Well, Now I am stuck, I decided to start over, deleted the original infinite plane and added AGR, render error when it hits the part were the Agr obj starts, just for the heck of it I added the tip obj again and it renderes fine, remove tip, render error. Hmmm Also, Now I can't get anything glows to work in the sceene. Glow chanel works in the shader but no light being emitted (tried all options of light color, obj and glow, as well as changing the box verteces..) I will start from scratch and see what happens, the sceen I am working on is in the WIP thread, not real complex, the shader for the walls is most of it, I just wanted to play with some new tech. Thanks for getting back so quickly, I will try your sugestions first.