Polls don't mean they've consulted everyone. I've yet to have a single soul ask me anything for the sake of these polls. I've also been voting for 17 years and I've never seen the death penalty on the ballot.

Compelling arguments but flawed because not everyone is represented.

Polls and surveys are often designed to seek intended results. Many of today's scientific studies are carried out in much the same fashion. A term I like to call tobacco science fits this nicely. As far as polls and surveys, I categorize them mostly as propaganda.

AHA !!! Eureka !!! not everyone is represented...why? Because they all sit around and don't say a damn thing...other than maybe to their wife or husband, or brother-in-law or something. Or they are just too busy following the lemmings...led by the ring n their nose.... Thus why I say stuff. If I and a few others don't say it, where would we be? And I'm talking overall. This includes software, cars, politics, everything. Half the stuff that happens wouldn't if more people took an active part...things would be much different. Or, looking from the other side, maybe more things that people want to happen, would. Even if what I say is incorrect, or maybe a bit off center, the fact I've said it at least fuels the debate...perhaps someone with more knowledge joins the fray, contributes the missing link....isn't that great?? But if we all just sit around and let things happen, where does it all go? I'd rather help direct what happens to me, instead of allowing some business or politician decide what I'm up to. Also, on the polls, I think it would be very easy to weight them the way the pollster wants it to come out. There is so much demographic research done in the U.S..they know exactly what specific people will say, and in which direction politically they lean...they even know if you wipe your butt with your right or left hand... The politicians also like the voting populace low, as it is now...they have most of them voting the way they want...it is much more difficult to control larger masses of people.

Exactomudo Dave-so (please note, rhyme unintentional) Remind me to send you a poem I wrote on this very topic, in which I too am very passionate about. You know, they hated guttenburg. (The powers that were)

information is power...if you use it. I think some history reading is in order for a lot of folk.

No kidding. Many like the path of least resistance which(like Lou Reed says) leads to the garbage heap up there. People are being duped eveyday. There hasn't been a real news story in 50 + years. Minds have been shaped for centuries but utilizing more sophisticated tecnology since the Rockerfeller era. Oh don't get me started Dave. Do you sometimes think that your the ony one that gets it. Supertramp..Crime of the Century..If you've got it listen to it again..they knew too.

Dave, I'm not arguing with you so don't take it that way. I'm just pointing out a different view. I rail against gereral statements where people refer to 'most' or 'all' or 'Americans'.
Even this here: "not everyone is represented...why?
Because they all sit around and don't say a damn thing...other than maybe to their wife or husband, or brother-in-law or something. Or they are just too busy following the lemmings...led by the ring n their nose...." -isn't right. Those not represented are not necessarily sitting on their butts doing nothing. Some are too busy trying to put food on the table in an economy they can't control to do any more than vote.

Even in voting you're screwed.
Take the choices for California Governor. Davis has screwed up enough and Simon is questionable. Voting for other than the two main candidates is like throwing a vote away so the best option is to pick the lesser of the two evils and hope for the best.

I can't control who becomes the next Governor but our school board was so screwed up that when the chance happened, my husband got on it. Now it's better than it has been in 10 years. You do what you can.

Anyway, glad to hear you're staying. Differences of opinion certainly aren't worth leaving.

Hi Kendra...good morning :) I know what you mean...generalization got me in trouble before, even in college :) What maybe hasn't come out in my reasoning to leave this group is the stress I inflict on myself....it does create a certain amount, guess it doesn't have to depending on personality, but it causes me stress for sure. So I figured if I left, that would be one less stimulus I have to deal with. Yes, I could just ignore stuff, but what fun is that ;) I can't help but speak up....things bother me, and I care about them. Sometimes ill-founded crusades, perhaps, but if it tweaks me a certain way, I'm off to the races.... So it really isn't anyone here that has caused me grief...I've been fortunate to not feel the wrath of anyone, (there's that generalization again), well, maybe a little, but folks have been pretty easy on me overall. Perhaps its because I don't slam anyone, just stick to the facts as I know them pretty much, and keep things on an even tone as much as possible.

Rock music, if you can understand the words, tells many truths.

They tell me opera does too but I can't afford an interpreter.

Try gaelic music. :)