"There is STILL no upgrade price published. Can't use SIGGRAPH as an excuse any more, it's been over for days." It's Monday. Kupa just got back last night. He posted in another thread: "...and now that I'm back, maybe we can finally get the website updated so all those great questions can finally get answered. " A day or two to prepare a formal Website update based on SIGGRAPH questions & concerns is certainly reasonable. "The employee went on to say that "the underlying features are the same for Poser 4 and 5." Weren't we told Poser 5 was being "completely rewritten from scratch?" Wasn't that one of their excuses for taking so long and not fixing P4? I believe it was. Somebody fibbed." No inconsistency there. A program can be completely re-written without incorporating hardware-Dependant features. I can't think of any reason why they would want to, anyway. I can imagine the howl from the "bitch & quibble" contingency if some features needed a certain Video Chipset or CPU to work correctly. "I never said Poser was a bad program; it's a great program, just clunky, buggy, and old." Agreed. Poser 4 out of the box works pretty well. I imagine it was about 80% of what MetaCreations envisioned. Better than most software on release, but some problems. With the 4.03 upgrade it probably jumped to about 88-90% of MetaCreations' vision. Then the poser community jumped on the platform, and some really creative folk cranked it up to a new level, making unanticipated demands on it - add Millennium Characters, ultra-Hi-res textures, meshes, etc. and soon the new demands taxed even the 4.03 patched program from 90% of MC's vision to 70% or even 65% of the revised users requirements. This is hardly a failure in the program. Poser 4.03, using P4 characters, props, textures is still a good 90% solid program. Curious Labs has their own vision of what they want their Poser to be. They based it on months of Customer feedback (Remember the Wishlist link that used to be at the top of every Poser Forum page?), and their own vision of where they want their program to go. It's their program, now. They deserve to follow their own "muse", and if they wanted to make that their priority over cobbling unsatisfactory patches together for MetaCreations creaky old engine, then that's very literally Their Business. They're not a huge corporation with dozens of cash cows raking in funds to support coders fixing problems that only exist because they'd rather rush a product into the stores and make the customer worry about downloading hundreds of perfunctory and imperceptible "fixes" just to maintain the facade they're customer-driven. I appreciate Cl taking the time to develop P5 until it's the product they want to sell. ....Just another 2 cents worth, opposing views expected and encouraged...... Cheers!