more control

On handling props - usually a prop has the same xyz as the universe. however once a prop is parented it inherits the xyz of its parent.

So often it is best to load an unparented prop and get it placed in the hand of a figure in the zero position. when it is in place then parent it and save it.

If your prop is already parented, load it with no figure in scene and resave to the library to remove parenting. then next time you load it, it should have universal XYZ again and be easier to manipulate.

Not all props are created equal, often an item that is freshly iported into poser from another format will have center of rotation that doesnt make sense for the item. Most swords for example should be centered on the hilt, to amke it easier to adjust.

You will need to use the Joint Editor to adjust the Center of the prop (this is an imaginary point that the item will rotate around)

Lyrra

Ahhh..... I see!

Thank you, BH and Lyrra.  Very helpful indeed.

Great info on props.. thanks.  I've often wracked my brain trying to figure out why they roatate the way they do.

i will add it in an update either tomorrow or monday. but now im heading to bed :)

Quote - I have to say that waiting for all this time has kinda put me off Anastasia which is too bad as I was initially very excited with the prospect of replacing Vicky.

I honestly haven't done much with Anastasia and, like Kalypso mentioned above, the 6 month wait has put me off of the figure also.

Truthfully, the clothing would have to be something really exciting for me to spend more money on any figure that has shown such limited support. I lean towards fantasy and scifi but have bought items outside of those before.

I would also  prefer dynamic clothes for Anastasia

take a look at this render. both renders are straight out of Poser. this is the exact same pose, lighting, mesh and render settings as the image i posted three posts ago.  all i did was replace Shae with the base Alyson.

customers continually clamour for more attractive base figures.  vendors complain that their clothing looks like crap on the base figures.  people complain about the proliferation of simple 'dial-twist' dime-a-dozen character packs on the market.  just about everyone moans about the current Genesis situation and whines that there arent any other options.

yet when i provide another attractive option, i get fucked because all of a sudden everyone wants every piece of vicky clothing in their runtimes to work with it seamlessly.  the legacy vicky runtime is the curse that has been holding back any sortof Poser development for years -- neither vendors nor customers want to try anything new.  over the 12 years ive been doing this ive watched countless original and innovative products fail simply because they 'werent vicky'.

ive been busting my ass on one base figure or another for many months now. i am just one guy, i work very hard, i barely ever get any time off. if customers want something different then its up to them to go out on a limb a bit and leave the safe confines of their legacy V4 runtimes, to encourage their vendors to make supporting clothing products, to pick up a tutorial and learn about possibilities such as dynamic clothing, and to understand that everything in this life comes with a tradeoff.

cheers,
-Gabriel

I can understand why you're pissed, Gabriel.  Your work is magnificent and yet not appreciated even a fraction as much as it deserves -- which is why I am trying to encourage vendors to support this figure.  I want them to, and given my extreme lack of talent in modifying existing products, I need them to.

I have made money from renders in the past, but it's not a business, and there's no profit in it, so I have to work at another profession.  I don't have time to learn how to model, how to rig, how to texture, etc, etc. Unfortunately, I get the impression that this somehow makes me worth less as a customer because I'm so lazy that I WANT to spend money.

Oh well.

I don't blame you, you understand.  But it is frustrating to reply in a thread when someone asks what products people want, and be told I should learn how to adapt my existing runtime, rather than ask for new stuff.  Okay... I really do appreciate the help, but let me skulk off back into my corner now because, yep, it's true: I am not a content creator and I will never be one because I don't like it, I'm no good at it, and I don't have time for it.

I don't think that the person you quoted above was blaming you, so much as lamenting exactly the same thing you are: that other vendors had not stepped up to support you.

Trust me, if the day I had spent playing with Marvelous Designer had given me any hope that I could produce something before the 30 day trial was up, I'd have bought it the software and would be pumping out dynamic freebies for Ana as fast as I could.  But it took me half a day to figure out I couldn't even load an avatar, despite all the tutorials I looked at.  I'm hopeless. So.  I give up. 

Is there a quick suitdress mesh avaiable for content makers to start from?

All the best.

LROG

"I don't blame you, you understand.  But it is frustrating to reply in a thread when someone asks what products people want, and be told I should learn how to adapt my existing runtime, rather than ask for new stuff.  Okay... I really do appreciate the help, but let me skulk off back into my corner now because, yep, it's true: I am not a content creator and I will never be one because I don't like it, I'm no good at it, and I don't have time for it."

thats not why i suggested it at all. i was simply pointing out that when it comes to dynamic, one of the main strengths is that it can easily be adapted to any figure in your runtime, so you should not have to buy a dynamic dress multiple times over for different figures.all you need is the morphing tool and the cloth room.

the morphing tool is very easy to master, ive been saying for years that its the most underrated tool in Poser. it will fix pokethrough in clothing, can touch up joints or even flex muscles, can make just about any of the popular breast morphs/squish/gravity morphs (not as detailed as ones custom done in zbrush, but pretty close), can create expressions, etc. i just found out the other day that it can even morph dynamic hair!

i am not pissed, im just frustrated.  ive been at this for over 12 years now and have watched SM roll out all these awesome Poser advancements such as the hair room, cloth room, face room, morphing tool, normal maps, weight maps, etc - and theyre working on even more - yet theyve been largely ignored as most vendors and customers continue to use Poser as if it were still Poser 4.  10 years in CG is a lifetime, yet 90% of whats in the marketplace right now could be time-warped back to 2000 and would work perfectly fine in Poser 4 Pro.

i will see what i can do about making a dynamic mesh or two today.

i also have this dynamic chemise i made (thats GND4) which i could morph over to Shae/Anastasia and put in freestuff.

Thank you, if I have a base to work from I can produce dynamic things very quickly.

Perhaps we could have it as a little challenge, no prizes, to get some more clothing done. I know there are some very talanted people out there that may be willing to help.

All the best.

LROG

i am relatively fast and efficient at making the meshes, and UV mapping them. i can delaunay triangulate them for best results in the cloth room. depending on the item i can also produce displacement/normal maps for seam detail.

what i dont have time to do is fiddle with it in the clothroom till i nail the right settings, or to texture everything and provide complete end-user packages.

the problem is that even if i provide a nice mesh with great UVs and displacement maps, its just going to be dead in the water unless people pick it up and run with it from there.

If you provide just a basic starter suit and dress and you may be amazed at what appears.

For most content makers eitehr free or paide for content, the hardest bit is having a starting point. Once they have that, then imagaination takes over.

Take a mesh for a pair of long legged pants.

Give me that and I can have, cargo pants, 3/4 length pants, shorts, short shorts, breifs, bikini bottoms etc.

As you can see, if I can see this from one mesh, then others will do so as well.

Now, those that want to go dynamic can stop at that point, esay enough to do a dynamic sim in Poser. Those that want to do conforming, well, there is a dev model for doing that as well.

So, if the basic suitdress appears, then the fun begins.

All the best.

LROG

This is what is killing me too.  I've made or started to make a whole bunch of things for Alyson2 with hopes of adding anastasia (and now shae if i get her) using morphing clothes.  I even found it super easy to convert from my antonia set to alyson 2 almost entirely within poser just scaling, trans and morph brush....  and then I go to set them up to conform to Alyson2 and.... full stop.

Maybe I just ride the short bus with regards to the setup room (though I've been doing OK with antonia) but everything I work on for Alyson ends up with crotch blowing apart or giant creases in the shoulder bend, or some other mess.  I keep walking away from her with the hope that I'll come back once I've refined my skills a bit, but everytime I end up in the same spot as the last time.  Anyway.. thats what is holding me back atm.

Quote - i am relatively fast and efficient at making the meshes, and UV mapping them. i can delaunay triangulate them for best results in the cloth room. depending on the item i can also produce displacement/normal maps for seam detail.

what i dont have time to do is fiddle with it in the clothroom till i nail the right settings, or to texture everything and provide complete end-user packages.

the problem is that even if i provide a nice mesh with great UVs and displacement maps, its just going to be dead in the water unless people pick it up and run with it from there.

What are you using to group your item to start with?

All the best.

LROG

it really depends on what youre making. there are people more experienced in conforming that could elaborate on what areas are difficult.

"So, if the basic suitdress appears, then the fun begins."

i will provide some dresses and slips/chemise, but a suit with a suit jacket is too complex for right now. letterworks has a pretty sweet skirt suit in the making for anastasia, i can add the shae morph to it as well.*

It seems to me that there is a huge opportunity for someone(s) who is skilled and actually enjoys the 'finishing' work in poser.  It seems like a lot of stuff doesn't get made because there are a lot of us who can take a project part way by ourselves but dont have the skills/tools to finish it off to a high enough standard.  

If someone was to post in here 'hey I can rig alyson2 without problems most of the time, want to partner up on this project?'   I'd be happy to cut them in on whatever profits came out of it.   Same thing with texturing.. I can do it.. but its slow and not my favorite thing so I'm usually up for doing one set for any product and thats about it.

Just a thought.  I bet a lot of support would come out faster if people would jump in and start teaming up... and it would be sure nice to kickstart the market on non-vickie things

I'm using the autogroup in the setup room then the poser grouping tool to tweak the groups(also in the setup room)

Quote - What are you using to group your item to start with?

All the best.

LROG

Ok, now I normally use AGE:-

LINK

This sets up my groups for the item. What you might have done is mixed up some areas when grouping ans so get the problems you have encountered.

Once you have a grouped mesh, just import in to Poser. Make sure Centred and Percentage of size is switched off.

Now, I normally don't have any figure in the scene, but that is my preference.

Go to the Setup room.

Now rigging isn't hard, you just need the right Dev rig to do it with.

If you have a look in your PoserCharacters sectionPeopleAlyson, you will see a figure called:-

Alyson_DEV

That is the rigging that you need, so pull into the scene and the bones will now appear.

Back to the Pose room. At this point, if you get an error message saying things are not grouped, then you have missed something in the grouping with AGE and need to find out where the problem is back in AGE.

If everything has gone right, you are now back inthe Pose room. Load in Alyson 2 and now do a conform of your new item to the figure.

Now, the pain begins!!!! Lol.

You may need to check fall off zones as things stay in place or elongate when you move or ben a limb.

I can't go into doing that in this little post, but it's not hard, I used to think it was impossible, but now it holds no fear.

Once everything is done, fall off zones working etc. you can then save it to Your Character section in a folder of your choice.

If all works as well, dance around like a loom and shout outto all that can hear that it works!!! Well, you don't have to but you will feel like doing it!!!! LOL.

All the best.

LROG

Nice work on the Business Suit!!!! And something that would be used in real life!!!

All the best.

LROG

Quote - It seems to me that there is a huge opportunity for someone(s) who is skilled and actually enjoys the 'finishing' work in poser.  It seems like a lot of stuff doesn't get made because there are a lot of us who can take a project part way by ourselves but dont have the skills/tools to finish it off to a high enough standard.   If someone was to post in here 'hey I can rig alyson2 without problems most of the time, want to partner up on this project?'   I'd be happy to cut them in on whatever profits came out of it.   Same thing with texturing.. I can do it.. but its slow and not my favorite thing so I'm usually up for doing one set for any product and thats about it.

Just a thought.  I bet a lot of support would come out faster if people would jump in and start teaming up... and it would be sure nice to kickstart the market on non-vickie things

i have gigs of content ive created that have not been released for various reasons. sometimes its because i dont have the time to finish an aspect of it. other times there is a minor flaw/glitch in the product that prevents me from putting it up in my store, yet it would still make many people happy. 

what would be more useful is a 'pool' where people can submit content, along with a 'terms of use' text file that outlines how it may be used/redistributed. ie: either total royalty-free use or possibly with other conditions.

for example if i model something i will gladly submit it for royalty-free personal or commercial use and redistribution for Alyson/Anastasia/Shae/future GNDs, but i would not authorize someone to remorph my meshes and start selling them in their stores as Genesis items.

i want to give, but on the other hand i do not want to be taken advantage of.

for example if i model something i will gladly submit it for royalty-free personal or commercial use and redistribution for Alyson/Anastasia/Shae/future GNDs, but i would not authorize someone to remorph it and start selling it in their store as a Genesis item.

I have seen that in various Read Me texts (Yep, I do read them!!! Lol), so that would be no problem.

All the best.

LROG

Gabriel, I hear you.

The only holdup I have had with the SM figures has been the T-Rex arms. I have to go through & adjust every one of them & then adjust every piece of clothing for them.

It amazes me that SM haven't figured out the proper length for arms after all of this time.

I agree that our biggest problem is the legacy V4 runtime - I would say that the second biggest problem is the aggressive unwillingness of a lot of vendors to move past Poser 4 as the baseline for compatiblity.

I have a 40Gb V4 clothing runtime.  Of that about 75% goes through Wardrobe Wizard with no fuss & it works just fine on Anastasia (and Antonia, Sydney, Maya Doll, V3 {I still use her}, Laura, Miki 1,2,3 etc - I need normal sized people & V4 height limits her to about 5%).  I could probably get the other 25% working when I sit down with the manual & figure out what I need to do to deal with buttons.

Wardrobe Wizard, Xdresser & Morphing Clothes are probably the biggest threat to the vendors - I can take a well made piece of V4 clothing & convert it to any other character I own - except Mariko - PhilC needs to get cracking on a WW plug-in for her.

I can't buy what isn't in the stores.  There is only 1 item of A2 clothing that I haven't bought, & I am purchasing it on Jun 1.   I stand corrected - I just discovered some clothing for A2 that I thought was a mislabled V4 outfit - the idiot vendor 7 V4 promo renders and only 1 A2 promo & it was the 7th promo image.

And it would help tremendously if I could find all of the A2 stuff in one place here at 'rosity - some things are listed under Poser 9 & some are listed under Poser Pro 2012.  Apparently, I have missed a few items because I wasn't looking in both places.

I would really, really like some sensible shoes for my A2.  I would buy them most rikki-tick.  And a good business outfit, and any clothing that could be worn out in public.  I still don't have native set of jeans, or blouses, or shoes, etc.

I'll buy more if someone makes more.  This is the same problem customers have with male clothing.

A number of vendors attempted to make 1 item for alternate characters (usually a male), they picked something of limited use (example - wizard robes - it was great, but I don't need a set of wizard robes) or they just half-assed the product - no movement morphs, hell, no body morphs installed, colors (in the case of a male item) that no man would be caught dead in & then they wonder why no one was willing to pay a 50 to 100 percent premium over a similar V4 item.  I don't mind paying $20 - $30 for an outfit - I just ask that have the same types of movement morphs & body morphs as a V4 item.  Oh, and see if you can get Renapd to do a texture set.  I have bought a number of products just because I liked what renepd did with them.

Vendors are only willing to make variations of the same theme over and over.  We had a saying in the Army "There is actually only one document in the Army & we just cut & paste it."  This appears to be the vendors' MO.

IMO, one of the major driving factors of that "Thing that will not be named" over at DAZ, is the fact that the market for skankwear was saturated.  Take a look at what clothing items that DAZ & DAZ PAs are releasing - it is the exact same stuff - "Now for the "Thing that will not be named".

my goal is to make 3 versions, one for Alyson2, one for Anastasia and one for Shae, so people pick the version they need without having to run an additional simulation.

I don't really want to get into another store thing, but yes, I have noticed that they are now duplicating a lot of similar things that were for V4 to their new model.

But, I think that we need to stay on topic and bring about more clothing items for Anastasia.

Now, some people are good at shoes, others at dresses etc. So it's just a matter of bringing people together with a like mind to make things for others to enjoy.

All the best.

LROG

^you can add 2 FBMs to the dress (if anyone is modeling one from scratch for these three figures, it would likely be easiest to use shae as the base, and then add an FBM for anastasia and alyson from there, since its generally more straightforward to morph down than up, and shae is quite a bit bigger in the hips/chest than alyson).

that way someone can load the dress and just use the FBM morph dials to fit whichever figure. it would also allow for partial morph blending between shae/anastasia/alyson. for example, the shae morph loaded on anastasia at ~50% looks pretty good, in case anyone wants to shed about 10lbs of T&A from shae :)

Quote - i have a dynamic cocktail dress in progress, originaly made for Aiko3 in Marvelous Designer, with various material zones to make different  looks, open back or lace belt.

my goal is to make 3 versions, one for Alyson2, one for Anastasia and one for Shae, so people pick the version they need without having to run an additional simulation.

I'd buy that.  Actually, I'd buy everything I have seen in this thread.

will post WIP shots in a bit.