As a person who already renders poser figures in a high-end open GL, batch processing true radiosity capable programthat opens Pz3 directly,it occurs to me that I have NO need for Daz studio. Just wondering how many users here already have viable alternative render solutions (Carrara,vue etc)??

My website

YouTube Channel

Do you rig your figures in Cinema or LW?

I don't see why the market is limited to those who don't have/use another renderer. Think of everything you actually do inside Poser. Eventually, hopefully, you'll be able to do the same in D/S.

I don't have another renderer. At the moment I'm using P4PP and the posts about the problems with P5 put me right off even considering it. I really don't want to get into all the issues involved with using Poser content inside another application, I just want something that will give me good results with the minimum of headaches. I'm hoping DAZ studio will eventually provide the functionality of P4 and a relatively straightforward upgrade path to give the features found in upmarket renderers. Improved file handling and better lighting/rendering facilities are what I'm hoping for.

Coppula eam se non posit acceptera jocularum.

My Store

My Gallery

I have Poser4, Poser5, Vue4 and Bryce4. I really have no use for Daz/Studio.

Depends what it does, how well. I use both Painter and PS, and have had other (cheapo) editors in the past. I bought Illustrator as part of the bundle when I got PS and quickly came to prefer it to Freehand, though I still use the latter for some things. For that matter, I have Vue but still buy many of the RDNA MicroCosm packs. There are many reasons for using two or more similar applications, and for switching, so until we see what D|S amounts to, and what the plugins do and how, assessing its place in the market seems premature. With luck we will fairly soon be able to form our first impressions.

My own thoughts kind of ramble along these lines - Poser 4 - old technology and old code, a 'fat' program, no resource management; Poser 5 - new technology and code added on top of old technology and code, nice 'ideas' for materials and hair, etc, but poorly executed in the extreme; Daz Studio - written from the ground up, resource management, etc. Is it gonna be the best thing since sliced bread? Dunno, but it's worth a peek. One of the major reason that MS Word even got their toe in the door of the Word Processing world (for better or for worse) is that the first Windows version of WordPerfect (who had over 85% of the market share at that time) was the most awful port of a DOS program to Windows ever seen and did not integrate well with Windows-based apps. Vis-a-Vis Poser and Daz Studio, it could be "deja vu all over again". Same door, different toe :) -Nancy.

wolf359,

Have you considered that you might be able to make minor changes to your scene and then render it to check it out without the need to switch programs? ;=?

If you are like me and do alot of test renders, it could save you alot of time, no?

Just a thought. ;=]

cheers,
dr geep
;=]

Remember ... "With Poser, all things are possible, and poseable!"

cheers,

dr geep ... :o]

edited 10/5/2019

geep, but can you save to a PZ3 so you can have a painless import into Vue?

I have Vue and Cararra but still look forward to DS because I want a program that does what Poser does only better, faster, and more efficiently. I have MUCH for faith in DAZ giving me that than CL.

Nothing wrong with having another tool handy. I have Poser 4, Poser 5 (never installed it after reading about all the problems), Vue, Bryce 4 & 5, Mojoworld. I use the Poser + Vue combination about 95% of the time. But if DAZ Studio has good resource management and file handling, I see no reason why I wouldn't give it a whirl.

Sgiathalaich

"never installed it after reading about all the problems" Well since they fixed the bugs, why don't you try installing it and downloading the patch so you can see how well it works.

My idea: 1/ taking into account the quality of their V3 etc products, and knowing how many, many meshes (figures, props) there are in my Poser5 that I will never ever use and hoping DazStudio will be empty and ready to host V3 etc ; 2/in the knowledge that OpenGL has got nothing to do whatsoever with rendering (the task of the processor) but with fast redraw of the working space/meshes while you are working, and is implemented in DazStudio but not in Poser5, I will most certainly download it and evt even buy it if Daz are so clever as to make it available online on their site. And if the price is reasonable. And I do have C4D8 with AdvancedRenderer and Bodypaint2. Which I will use for final renders.

I have tried prudent planning long enough. From now I'll be mad. (Rumi)

The response 'I have no use for DAZ|Studio' is a bit misleading. I'm sure a lot of people imagine they have no use for D|S, but the question is 'Will they get it anyway because it's free?' And having got it, (assuming the bloody thing works), will they perhaps decide that it's worth getting a module or two 'just to try'. You see, a new app may not interest a certain sector of poser users... but a new FREE app might just be a different story. That aside, I practically NEVER render anything, other than test renders. But I'm keen to see D|S, because I have a fair idea that rendering is going to be the least of it's capabilities. If, just for starters, it's a windows-based interface that runs poser figures without crashing, I'm already happy. Add to that the fact that rendering (for me) is about 1% of my poser activities, and I can see a lot of possibilites on the horizon. I'm not 'Utah Dreaming' yet. Just interested in competition from a trustworthy source. mac

I'm a Mac user. I have both Vue & Bryce, Photoshop & Painter... you just never know. Each tool has its own 'specialty' if you will. I only use Poser 4 right now. I'm hoping that Daz will give a clean decently sized program with modern technology and look forward to the openGL etc. I do a ton of test renders and they're godawful slow. If I can preview things realtime, that's enough for me to buy Studio. :D And I don't usually feel the need to render elsewhere. The image will probably be postworked, so it's no loss.

Calypso Dreams... My Art- http://www.calypso-dreams.com

Renderosity Gallery

PS The mere fact that it has an Open GL preview that shows transmaps is a major step up from poser. mac

Read there page on DAZ/Studio. Only the Beta will be free, once they go to 1.0 you'll have to pay for that.

I have poser 1/2/3/4/5 Vue4 & Bryce5 but I still want D/S, there's no such thing as too many renderers ;)

'Only the Beta will be free' Yep. But the beta will render and save, so at least we get to try it without selling a kidney. And if a (for example) D|S to Bryce plug-in costs $20, how useful would that be to many people? So the deal is, try it free. You get to keep it. When the plug-in you want comes out, weigh up the cost/benefits and decide. That's the advantage of modularity. mac

I frequently export Poser figures, props, and scenes to Vue d'Esprit, but can't wait to be able to try the same in D/S. Variety is a good thing, and although I wouldn't know, I'm guessing that the price of a reasonably robust version of Studio will be roughly in the Vue/Poser range, rather than with the much more expensive apps, so to my mind it will be worth it to have another tool handy.

More tools in the tool box couldn't possibly be a bad thing. I eagerly await D|S's release.

Ditto Maclean. When I use Poser for serious purposes, it's always to create an animation that shows things clearly, not beautifully. Rendering ability is absolutely unimportant; easy modifications of placement and movement are critical. If the core of D|S is faster and easier to handle, I'll switch in a millisecond.

My python page
My ShareCG freebies

"Do you rig your figures in Cinema or LW?" NO I animate in poser and import the animated figure Via the propack plugin, a thorough previsualization in poser prevents me from having to make changes after the PZ3 is imported into C4DXL. In Cinema I have acess to open GL previews,batch rendering SLA procedural textures ,particle and liquid simulation,UNLIMITED UNDO'S explosion effects, removal of unused textures a world class polygon modeling modeling toolset with hypernurbs unlimited number of cameras,lights and of course GI and radosity I can also do region render as in drawing a marquee on any portion of the scene and just rendering that portion.. SO overall I personally dont need DAZ studio.

My website

YouTube Channel

sirkrite... "Read there page on DAZ/Studio. Only the Beta will be free, once they go to 1.0 you'll have to pay for that." Where on the DAZ Studio page does it say that?

"Prior to the release of DAZ|Studio 1.0, the base version will be made available as a free beta for an undetermined period of time until it is solid." Why cooler, it's right on the top of the page. Need new glasses?

I agree 100% with Dr. Geep, lets say you wanted to do a render like the above, using my little mirror, which happens to have dials to adjust the angle of the wing mirrors. As the reflections don't show in Poser 4, and Poser 5 takes a rather long tome to do a low-res raytraced render, DAZ Studio might be a real time saver. It took me about 6-10 tried to get this exactly right, BTW. Bryce and other rendering-only engines need not apply for this job! I'm under the impression that DAZ Studio's basic package is going to be free forever, I think there was talk about selling advanved versions, though. That is how I remember it, anyway.

sirkrite, Sorry but I still don't see anywhere on the page where DAZ states there will be a charge for DAZ Studio 1.0. Perhaps the problem isn't in the strength of my prescription glasses, but rather one of your faulty interpretation.

bookmark

And it doesn't say anywhere that they are giving the 1.0 away for free. Just the beta until it is solid.

Attached Link: http://www.daz3d.com

Though DAZ|Studio will not end world hunger, nor cure any form of cancer, (as far as I'm aware) it will definitely be free. How long it remains free will be decided by our customers. As long as the support of DAZ content continues to grow, then DAZ|Studio will continue to grow (for free) as well. We would like to keep the base app available for free as long as is possible. Of course there will be certain add-on modules released apart from the base that will most likely not be for free. However, we hope that the ability to pick and choose which enhancements a customer buys will be seen as an advantage. There are many items that one user will desire that another may not. Why be forced to pay more for items you don't want?

Another reason for DAZ|Studio being a positive addition to the market is that not everyone has the money for higher priced app's, like Cinema4D as Wolf359 apparently did. ;) It is true that the Poser market continues to keep it's price bubble from bursting into the prices of most of 3D content markets, and we at DAZ want to do our part to make our content accessible to as many people as possible.

Boy, all this talk about Studio which doesn't even have a public release date yet. We do hope that you all will be happy with it once it does arrive, but please keep in mind how simple the initial releases will be and that it will take many months for the additional plugins and modules that many of you hope will be available within weeks of the core app. Consider this your fair warning that though we have some cool things in store for the beta release, everything on our information page is accurate and unfortunately the "Make Great Art" button didn't make that list last I checked. :p

Take care,

Steve Kondris
DAZ Productions, Inc.

Steve and/or Dan have said here that the base will continue to be free as long as the plugins sell well enough to cover costs (and I'd expect they might even absorb small losses for the sake of brand promotion, since models are their mainstay - but that isn't supported by evidence).

Cross-posted with Steve.

Glad you cleared that up Steve. :) The way the page is worded appears that it would only be free until it went to 1.0. "unfortunately the "Make Great Art" button didn't make that list last I checked. :p" LOL! That will cost you! That's what most of them were looking for. ;D

thank you Steve for the heads up for the ppl here. I to saw that line about the beta being free blah blah, but decided to wait until you or someone from Daz wanted to clarify the questions. as for do we need D/S? some will some won't. those that do, will use. those that don't, won't. I don't need 3dMax. so I don't use it.. simple huh? Kai

Thanks for the clarity, Steve. Much appreciated! It's not easy, but I for one promise to be patient. :-)

I'll be patient, too ...
(but, I really want it now)
;=]

Remember ... "With Poser, all things are possible, and poseable!"

cheers,

dr geep ... :o]

edited 10/5/2019

I wanted it yesterday

---

---

Software: Daz Studio 4.15,  Photoshop CC, Zbrush 2022, Blender 3.3, Silo 2.3, Filter Forge 4. Marvelous Designer 7

Hardware: self built Intel Core i7 8086K, 64GB RAM,  RTX 3090 .

"If you spend too much time arguing about software, you're spending too little time creating art!" ~ SomeSmartAss

"A critic is a legless man who teaches running." ~ Channing Pollock

My Gallery  My Other Gallery 

"I wanted it yesterday" More patience, Grasshopper. I wanted the f***ing thing 6 months ago. :)

Coppula eam se non posit acceptera jocularum.

My Store

My Gallery

Oh YEAH!
Well I wanted it 8 months ago.
;=]

Remember ... "With Poser, all things are possible, and poseable!"

cheers,

dr geep ... :o]

edited 10/5/2019

I wanted it when it was just a twinkle in DAZ's eye. So there! mac

I wanted it before computers were invented. :P

Coppula eam se non posit acceptera jocularum.

My Store

My Gallery

Stone carvings ..................... anyone? ;=]

Remember ... "With Poser, all things are possible, and poseable!"

cheers,

dr geep ... :o]

edited 10/5/2019

I wanted it before the Big Bang. ;)

Calypso Dreams... My Art- http://www.calypso-dreams.com

Renderosity Gallery

I wanted it B4 the Big Bang's .......... fuze was lit! ;=] Actually, I only wanted it before time was invented. BTW - Does anyone know why time WAS invented???

Remember ... "With Poser, all things are possible, and poseable!"

cheers,

dr geep ... :o]

edited 10/5/2019

'Does anyone know why time WAS invented???' Oh, that's an easy one. To make sure women are late for everything. mac

Uh oh, I'm not gonna touch that one even with a 10.5PNU pole, ;=]

Remember ... "With Poser, all things are possible, and poseable!"

cheers,

dr geep ... :o]

edited 10/5/2019

Uh oh, I see a locked thread... in the future ;D

---

---

Software: Daz Studio 4.15,  Photoshop CC, Zbrush 2022, Blender 3.3, Silo 2.3, Filter Forge 4. Marvelous Designer 7

Hardware: self built Intel Core i7 8086K, 64GB RAM,  RTX 3090 .

"If you spend too much time arguing about software, you're spending too little time creating art!" ~ SomeSmartAss

"A critic is a legless man who teaches running." ~ Channing Pollock

My Gallery  My Other Gallery 

Now where, per chance, could that be? ;=]

Remember ... "With Poser, all things are possible, and poseable!"

cheers,

dr geep ... :o]

edited 10/5/2019

Locked thread? Wheeeeee! Hello mom! :D

Coppula eam se non posit acceptera jocularum.

My Store

My Gallery

"Another reason for DAZ|Studio being a positive addition to the market is that not everyone has the money for higher priced app's, like Cinema4D as Wolf359 apparently did. ;) It is true that the Poser market continues to keep it's price bubble from bursting into the prices of most of 3D content markets, and we at DAZ want to do our part to make our content accessible to as many people as possible." Well if you accept that the great majority of poser users will Download the free D/S basic pose figures and render still images then wheres the market for the paid version??? I ask because I spend alot of time in professional web forums for lightwave and cinema4DXl and those people want NOTHING to do with PZ3's or millenium figures for animation etc. and as far as us "12 animators" who animate in poser and render in C4D,LW or MAX, our next generation of plugins for poser import will ikely come from Reiss studio so if and when the $$paid version$$DAZ studio has Lightwave and MAX export why will we need to buy it??? I understand that Daz studio will provide an outlet to sell DAZ content but i really fail to see any Market potential for GROWTH OUTSIDE the existing base of poser users who already buy DAZ content.

My website

YouTube Channel

It may not attract existing high end application users, but it probabley will attract people who may not have thought about trying 3D art in the past because it is so costly. What it will do is attract more and more people to expand into 3D art. That's the whole point of it being "Tellware". It's a great marketing strategy. I, an existing Poser user, create a 3D image with a free application, that has the same attributes as an image created with a high end application. I am so excited about this program, that I tell everyone about it...and the best part as far as everyone is concerned? It's FREE! This makes 3D a more attractive medium because it is easily accessable to everyone. There will be some folks who don't care for it, but there will, hopefully, be even more that do. Getting your 3D feet wet with a free app is much more appealing than shelling out several hundred dollars just to see if you like it. If they do like it, they may want to improve their skills, or try new effects that would be available as plugins. It also takes a bite out of the learning curve to be able to purchase and learn one module at a time. It may also have a more user friendly interface. I'm REALLY hoping for that. I'm very intrigued by the realtime previews. I have Bryce 5. I bought it because I loved the images I saw created with it. I could see what kind of quality was possible. I hardly ever use it. I think I've created 2 images with it in the past 2 years. Why? Because I can't work blind. I need to be able to see what I am doing. You can't do that in Bryce OR Vue. AFAIK, you can't do that in most 3D applications. Can you do that in the high end apps? Can you see the results of your work as you do it?

"Well if you accept that the great majority of poser users will Download the free D/S basic pose figures and render still images then wheres the market for the paid version???" Depends - (and this is all wishful speculation here): What if the plugins could be in-product posing thingies for other renderers (like Vue ferinstance), so that once you import a .pz3 file into the other proggie, you could adjust mesh figures on-the-fly within that proggie? I'd dearly pay for one that does that in Vue, or in Maya (without having to rig a biped first like you normally would in Maya/3DS/LW...) Or, say that a plugin does dynamics on both hair and cloth at the same time on ALL figures in a scene (based on weights assigned to those elements), so that all you have to do is get a scene ready, assign each item a given weight or rigidity factor, then let the plugin do it's magic? I know for fact that such plugins in the big proggies will cost you a TON of cash and still need tweaking occasionally. You could also have a plugin that applies gravity the same way, a plugin that does these things but spreads them out across animation frames, a plugin that does advanced animation tricks, a plugin that blends Mimic in on-the-fly, a plugin that will turn ordinary Poser clothing into deformable cloth, a plugin that creates and deforms flowing water, a weather plugin that lets you insert volumetric rain/snow/tornadoes/whatever, or how about a plugin that converts one skin texture onto another without tweaking an external proggie all day long? Hell - the possibilities are endless. I'm fairly sure that while a lot of folks will be fine and happy with the base package, there are just too many possibilities out there for code-monkeys to create plugins that folks will actually want. Given the open nature of the API's and the standards being adhered to, folks outside of DAZ could easily build stuff and sell it, too. Once folks begin whomping out some of the plugins that I'd mentioned, it will get the attention of folks both in the hobbyist world who want to give their art a little more oomph, and actual high-end artists who always look for a shortcut that saves them time and money. /P

It's been my experience that a lot of "professional" artists make use of the cheaper tools, and just use a better rendering engine (such as a Renderman compliant one) in order to attain great results for a low price tag. I've even seen some of the artists use poser models in other applications, those would never in a million years fess up to the fact that they are taken from Poser. Yet, quietly still, they use the program, and the models that are both provided with it or available through stores such as DAZ.

Well, I suspect the base program is just that. A base. I wouldn't be surprised (nor miffed) if a posing module was separate.

Some interesting Quotes from DAZ: "The good news is that all these work-arounds will go the way of the Dodo once DAZ|Studio is released. There will be no need to use MAT pose files as you will be able to very quickly and easily load and replace materials to whichever body parts you like all in one single operation contained nicely within the interface. The INJ/REM system will also slip away into the past, as D|S's smart asset managers will intelligently keep only needed assets loaded into memory, etc." "P.S. Just to clarify about the Free basis of DAZ|Studio. The beta will be released for free, AND all future versions of the base application will continue to be released free, so long as the support for DAZ Content grows along with DAZ|Studio. We plan to keep DAZ|Studio free for as long as possible. How long that goes on for will be decided by our customers. Thanks for listening, Steve Kondris DAZ Productions, Inc."

My website

YouTube Channel

Well, this "wireless phone business" approach is not bad for business. New contents are release more often than the application itself. Daz made it's money from content, not from the application. I used to be in the cellphone business. You give away a phone and let the customer sign up for a year. You know you are getting a monthly residual. That's how you stay in business. Daz approach to this is not novel, but surely interesting and who knows, it might work. Look at their Platinum Club approach, althought not similar, but it sure kept a lot of customers coming back for more.

---

---

Software: Daz Studio 4.15,  Photoshop CC, Zbrush 2022, Blender 3.3, Silo 2.3, Filter Forge 4. Marvelous Designer 7

Hardware: self built Intel Core i7 8086K, 64GB RAM,  RTX 3090 .

"If you spend too much time arguing about software, you're spending too little time creating art!" ~ SomeSmartAss

"A critic is a legless man who teaches running." ~ Channing Pollock

My Gallery  My Other Gallery 

"...it probabley will attract people who may not have thought about trying 3D art in the past because it is so costly." Just ocurred to me... If they want these new people, are they going to provide any content with the free base? The lure of free will pale for new users if they have to buy Vicky just to try the program. There are plenty of free props, clothing etc. but not very many completely free human figures - Maya Doll is the only one that comes to mind immediately.

"Democracy is a pathetic belief in the collective wisdom of individual ignorance." - H. L. Mencken

Beyondbent provides free 3D models also, though not entirely human-based... or even biped...

Anyone else thought that D/S might not just be aimed at us Poser users? Why would Daz limit themselves to one group of people when the renderer is possibly going to rival those included in the "high end" modelling software. Could there be a joining of forces with Zygote somewhere in the future? yes I know Daz used to be part of Zygote but they're still around making their own (high priced) models for the big boys toys.

trust me all the" big boys" who Dont hang here at rosity HATE the whole concept of pre rigged figures that everbody else uses and they already have all the open GL textured Previews, etc as well as highend modeling effects and animation So I honestly dont see any Market for the $paid$ version of DAZ studio in the hardcore Lightwave,MAX C4D userbase.

My website

YouTube Channel

Maybe not...who knows. It depends ultimately on what D|S has to offer in the long run. I can definitely see a market being created amongst other graphic artists who had not previously considered 3D.

From the D|S FAQ page - 'Items included in the initial stage of the DAZ|Studio Beta Program: DAZ|Studio specific file format' So.... although D|S can load pz3 files from both Poser 4 and 5, it will also have a native file format. Anyone want to take bets on what that will lead to? As someone pointed out above, the base is just that - a base. Everyone seems to assume that DAZ are setting out to replicate Poser in modular form. I doubt it. To me, it looks more like a long-term stategy that could incorporate future meshes, formats and plug-ins over the next 10 or 20 years. And with 3rd-party participation, that could lead to some interesting events. mac PS Locked thread? Can't we even make jokes any more?

Re 'the big boys' - I could care less what the 'big boys' do or don't do. If they want to blow their salaries at TurboSquid, let 'em. Anyway, the only reason these people can class themselves as 'big boys' is that they pass the costs on to the client, who wouldn't know a morph target from a bar of soap. mac

" trust me all the" big boys" who Dont hang here at rosity HATE the whole concept of pre rigged figures that everbody else uses and they already have all the open GL textured Previews, etc as well as highend modeling effects and animation " Sure, most of them say they do... However, when the deadline looms, and the project ain't quite on track (a pretty common condition), most of them DO turn to pre-rigged figures. I've seen Poser stuff running on television (and not just Dork) - sure they were rendered in something else (3DS, Maya, whatever), but the mesh is almost instantly recognizable to those who use it a lot. This isn't just Poser stuff, either... Vue d' Esprit, Bryce, you name it - stuff that most of the so-called "big boys" turn their noses up at on the web forums - has a very nasty habit of finding its way into their work, especially if it's just a short job, like TV ads or (as a real life example) the lead-in animation to the History Channel's "Boy's Toys" series from last year. I've seen Bryce and Vue crop up very frequently on the Discovery Channel and Science Channel, since documentaries are notorious for not paying anything near as much for a CG job as the movie houses do. Poser and such reminds me of CG Art's equivalent of a whorehouse or casino: The prominent big-shot citizens will denounce it in long and loud speeches on the Sunday pulpit, yet they'll still show up the next Saturday night, with lust in their hearts and cash at the ready. ;) /P

Heh. You're bad, Pengy. Accurate, but bad.

you know what gets me? why are we having this discussion in the first place? so wolf, you won't use it. others will. if others do, there's a market for it. the universe ain't just users that have Max, Maya, Cinema etc.. there are some of us that welcome an alternative to Poser. and with the competition, who knows. maybe CL will get their act together and actually deliever on promises that they have made with their software? I for one can't use Poser 5. yet other games and apps work AOK that need far more in the way of hardware and resources. examples such as trueSpace, Tron 2.0 (hell that taxes a machine to it's limits on high mode lol), etc. so I know it's not my machine thats at fault before anyone says it is.. there's no excuse for the 'pot luck' approach of 'will it run ok on my machine or not' with a modern biz. I wish Daz a lot of luck with D/S but I know for certain.. free or not, soon as 1 bug, just 1 bug is found, there will be a witchhunt from some users on Daz accusing them of bad coding etc. they won't bother about the Beta status or it being free.. they will holler and look for attention. the world we live in is sad, but thats the way it is. Kai

"As a person who already renders poser figures in a high-end open GL, batch processing true radiosity capable programthat opens Pz3 directly,it occurs to me that I have NO need for Daz studio." "...I animate in poser and import the animated figure Via the propack plugin, a thorough previsualization in poser prevents me from having to make changes after the PZ3 is imported into C4DXL." So if DAZ Studio allowed you to do the same thing that Poser does for you now but was faster (perhaps because of OpenGL previews) and possibly worked better, you wouldn't have any use for it? I'm afraid I don't quite understand. If you were able to pick up a program and just the plug-ins you actually need to do what you do now but be able to do it faster, cheaper and better, why wouldn't you want it? Surely the desire to save time and money isn't just a low-end objective? ;-) At the very, very least, I find the idea of being able to see how transmapped hair is going to look without having to render it would be an incredible time-saver. I will be using it, from the get-go. How long it takes, if ever, to replace Poser in my toolbox, I have no idea, but stating that you "have NO need" for an unreleased product without actually knowing if can help your workflow seems, at the very least, incredibly short-sighted. To answer your actual question ("how many users here already have viable alternative render solutions") I use Lightwave with the Greenbriar plug-ins; I'm looking forward to DAZ Studio helping me work faster and, hopefully, with fewer bugs than with Poser 5 for MacOSX. I'm also looking forward to DAZ Studio releases and updates for the Mac showing up in the same year as the Wintel versions. ;-) -- Walt Sterdan, Freelance

"I use Lightwave with the Greenbriar plug-ins; I'm looking forward to DAZ Studio helping me work faster and, hopefully, with fewer bugs than with Poser 5 for MacOSX" Hi Walt I have read the documentation on Greenbriar the website but i cant seem to get any in-depth reviews or sample render of the plugin from actual users. Do you know of any online examples of character animation renderd in Lightwave or cinema with the Greenbriar plugins?? thanks.

My website

YouTube Channel

I don't know of anything online with the exception of the still and animation samples on the Greenbriar site. I don't have Animation Loader yet (working with mainly stills at the moment) but the Lightwave versions of CR2 Loader and CR2 Rigger have worked flawlessly for me (so far... knock wood). Any CR2 I've loaded has come in as advertised, with endomorphs intact. If there's anything specific you'd like me to test, let me know privately and, time permitting, I'll give it a try. You might contact the author as well with any specific questions, especially regarding the C4D versions; he's been very responsive (two free updates since my initial purchase) and I'm a satsified customer. -- Walt Sterdan, Freelance

Maclean has a good point about not thinking in terms that are too Posercentric. There's no telling what Daz's long term plans are. I imagine having the figure so recognizable is one of the main reasons the "big boys" steer away from Poser. It looks like Daz (with V3/M3) is doing a lot of thinking about getting a wider variety of looks from a single base mesh, so perhaps that will become less of a factor in time. I don't know about the 10-20 year timeframe. I wouldn't bet on even Microsoft being around in 20 years, at least not in it's present form, though I wouldn't be entirely surprised if a doddering Sadam Hussein were president of Iraq in 2023 :-)

"Democracy is a pathetic belief in the collective wisdom of individual ignorance." - H. L. Mencken

LOL. Well, 10 - 20 years was a figure pulled out of my hat, but the principle still stands. I could easily see DAZ moving towards their own native format in time. They have a good user base and market, and the content and talent to maybe pull it off. mac

True. I see no reason for them to be bound by the Poser format. In the short term, it's pretty essential, but in the long term, I don't thank any company likes to be bound by someone else's infrastructure, especially a competitors! Working on their own, DAZ might decide to abandon obj as a base format, for something more capable. I'm sure there are a lot of innovative things they could do with the figure formats) as well. Of course, if Poser were still around at that point, the whole question of compatibility comes up. It's hard to see DAZ abandoning that market as long as it's still profitable so they'd have to think about some kind of translation facility or face doing double work to produce both Poser and DS studio versions of figures. It'll be very interesting to see how this all plays out. I really hope the market will be big enough for both products to coexist. I think for that to happen though, they will have to diverge enough in their focus to perhaps appeal to somewhat different groups of users.

"Democracy is a pathetic belief in the collective wisdom of individual ignorance." - H. L. Mencken

*Poser and such reminds me of CG Art's equivalent of a whorehouse or casino: The prominent big-shot citizens will denounce it in long and loud speeches on the Sunday pulpit, yet they'll still show up the next Saturday night, with lust in their hearts and cash at the ready. ;)*Amusingly enough, truer than you think. I know of at least one porn flick that used Poser figures. Rendered in another app, but there was Vicki and Michael.

I read that a professor (at Texas A&M I think) once did a study of technology and adult content. It's no secret that it drives a large portion of the internet and also played a big role in the success of the VCR. I believe that he also stated that a good part of the initial success of answering machines was attributable to call girls. It's not surprising that an easy way for producing reasonably realistic computer generated human figures would find an adult niche. At this point, the time, talent and cpu horsepower required to produce pleasing animation, even with Poser's help, makes it a pretty daunting exercise but I wouldn't be surprised to see some significant developments in the next 5 or 10 years.

"Democracy is a pathetic belief in the collective wisdom of individual ignorance." - H. L. Mencken

If Studio gets a good renderer plugin, a good material room and so on, then there will be some kind of market. Oh, but the cost of all those plugins will make it more expensive than Poser 5 which already has excellent capabilities.