Forum: Poser - OFFICIAL


Subject: They were right about Genesis and Poser

FightingWolf opened this issue on Dec 09, 2014 · 29 posts


Dale B posted Tue, 16 December 2014 at 7:36 AM

The only issue I have is the lack of full disclosure. Telling people that the g-thing 'Works In Poser' is misleading. Because the new and the virgin (and far too many with some experience) are going to be mentally adding 'just like it does in DS' to the end of that statement, because the initial assertion suggests it. Which is a blatant untruth. If it's explained fully, no problem. But how often is it? How many times do we have to get on this merry go round when someone tries the g-thing? My personal view is if you have to slap two or more qualifiers onto something working or being compatible with something else, then it doesn't and it's not. You might be able to kludge -some- function out of it (which a lot of people have), but you do not get =full= function (and if this is no longer the case, please provide references to both stills and animation proving it). And that should be stated plainly. All we need is a sticky up at the top of the page, listing all the steps you need to take and all the urls of the assorted scripts needed to obtain specific functions, and someone take the time to write it up as a technical document, removing any and all attempts at humor and marketshare grabbing from it. Information sans opinion. From any side. Then its just point at the top and say 'ask if you have some issue not addressed there'.

Well, the function that I regularly "kludge" out of Genesis includes: 1. loading a figure, 2. dressing a figure, 3. fitting clothing to a figure, 4. using a figure in the cloth room, 5. morphing a figure, 6. texturing a figure, 7. posing a figure, 8. rendering a figure in a scene.  I particularly enjoy "kludging" through step 3, which with Genesis is a one-click operation, as opposed to V4 and her magnets.

In my experience, the issues surrounding DSON importation and installing the plugin really aren't any more complex than the problems new users experience in installing V4. Making any Daz content work in Poser requires some knowledge beyond simply downloading a zip file. It always has.

I don't do animations in Poser; I haven't got a clue HOW to do animations in Poser with any figure. So I have nothing to say about that. If you find that Genesis isn't appropriate for animations, I won't contradict you. I also don't use DS, so I can't speak to exactly what Genesis can do in DS that it can't do in Poser. But since I'm not using DS, I'm not missing those things either. :)

But I know what it can do in Poser for still shots. It poses, morphs, and renders. For a great many users, that's kinda the whole point. And it's why, when someone new wants info on Genesis 1/2 and using it in Poser, pretty much everyone here asks the OP what they want to use it for -- because we all know that, regardless of who holds the IP, some figures/software/tech/methods are more optimized for some uses and workflows than others. Doesn't make any of them worthless. Just means you should pick which advantages you're unwilling to live without and which disadvantages you're willing to live with. As with all things, this will vary greatly from one person to another, and no one has the right to insist that their standards be universal.

The point that is getting buried underneath a lot of personality conflicts is the concept of time. As an animator, seconds are precious to me. That's one reason I use the Poser-Vue pipeline. If they haven't broken the SDK functions with a blown update, the import is quick and smooth. Yes, I can create the illusion of terrain in Poser, but not the kinds of terrain you get with Vue. The lighting system there is far more flexible and easier to work with....saving time. Adding a half dozen steps per figure just to get the figure to a usable state is wasting time at best. If you have a paying job, you usually have a deadline. Those kinds of shenanigans can run you out of your contracted time very quickly, and then you are sol, depending on the contract terms. In my case it is writing and animating an original story, so I have even less time to waste, as I have pretty much all the jobs involved in bringing something to life on my plate. Being able to morph from one figure to another would have been cool...but none of my pipeline talks with DS. You do not get full function from the figure, as it was built to -need- DS for that, so its a no go.

I'm sure genesis was fast in Poser; with sub-d off, it is a very light mesh. However, that is not a function of being genesis. Any mesh as light as that one is would be equally as fast, unless it had some bad vertex's at just the wrong place.

And not to be combative, but the real test would be with a mocap file created specifically for that rig, or seeing how well behaved it is when someone goes into the graph editor and starts correcting the errors (which is a valid practice. If a client insists you use X mocap file, then you have to clean the bugger up by hand). If it meets yours and others needs, great. But as one who was really hoping to see advances in Poser specific technology in figures, the number of hoops you have to jump through to get partial functionality of that system simply are not worth the investment in my case. Their program will not fit into my pipeline, except possibly catty cornered. And I really do not want to see Poser held hostage to another company again, as most of the neato work around tricks in V2-3-4 etc were created by the end users because the figure creator refused to move beyond P4 and its severe limitations. If someone manages an effective way to get the full functionality of genesis into Poser, I'll be happy to re-evaluate my stance. Until that happens, too little return for too much annoyance.