thanks for the support folks. i actually suspect that mikeknott is pretty closely affiliated with bebop, since hes been trolling my gallery with bebops usual bs. as for no copyrights on lights because theyre just a bunch of dial settings? gee... then i guess there can be no copyrights on poses either, since theyre just dial settings that anyone who owns poser can reproduce. and no copyrights on meshes, because theyre just a bunch of numbers that anyone could theoretically reproduce. and no copyrights on literature, since theyre just a bunch of words that ANYONE could put together in the same sequence. no copyrights on images either, since a bitmap is just a sequence of colored dots that anyone could reproduce. and as for steve cooper's response - i dont see what a programmer has to do with any of this. and i wonder what steve cooper would say if i started redistributing poser, since all it is is a bunch of code that ANYONE could reproduce. although i seriously doubt that you explained the situation to him fully, or that you are quoting him in context. i wouldnt put anything past you or bebop (assuming youre two separate people). cheerio, -gabriel