I recall a time not so long ago when some people were put off by the fact that some of us were suggesting there may be some problems with this holy grail of a program called Poser 5. As the bug parade continues it kind of proves what we were saying out of the gate.<<< Buy, Lapis, those people still will not acknowledge that. It is still somehow our fault, our "user error," our "lack of knowledge." Granted, they have never, ever been able to explain to me how "user error" or "lack of knowledge" by the user can cause the ongoing C exception parade. And do not even try to state your position on the "public beta testing" AFTER the public release in the "Poser 5 Public Beta Testing Forum." The pirahnas quickly swarm. Oh, well. Gotta run. Animation is finished rendering. Take care and be well. casamerica