I agree that there's far too many posts about what poser5 is going to be able to do or not do, but I'm still hanging around trying to make "heart warming comments" lol thanks lance, & helping the newbies as much as I can. It must be really difficult for the mods right now to decide where these posts should be, should they be in the poser forum or the showcase forum or even poser technical as most questions are of a technical nature. I freely admit I got caught up in the excitement of the impending poser5 release & now that money is changing hands I've calmed down again. I do disagree lance with your comment about us poser5ers laughing at those who are not upgrading straight away, I'm planning to keep poser4 installed & active even after I get poser5 simply so I can keep my poser4 skills alive to help all the newbies who are coming soon with the magazine freebies that are just round the corner. I personally don't hate you lance, why should I? you said nice things about me & others. ps it really depends what level you are when you work in mcdonalds or how many stars you have. Rob