I was a beta tester and I can verify that. from what I saw during the beta program, we beta users did not have these problems. there were no known show-stopper bugs in the software when it shipped. Sorry Reise, I have to disagree with you. Though we were on the same beta team (you and I), and are stuck under NDA, I only wished I was fully able to get into specifics or have the ability to properly do a Review on Poser 5 that I would like to for the members that visit our sites. Forunately there are some magazine companies already stating the same facts that people are already hearing in this forum and some of what I'd like to say. At least they weren't bound by an NDA in which to do so. Jack