Tux :) Both of your assertions are myths. Name me any commercial program on any system, and I will provide you with the binary header that you can check against an original, it may take me a while, but I've got all night :) If you want I can provide you with a simple "shell virus" that performs all the classic functions on any *nix box you choose, they're not impossible to write virii on, but they're not widespread enough and too hard a target to crack when you can bulk infect myriad PC's in minutes. If you want proof of a real trojan that spread like wild fire on UNIX, do a search on google for the Morris internet worm. Being smug in this game will get you dead real quick :) later jb