Razor42 posted at 6:42 PM Sat, 2 March 2024 - #4482142

The palm does have some bones in Genesis 8 which can give some degree of control. These bones in the palm do mirror pretty closely true human anatomy. The main difference would be in the wrist area or the carpal bones which are a pretty complex series of interconnected points in the wrist. You also need to consider the amount of hidden morphs or (CBM or MCM's) used in something like making a fist in the Genesis series, These help to give the whole hand a more natural look.

When posing feet and hands I generally use a combination of Pose controls and individual bones to achieve the look I am after. Another trick you may consider is turning off or extending the limits on particular bones parameters to give a greater range of movement for those truly flexed poses.

Could the hand and feet be better/more realistic? The answer is definitely yes, but with the caveat that would also add more complexity to realistic posing and further break pose usage between generations of figures.

Aye! I have been trying to get that bone on the pinky end to fold over a touch more. And it seems to break the hand. Which is frustrating for when you are trying to make a hold on something seem realistic. The hands have to be one of the most frustrating things. We have all these amazing hairs, breast that do just about everything including dance the Macarena if you want them to, buttocks that flatten...but we still seem to be stuck on "laura croft paddle hands" from early 2k.

Thank you I am going to go try some of the tips!

IAmNobodySpecial posted at 12:28 PM Tue, 2 January 2024 - #2985365

I just spent the past month+ putting together my two masterpieces for the Holiday contest. I live in a car, so I can only use my computer for 1.5 hour a day (non-rendering) or 20 minutes a day (rendering) before the power is drained. I then either take my Ryobi battery packs to work to charge them (5 days a week only), or I have to find an outdoor plug or coffee shop (spending $$$) somewhere and spend 2+ hours for each of the two battery packs so I can get another 1.5hours/20 minutes on my computer. Otherwise I spend my entire time watching my windshield freeze, and my ankles swelling.

Which is what I did for nearly 36 hours over the Christmas holiday. Sit in my car and do absolutely nothing. No place was open to charge my batteries, and work was closed, It was raining, cold and miserable, and I just sat in my car and stared from midnight to midnight on Christmas day, except for when I would break down and cry and wish I was just finally dead. That is how I spent my 32nd Christmas in a row without a family. The only person who visited me on Christmas was a police officer, who told me I can't be there and had to go somewhere else. Yet he also could not tell me where I could legally go. He never said Merry Christmas.

I had spent $150 on two power inverters to run my laptop computer from my car battery. One disintegrated 3 hours after I began using it, and the other one destroyed my car battery, forcing me to buy another car battery. So that was $300 to get back to where I started.

This is how I put together those contest entries. When it came time to render I rendered for 20 minutes, then canceled the render and closed my laptop so it went to sleep. Hours later after charging my battery paks I could render again and I hit Resume for another 20 minutes. Some renders take a dozen or more hours to complete this way.

And some renders get lost midway when Windows decides to shut down my computer and update.

So the effort involved in creating these contest entries was comparable to the Manhattan Project. And then, to upload them, I had to stand outside in a Minnesota winter holding my laptop in one hand while trying to work that little trackpad with my other frozen hand.

And for all of that effort, both entries were rejected, because they contained "copyrighted material". Only my third entry (a closeup from one of the two,which is awkwardly out of context) was accepted.

The copyrighted material were cigarette packs, like the ones sold at Renderosity ("Marlbaro", "Cowboy Killer", etc). I had put a big bow in front of the names on the cig cartons, so their full names were not visible. Yet they were rejected. For the second one I then removed all cig packs altogether (leaving stupid looking hand poses on every character), and that left me 4 minutes to render my very fuzzy final entry after weeks of work. That was rejected because it displayed a soda can without modification, exactly as I had purchased that content from... Renderosity.

So for all the work I put into those under third world conditions that none of you will ever comprehend, nobody will ever even see them.

Which begs a fair question, I think. If you are not allowed to use Daz Studio to represent the reality of the world we actually live in, then what is anyone using this software for? Most photographs I take have branded products or recognizable shapes and figures somewhere in them. Yet the photo shop prints them for me. They have recognizable real world people in them. Everything I see on TV and the news shows the reality of the world we live in - cereal boxes, blue jeans with logos, automobiles - nearly everything in our environment is a "copyrighted" or trademarked thing. Yet the only place I'm not allowed to represent that reality of the world I live in is with my Daz creations.

Has anyone out there ever actually used Daz and the hundreds or thousands of dollars of content you've purchased to produce... well, ANYTHING that you can actually use for any purpose in the real world? The money I spent on all this was supposed to be one of my tickets out of homelessness. It was to compensate for my utter lack of drawing ability, where I need that to dress up creative projects I'm good at and can sell.. But if I can't even display my renders at the very place where I bought the content, then what in the world do I actually DO with any of this stuff?

I would post this to the Prime forum. But Renderosity doubled the price of Prime, and I can no longer afford it. I had to buy a new car battery instead.

Sorry about your situation. I know it can get incredibly frustrating to be in a situation like that.

With that said, Yes, it gets used for things..allot of things. I use it for my work almost exclusively.
(yes I do it for pay) NO. I no longer post my work in Rendo. I post in three places exclusively. About to open a patreon.
Copyright...has to be protected. We all want our work respected, therefore, we must respect others copyright as well.

Names(brandnames) are protected, and you can use something similar, but not exact


Im surprised people do not understand how much of a useful tool it is. Particular for free. (I dont like its dynamic cloth, but hey, cant have it all)
Its a tool though. Only a tool.

CHMedia posted at 8:55 PM Tue, 12 September 2023 - #4474499

I regret to inform you that this vendor has closed their store. Thank you for reaching out.

...I already saw that. Consequently, why I came to the forums to see if anyone knew anything....

Crystal46 posted at 12:42 PM Thu, 18 May 2023 - #4465700

I know this comment is going to be misunderstood but I am going to say it anyway. This image is something I made after studying AI for about 2 weeks.

I always wanted to be a 3D artist but could never get the hang of 3D.  I have been loving and admiring all of you who can create amazing 3D since 2007 when I joined Renderosity.  Fast forward to 2023, and I can create art that rivals any 3D artist with a few clicks of a mouse because of AI. I realize that AI still has a long go. For example, AI has mastered the human face but still makes horrible hands and extra body parts sometimes on the subject.  With 3D, the artist controls every detail of the image.  With AI, you are at the mercy of the computer.  You have to keep entering prompts over and over until you are satisfied.  Writing good prompts is the skill.  With that said, I love AI because now I can play with you guys on your level.  

Ok I took time to step back before replying to your post specifically.
I understand the desire to post work. Its what drove me to switch from traditional mediums to digital. I wanted so badly to create some really interesting things.

But here is the difference....
You are giving "prompts". -you-...arent doing any of the work.
You are not tweaking out the lights, then adjusting shadows.
You aren't working on getting the reflection and refractions correct.
You aren't learning the different camera settings, the DOF, the angles, focal length, etc.
You aren't working on how the textures work.

Our computers are not doing the work for us, they are doing things we -manually- adjust. We spend YEARS working on learning how to do something, working on how to accomplish a specific effect. We spend years, learning how to texture something, how to get the light right to catch just the edge of a figure, we work years on how to pose a figure so that it doesnt look wooden. We learn about how cloth drapes and hangs. We learn about how best to set up a scene to capture just the right amount of the scene and enough to capture the imagination.

Our computers...do not have a "create art button"....but that is what you are using. You are giving a prompt of(something like) "Studio office, sunny day, glass desk top, day time, reflective surface, city" and the AI ENGINE….is making the scene.

You....didnt.


Some of us here have been studying and working and learning for over 20 years….and you have given a few prompts to an AI engine that did the work.

I know it sounds harsh…as harsh as it's been for many of us for years getting accused of doing what you ARE doing.

None of us, have some magic button in our programs that just POOF makes a picture. Each of us that work in 3d, or digital painting(which most of us do in combination to our 3d work)  work bloody hard to get the results we do. To grow. To improve.  To learn things like anatomy, so we know how an arm is supposed to move or how it will bend when holding something.

(because is rarely is there any pose package that gets tiny, little, tweaks just right for every single instance a pose may be used. Something as simple as how the fingers flex when it comes into contact with a hard surface can change how a pose looks.)


You have no concept of what it is like to spend decades working on a skill, a craft...to see something just do it in seconds with just a few "prompts"....

No, what you are posting, is not the same. It's not YOUR work..it's the AI engine's work.
There is…a difference.

Warlock279 posted at 4:14 PM Thu, 18 May 2023 - #4465724

Crystal46 posted at 12:42 PM Thu, 18 May 2023 - #4465700

I know this comment is going to be misunderstood but I am going to say it anyway. This image is something I made after studying AI for about 2 weeks.

I always wanted to be a 3D artist but could never get the hang of 3D.  I have been loving and admiring all of you who can create amazing 3D since 2007 when I joined Renderosity.  Fast forward to 2023, and I can create art that rivals any 3D artist with a few clicks of a mouse because of AI. I realize that AI still has a long go. For example, AI has mastered the human face but still makes horrible hands and extra body parts sometimes on the subject.  With 3D, the artist controls every detail of the image.  With AI, you are at the mercy of the computer.  You have to keep entering prompts over and over until you are satisfied.  Writing good prompts is the skill.  With that said, I love AI because now I can play with you guys on your level. 

I'll do my best to be polite.

The lighting and overall aesthetic are nice. It would make a solid pre-vis, style guide, or concept image.That said ...

"...mastered the human face..." has it tho? The dude in the grey suit [left side of the picture on the monitor] ... is wearing his face backwards! Backwards! Ooph!

Also peculiar the display doesn't fill the monitor. At first I was willing to pass it off as a "slideshow" type app, but you know what, there's an awful lot of docked icons at the bottom for that.

There are somewhere between, 200 and far-too-many-to-count-keys on that keyboard, thereisnospacebartho.

The left edge of the desktop deteriorates into ... well I'm not even sure, we'll call it a touch of surrealism. The right edge of the desktop is a bit wonky as well. Its a mix of solid and hollow that probably couldn't work in the real world.

The back of the left side of the desk where the drawers meet the wall isn't correct. At the bottom where you have the light and the floor board, that indicates a fairly sizable gap between desk and wall, at the top however, the tightness of the shadow indicates a very narrow gap.

You've got two handles on one drawer on the right side. The drawers on the left side have a clear protrusion from the front face on the left, but are flush at the right edge.

Reflections on the desktop seem alright, except the apple logo, and the black label on the one candle, that reflection clearly isn't correct.

The reflections in the picture on the wall shows a double pillar in the window, but there's only a single pillar. Its reading as "this is supposed to be a reflection, play along please" rather than an actual representation of the "space" its reflecting.

The whole desk in general is pretty odd, there's little to no signs of or way it could possibly have been assembled [short of superglue and will power?].

Reflections on the desktop seem alright, except the apple logo, and the black label on the one candle, that reflection isn't correct. The reflections in the picture on the wall shows a double pillar in the window, but there's only a single pillar. It generally reads as "this is supposed to be a reflection, play along please" rather than an actual representation of the "space" its reflecting.

That candle on the right side is doing all kinds of strange, we'll throw that in the surrealism category.

Some of those flowers are pretty suspect. Left bouquet, there are at least two that are pretty indistinct "swirls".

The chair is missing a leg. That should be a five leg base [based on the positions of the four in the image], and while you could make the argument that the fifth would be [mostly or entirely] occluded by the center post, cause, you'd be right it probably would be, you should still see the caster and its interaction [shadow/reflection] with the floor.

Those are the things that jump out to me at first glance. We'll ignore some of the general amorphous ambiguity of some of the "pictures" in the image and chalk that up to being them "abstract" or visual representations of "lorem ipsum".

"Fast forward to 2023, and I can create art that rivals any 3D artist with a few clicks of a mouse because of AI." Honestly and simply put ... no you can't. I feel like that statement is an over reach at best, as you admit, "... AI still has a long [way to] go." At worse, its borderline demeaning and offensive [I'm sure you didn't intend it as such].

Replacing your arm with an air cannon, doesn't make you a major league pitcher. Personally, I see more merit in what you might consider "a lesser quality image" that someone who is struggling with/learning the process might produce than hitting a "make art button".

If you want to continue down the AI road, and there's nothing wrong with that if that's what makes you happy, I would suggest a bit more effort/focus on post work. At least some of the things I listed, would be pretty minor/easy things to clean up in post, would elevate the image quality significantly, and make it less obviously AI generated.

I am just going to sit in my chair and clap.

Thank you

rokket posted at 9:29 PM Mon, 6 February 2023 - #2977157

I am starting to see a flood of it on DeviantArt. Almost all the images I am seeing (because I don't want to see yet another naked female, so I choose to only look at 3D or painitngs, et al) lately have been AI.

I don't see it as art. With what we do, especially me since I create almost everything the figures are wearing, there is a skill set. With what I used to do, drawing, painting, inking, there is a definite skill set.

But I have messed with some of the AI online sites. A couple of key phrases and a couple of mouse clicks, and you have an image.

Where is the skill in that? Where is the creativity? It's all in the software. There are some incredible images created out of it. Look on DA. There are some that look photo realistic. The uncanny valley has been crossed.

But there is no skill involved. While some might argue that it lets everyone create art, the imagination, the years of perfecting your skill set, or your workflow is not there. You can learn to manipulate the software in a matter of minutes.

If I am wrong, tell me.

But it's like the old musician's argument that a DJ is not a musician. AI manipulation is not art.

HO-boy.

I tried "Mid-journey"(my gods do not let that thing into your discord) and it was fun. I used prompts such as "water lilies in gold" or "Geisha and water lilies" and it was abit of fun.
Thought, ok, this is just something to play with. I didn't give it much thought. AI wasn't bad at the time(this was less than a year ago)

Now...
I open DA and that is almost all I see. It can be beautiful, I will give it that. Even if it hits the "Uncanny valley" aspect of the mind. But...
I can't say it is art. And the law doesn't either. If a person uses a prompt to create something out of one of these engines, unless they use it as a background, etc, is not copyright'able as it is not created by a human. There is a lawyer on Youtube that goes into detail on this.
That aside, I see it being very hard to keep up with it. As an artist, its going to make it difficult.

It harvests our work(and Adobe is helping it) and poof! Artists...are outworked.
Also, DA has been sued already for this by three artists. I cant remember if it is still in court or not. But DA helping AI has already been flagged an issue.

But as it has been said above, if it is trained to steal work...its not wholly AI.

Oh and fyi, there are companies advertising on LinkedIN to “harvest” data and images for AI.

Our time as artists...may be in the sunset years.

dbwalton posted at 9:31 PM Sun, 21 May 2023 - #4466087

DarkElegance posted at 4:32 PM Tue, 16 May 2023 - #2979496

Hi

I saw this product promo but cant find the listing in the description for what hair was used. Its the one in the first thumbnail with the beads adn rings on the side.

Thanks in advance if anyone knows the name!

https://www.renderosity.com/marketplace/products/128198

Have you tried asking the vendor???

btw. they dont remember.

TwiztidKidd posted at 9:39 PM Thu, 18 May 2023 - #4465750

That looks a lot like Bronwyn Hair by AprilYSH sold at Daz (the same as in the 7th thumbnail too) but it doesn't come combined with any of the hair beads or any other props pictured in the promo pic.

Hope this helps. Happy Friday!

Thanks! I did look at the hair you mentioned but it seems to lack the braids and rings. I appreciate the help! (as now I have a new hair on my wishlist!)

TwiztidKidd posted at 1:14 AM Thu, 13 April 2023 - #4461996

The past three years felt like a neverending Monday lol A Groundhog Day Monday!!

Mom says: "If you want to look younger, hang out with older people" LOL!

Sounds like good advice! And yes, groundhog day would cover the last three years. Then it all seemed to halfway go away and its like surreal when you see the streets full again etc. You wonder if it was all a dream?

HartyBart posted at 6:30 PM Wed, 12 April 2023 - #4461964

I recalled that FoRender has a number of exact copies of Star Wars figures, for G8. For fan-art only, of course. Jaba, Yoda, even wookies. But looking through the list, there appear to be no Twi'lek there. 

There's a "Twi'lek for Genesis 8 Females" at RenderHub, and "Lekkulian 2 for Genesis 8 Female" at the DAZ Store, which are the closest I can find at stores.

I also found a free "Twi'lek for Genesis 2 Female" at ShareCG, based on the Creature Creator Add-on pack. G2 would mean she could be imported to Poser 11 with DSON. No skin textures, though. This was later ported by the maker to "Twi'lek for Genesis 8 Female" (Jan 2022), Crimsonight at DeviantArt, with a new better ear morph. This G8 version is free on Gumroad for download. It may be what you want.

There is also a free Aiko 4 / Poser .PP2 morph at DeviantArt, "Twi'lek Headpeice".

Brilliant! I had seen the daz thing but, that doesnt look like the lekku for twi'lek. I will check out renderhub and gumroad! again Thanks!

TwiztidKidd posted at 12:38 AM Wed, 12 April 2023 - #4461879

DarkElegance posted at 11:47 PM Tue, 11 April 2023 - #4461877

but time has a way of getting away from you

Like a squirrel... where did it go? lol

Looking forward to see more of your artwork. Love the style. I would just add new images to the existing gallery. No reason to try to change the past artwork really, just focus on creating new art. Keep up the fantastic work.

Rick (the P is silent lol)

You blink and suddenly ten years are gone and you have no idea how or why it went so fast. Lol. Or at least the past three years.

RHaseltine posted at 2:55 PM Wed, 12 April 2023 - #4461939

Have you checked RawArt's store?

I just checked, there seems to be three items in his store and none are lekku

TwiztidKidd posted at 10:58 PM Tue, 11 April 2023 - #4461875

Where do I know you from? cuz I feel like I do when I looked at your gallery which is amazing BTW... From Renderosity chat room? the one they once had... ages ago... in a galaxy far far away lol

I use to be on here allot posting. But it was, as you say, in a galaxy far, far away. I would say roughly ten years? (it so didn't seem that long, but time has a way of getting away from you)

Not sure if you would know me from any place else.

TwiztidKidd posted at 10:27 PM Tue, 11 April 2023 - #4461867

Hey, just curious... are you doing this because you don't want A.I. to harvest the artwork within your gallery? It's a little bit too late for doing that!! A.I. sites like MidJourney, etc. already created a database of art images WITHOUT asking for permission from the owners and they're already making millions of dollars in membership fees, selling GPU time to make recycled images from actual art... and I'm pretty sure they've got Renderosity covered already.

Hi, Nah I know midjourney and all that has done the harvesting already.
(as annoying as that is..)
It's more because of the age of the works and quality. While its nice to go back and look, I kind of want to archive it and restart a public gallery.
One reason is (as insane as it is) there is two or three images that still get brought up to me as stolen. In order to do a "take down request" you have to have it on a site to date it. On DA, you can do that even with the images being archived. I was hoping there was a way to do it here.
Thanks for the help though. It is greatly appreciated.

SpookieLilOne posted at 5:55 PM Thu, 19 January 2023 - #4454256

Tada

MRL Hedera Bane by Mihrelle

Yup that was the one! to bad it is not available. I wonder if there is any for g8