AAAAAAAAAAAAARGH! that time max didn't crash...the whole computer did! ugh! luckily I use a network at home, so I can reboot the computer without getting cut off the 'net (since I've done that five times today already, and we pay for local phone calls) I'm getting really very close to saying something rather discouraging about this project, throwing my hands up in dispair, and leaving it for another to do SewerRat