Yeah Emily, I'm always hoping that the Kai Krause interfsce concept will die someday.... I don't demand default Windows grey interface, but the KPT/Bryce/Poser 'revolutionary' style of interface is a total pain, always has been. I own Bryce 5 but I can't use it - the interface is so stupid, it makes me furious! Orio - Kupa virtually said as much (about money shortage) in a post some months ago, about how he could hardly afford to buy food - there was no money for salaries. That was about 6-8 weeks before P5 was released. Here in this forum someplace. And what I was hoping for in P5 was NOT fancy new stuff like the Face Room and such, but rather stability, no crosstalk, a good renderer, good lights, decent handling of MATs, smarter pose files, stuff like that. Basic stuff. And really good new characters. Judy is an abortion in my view. In other words, I would have liked to see a Version 4.5..... I would have been happy to pay for it. As it is now, I won't buy P5 until it is reported stable and useful - I can't stand apps that hang and carry on... I've been in the 'puter game for nearly 20 years, I've been there, done that. As an example - I didn't switch to Win2K until this year. I won't touch XP until I HAVE to. Why should I? :] Fish