Being a writer/producer/sound designer for more years than I'd like to mention, I have used extreemly high end audio programs myself such as protools, etc with the odd little problem here and there, but so far Poser 5 has been laughable. I'm not talking about a few bugs but a regular cockroach festival. I currently have more than 100 software packages on my primary hard drive. Most run flawlessly. And games. I'll use Warcraft 3 as an example. Its a work of art. How software should run. The odd software I own shows a glitch here and there, but Poser 5 has been a bug bash...for me at least. I have been in contact with so many others that agree but incidently they are afraid to post here because of what happens when you do. I guess I've developed a thick skin over the years. I feel integrity is important so I post my honest feelings. About getting something wonderful from daz..I hope so.. I don't think it could get much worse. They did make Vic, Mike, and Steph and I think you'd agree these are leaps and bounds better than any CL offerings. Off topic circle..what are you doing up sooo late?