I ALWAYS remove the normals from my files before uploading them. Just to sum up the whole thing. 1. Poser doesn't use normals. 2. You can remove them by exporting an obj to uv mapper and resaving without normals. This cannot be done in poser. 3. I've heard some people complain about models with no normals because (apparently), in Bryce and some other apps, that information is needed. 4. DAZ specifically ask their vendors to remove all normals before submitting models, to cut down file size. 5. I haven't done extensive checking, but removing the normals generally cuts down the file size by at least 10 - 20%, if not more. It depends a lot on the type of model. I suppose the reason the average poser hobbyist doesn't do this is that a lot of them don't use uv mapper, and those who do maybe don't know about it. Having said all that, I don't know if I'd reccommend it to the average user as a fix-all for big files. Messing about with the Geometries is fine if you know what you're doing, but writing over original files can be tricky, so beware! I do it with things I make myself. I've never done it with the poser .obj files, (mainly because I can't be bothered). mac