Mike, Thanks for your input. You pretty much confirmed my suspicions. One reason that I like Moray is that it is inegrated with POVRAY. POVRAY is an underrated renderer in my opinion. A couple more follow-ups: I assume from looking at your gallery that Vue 4 is your choice of renderers? (Nice pics! I put a comment on one of them) I assume from your mention of NURBS that you are partial to Rhino? If you are looking for Photorealistic interior scenes, Lightscape is by far the best renderer out there. It is customized for interior and architectural renderings, but the renders are mind-boggling. It is over $700 for the commmercial version, but I saw a student version for around $140

I agree. I think that POVRAY (and MORAY) are great applications by themselves, but also provide a great learning/testing ground for people (like me) who eventually want to use a commercial app. Once you learn POVRAY (I haven't!!!) your 3D fundamentals are SOLID.

From what I have seen and heard on the forums (fora?), Vue d'Esprit is very competitive to Bryce in almost all aspects, with the biggest advantages being render speed, vegetation and price. I am thisclose to getting Vue! For what it's worth, Rhino and Truespace look like excellent modelers. Truespace is also an excellent renderer. I have Terragen and POVRAY (both free). Terragen is easy and photorealistic, but lacks flexibility. POVRAY is much harder (you have to code everything) but infinitely flexible.