Hi, "somewhat organised" huh? I think you've been watching to many movies, most of the virus crowd are fairly solitary types, the have E-zines,etc. but due to the covert nature of thier work, they don't tend to announce themselves openly. They're also not my friends, I don't know anyone who writes virii, and I'm not sure I'd be too well disposed toward them if I did. It is possible to admire the work but abhor the use it's put to, you know. A good virus is much like an F-16, or a cat, which may be cut and lovable to humans, but to a mouse, it's hell on wheels. As for the crap about the NSA, get real, they, like most of the other US domestic intelligence agencies, simply don't have the staff that could infiltrate any such "somewhat organsied group" (even if one existed) the over relience on technology rather than more "human" forms of intelligence is what led the USA into the false sense of security from which it has be so rudely awakened. Granted the NSA may be a power in the computing world when it comes to espionage, encryption, and evesdropping, but I doubt they could succeed where the CIA have failed, especially when most of the virus writers come from developing countries. I believe "Dark Angel" was Bulgarian, the Mellissa virus was written by a Aisan, and Nimda is supposed to be written by an Indian, I can't see a spook from a suburb of Langely fitting in well in any of these locations, even if they could speak the language. I would unplug my computer, but the bank won't let me :) You see, you assume that because I know about this stuff I must be "involved" when in reality I know about this stuff because I get paid to prevent such problems from occuring. Word has it that Nimda killed the whole "Bank of America" (UK) network on Thursday/Friday, we were getting frantic messages via email, (I work at a different bank) telling us where to get updates, etc. Today we're getting email asking if certain of our systems are compliant, and the back-chat and related banter are both amusing and enlightening. Though I think you'll find that charges of treason will be remarkably hard to impose on a citizen of a sovereign country. Granted they could impound any assets/employees on US soil, but unless you're willing to go in with guns blazing and occupy the country, (which is working real well for the Israelis/Russians at the moment :) then I think your chances of a successfull "prosecution" are remarkably slight to non-existant. But each to his own I guess. later jb