clyde - the systems you mentioned are not worth the money they're asking. Shop around, definitely. Get lots of RAM (512MB is absolute minimum) Preferably 768MB or more. DDR is best at the price, 333MHz. Make sure the motherboard supports USB 2.0 and Ultra ATA 133. A fast CPU (1.4 is absolute minimum) AMD or Intel makes no diff. Preferably 1.8 or more. Harddisk 60GB minimum, preferably 80 or more. Graphics card GeForce3 absolute minimum, preferably GeForce4 - Mind you, graphics card type/speed has no significance for Poser, but as a general rule. Screen 17 inch mimimum, preferably 19 inch. Go for at least 1280x1024 res. Windows 98SE (NOT 98Gold) or Win2K (avoid XP for the time being. Avoid Win ME altogether.) If you run a maxed PC at 2.4 GHz, 1 GB RAM, 800MHz RDRAM and GeForce4, you'll blow any Mac out of the water, whatever Apple try to claim. But it isn't cheap! :] FishNose