I model everything except trees in Cinema 4d XL V7...the trees are done in onyx tree pro (which exports to cinema), it works well with poser as long as you know the few quirks (which i'd tell you if you got it of course ;o) of the 3 pro pack plugins the cinema one seems to be the easiest to use (just move the trans to the alpha channels and your done).....the app has fast radiosity but still renders well without it ....heres a few image links where everything has been modeled and render ii C4d (except humanms and trees of course )....BTW which ever app you get ring them before buying and ask if they have any crossgrade deals from what you have, if they say know hum and hah and bit and seem indecisive they may make you a good offer :o).........Steve http://poserworld.com/stevePublicPrvws/todinner.jpg http://poserworld.com/stevePublicPrvws/mbrender.jpg http://poserworld.com/stevePublicPrvws/stopnow.jpg http://poserworld.com/stevePublicPrvws/btwindow.jpg this last one has radiosity http://poserworld.com/stevePublicPrvws/btw2.jpg