I use Max a zillion hours a week, but it is all for modeling, I've never done a single real render in it. The only time I tried I ran into problems using my hair, I think you need to turn on double sided or something, otherwise the backside polys don't get rendered. I aught to get up to speed in it, another thing for the to-do list. However, my system is fast enough in Poser it wouldn't be primarily for saving time, but it would be nice to not have to fake the reflections like I do now. ;-) Incidently, the file is still in Freestuff, search on my name. I'd still like to get a couple more resulys, especially 1200+ Celerons or some 800 mhz+ Mac G4s. My school is updating my Mac G3 to a G4 800, but It will probably not be here to mid summer. I'm (eventually) going to add a text file with the results to the zip, in a couple years we can rerun the test and say "What did we think was so fast about these computers..." !