well, it's funny you should say that :] i purchased that from amazon ages ago, i just couldn't really be that bothered to read it. there was too much in the way of boring explainations (spelling?) for my liking. I guess some of it might be handy.. it's a bit heavy to pick up mind

ahhh, cunning :] shame about the decimal though (yes, that's it, blame it on the little dot)

I see what you mean - both redneck and yourself, shadow - about the attributes box. It'll take some getting used to though... just out of interest, what's special about 20.48? Why create everything in such a random size? I assume that it's got something to do with the grid size? Anyway.. yeah, i've used unrealed a fair bit, but mainly worked with qoole and editors based on the quake engine, which in many ways is far more like bryce than unrealed is... with that you have to cut away from your world, but with both bryce and quake based mapping, you just seem to add "brushes" into the world (again, not the correct term, i'm sure) what would be really nice would be if there was a way to display your world in bryce in a 4 window layout, so as you could see 3d, top, front and side views all at once - is there perhaps a plugin of some sort that can enable this? as you said, a converter would be very useful. when i first started using bryce I spent a long time trying to get unreadED files into bryce, because the stair tool for unreal is really nice (or i think so anyway), but after a month of searching I gave up... i wonder if it's possible to convert bsp files into bryce, i've not tried, but i shouldn't think it'd be overly easy. thanks for your help, it's going to take me a while to stop thinking of everything in terms of squares and grid units i'm afraid. still, it seems a bit odd that there's not easy way to have a grid overlay in bryce, and one that you can edit the size of. anyway, back to playing, if i'm lucky i'll learn. Paul

wow, thanks very much for that link, ICM, i wasn't even aware that you could have solid openGL rendering, that's really useful and aldaron... how stupid of me yet again, i should've seen that set of tools, "rtfm" springs to mind, i dare say thanks once more, Paul

ahh! flooded with replies and i've only just said thankyou to the first generous helper. thankyou to all, erlik has answered my question about the grid snap, and zhann, the A scared me, i just ignored it :) thanks again to everyone.. i think i'll go play with my objects now, paul

thank you, jen, for a very speedy response to my question. how stupid of me not to see the zoom tools, i'll pretend that they weren't there in bryce4, eh? one more question, to you or anybody else.. is there an easy snap to grip option? and if so, how do you alter the snap size? thanks again, Paul