I am not sure if this problem is one of objection creation in Blender, or if it is a Poser rendering problem.

I've been creating a door handle, the handle has a circular base where it connects to the door.  It's supposed to be circular.

The angles curve properly around the edges, but not on the front and back.  In fact, when rendered the edges seem to split apart.  I've double and triple checked to be sure that I don't have duplicate edges.

The first image below is a render, with red circles to highlight the weird thing going on.  The second image shows how the geometry looks in Blender.

My guess would be that vertices aren't welded along the edges. I can see it happening with the latch portion too. Since it sounds like you've checked that, I'd look and see if it isn't somehow becoming split in the export/import process, perhaps something to do with the seams because it is following those.

My other thing would be to try turning off the smooth polygons in Poser.

Yars ago on the Smith Micro forum there was a discussion about splitting faces.  Part of the problem is the order in which the faces are read.  The other part has to do with smooth polygons.  Smooth polygons is only meant for figures as in people and animals.  Not for hard surfaces that only bend in one direction.

Select the whole mesh in Blender (All Faces In Edit Mode), go to Vertices, Hit  " Remove Doubles " . Depending on the distance the preset might be enough 0.0001 if not Increase the value slowly. Export again the formant you want to use in Poser . This should fix your issue. 

I've done remove doubles and delete loose geometry.  Multiple times, as I have remade it a few times to see if more subdivisions or holding edges would work.

I was wondering at first if seams could be the issue, but there is only a seam around the edges of the bottom part of the plate where it would touch the door.  The top edge away from the door has the split too, but it doesn't have a seam.

Richard60 posted at 4:46 PM Thu, 9 March 2023 - #4458019

Yars ago on the Smith Micro forum there was a discussion about splitting faces.  Part of the problem is the order in which the faces are read.  The other part has to do with smooth polygons.  Smooth polygons is only meant for figures as in people and animals.  Not for hard surfaces that only bend in one direction.

I was wondering if Poser didn't like the circle in two dimensions and then the hard angle in the third dimension.  Though when I load a cylinder primitive and look at it, it's pretty much the same thing but it doesn't have the problem I'm having.  So I feel like I ought to be able to do the same thing as the cylinder primitive.

I could try beveling those edges a little, but I was trying to avoid using more faces than necessary, especially when they are going to end up being very tiny faces.

For a better result you might also after removing the doubles subdivide Edges 2x and Smooth the Vertex 2x  ( Aprox ) This will avoid a deformation when rendering in poser with smooth on.

bjbrown posted at 5:42 PM Thu, 9 March 2023 - #4458024

I've done remove doubles and delete loose geometry.  Multiple times, as I have remade it a few times to see if more subdivisions or holding edges would work.

I was wondering at first if seams could be the issue, but there is only a seam around the edges of the bottom part of the plate where it would touch the door.  The top edge away from the door has the split too, but it doesn't have a seam.

Richard60 posted at 4:46 PM Thu, 9 March 2023 - #4458019

Yars ago on the Smith Micro forum there was a discussion about splitting faces.  Part of the problem is the order in which the faces are read.  The other part has to do with smooth polygons.  Smooth polygons is only meant for figures as in people and animals.  Not for hard surfaces that only bend in one direction.

I was wondering if Poser didn't like the circle in two dimensions and then the hard angle in the third dimension.  Though when I load a cylinder primitive and look at it, it's pretty much the same thing but it doesn't have the problem I'm having.  So I feel like I ought to be able to do the same thing as the cylinder primitive.

I could try beveling those edges a little, but I was trying to avoid using more faces than necessary, especially when they are going to end up being very tiny faces.

Ok this is really strange, such a phenomenon never occurred to me ! Was worth a try :) Does the same thing happen in Blender when you hit Smooth Vertex ? or do they stay together?

RedPhantom posted at 1:42 PM Thu, 9 March 2023 - #4458005

My guess would be that vertices aren't welded along the edges. I can see it happening with the latch portion too. Since it sounds like you've checked that, I'd look and see if it isn't somehow becoming split in the export/import process, perhaps something to do with the seams because it is following those.

My other thing would be to try turning off the smooth polygons in Poser.

Do you mean to turn Smooth Polygons in the Render Settings checkbox?  Or on the object, or both?  I tried unchecking it in render settings.  The edges don't tear- but now they aren't rounded at all.

vopehov506 posted at 5:51 PM Thu, 9 March 2023 - #4458026

Ok this is really strange, such a phenomenon never occurred to me ! Was worth a try :) Does the same thing happen in Blender when you hit Smooth Vertex ? or do they stay together?

They stay together when I use Smooth Vertex.

I was thinking of the object one, but I'd try the other if one didn't work. And it's not going to be round because your object isn't round. You could try subdividing it in Poser to fix that.

Rather than removing doubles, I'd select all points and merge by distance. Make it a really tiny number, of course.

Yikes.  I don't use Blender but IMO, the first problem is the cylindrical parts are too low poly.  I'd at least double them before doing anything else.  After that, I'd run a row of polys either side where the faces join to help Poser stop smoothing it out too much.  Yes it adds to the poly count but it shouldn't be a problem on a modern system.

Also, there's a stray vert on the handle, which may not cause you any problems but if it was me, I'd kill it.

Here are the pictures that I was talking about.  

The top one shows that the order of the faces in the object file make a difference.  If the Right face if first in the file then smoothing causes the other two to bend outwards.  The bottom picture shows what happens if you change the smoothing angle to 90 degrees.  Then all faces bend outwards

There was someone over on the SM forum that was trying to use smoothing as a substitute for subdivision, since Poser 9 did not have subD.  He had a simple object that he posted the text for and I copied it and then started to move the faces around to see if I could get rid of the problem. I did but it is hard to do with any type of complex object. 

The original object was a box with depth provided by the edges at the top of the box.  he reduced the object down to the three sides you see above that have the smoothing problem.  The 3 faces have a common point and there are only 8 vertexes and three faces in this object.

Using subdivision in Poser makes the edges a little bit too rounded- I'd like that to be last resort.  Today, I am going to see what happens if I split the edges (separating the caps from the cylinders), or beveling the edges in Blender.

I assume this is no longer a problem in Poser 12?  I actually just bought Poser 12, but haven't installed it yet.  I've been delaying installation because I know I can't just plug in my old Runtimes and files, and I've been dreading the work it's going to take to make everything usable.  I'd like to finish current projects before dealing with changing version; but I also don't want to spend too much extra effort modifying objects as work-arounds for problems in Poser 10.