Sharen: Yeah, I've got 4.03 - it was the first thing I did before using it !! - I've now got a feelinbg that my motherboard is at fault - it's gone wonky before - but ta anyway. Agiel: I've had about 10 tutorials from here alone, so I probably don't really need a book - it's just that the one by Susan Kitchens for Bryce4 is so good that I'd probably buy one anyway. As to the images here they are just fantastic - it kind of almost puts me off posting any - mine seem so inferior to some that I've seen.