Jackson: I might prefer that CL used the Windows API, but that was just as true of P4 as it is of P5. And while I would tend to put that more in the "klunky" category, than the "outdated" category (since the Windows API was always there to be used), my understanding is that historically, this has to do with cross-platform issues. Also, your last msg makes my point. You don't know what, if anything Jack knows about the stiuation. I would submit that if Jack had any inside info, he would be sharing it. Jack has been called many things over the years; "shy" is not one of them. Yet he has presented nothing (and, I note, chosen to disappear from this thread). Again, I agree with some of your complaints, and I think reasonable people can differ over some of the others. But Jack taking a cutesy shot at CL's business plan when he doesn't even know what it was or is, strikes me as cheap. His story "looks" true to you; I already posted a very different version that could be true. I try to base my opinions on evidence; others are free not to, and often do. CyberStretch: "Was P4PP not a separate purchase and gave CL additional cash inflow? Therefore, calling it P4.5 or whatever would not have accomplished much more than what it did." No, if CL had marketed it as P4.5, more people would have bought it, as demonstrated in part by the greater sales of P5 in relation to Pro Pack. Marketing something as an optional add-on simply will not generate the volume of sales you would get marketing it as the new base product. Had CL treated ProPack as P4.5, they could have charged everyone more to upgrade to P5, because the P4PP people had to get a deal since they subsidized the development of a number of the new features in P5. Alternatively, CL could have charged more for people who did not buy P4.5 to upgrade to P5 on the ground that you were really buying 2 upgrades. Plus, the expectation level would not have been as high, because everyone wouldn't have waited as long for the new version of Poser. The product cycle would have looked much more like the regular, incremental upgrading that so many other apps (Photoshop, for example) go through. The only reason I even dipped my toe in the pool of second guessing was to point out that one of the implied theses of Jack's parable -- that CL was eager to put out these other products (at the expense of Poser) "just to make more money" -- is readily disprovable. If CL had treated ProPack as P4.5, Jack's whole analogy falls apart, because then the man isn't neglecting the horse.