every render i have seen of M3 so far has a feminine aspect, expecially around the eyes. Hopefully someone will release some better morphs soon to buff up the mesh and correct the eye problems. I appreciate the versatility in being able to have a more feminine looking male figure but surely it can be worked out to have more masculine options as well.

Catharinas Leonardo M3

I'm having issues with the nose. The cheeks are so puffy that they envelop it. I'm also having such difficulties trying to get a chiseled nose.

I can see your point of view with the eyes. The top of the eye needs to be a lot less rounded.

I tried again widening the nose...what do you think?

Been playing with M3 face inj.'s for a few hours, here's what I came up with.

Howdy Ma'am

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I just don't see him as feminine. Marque

The eyes are still very almond and feminine, i cant explain it in very good detail. it just looks more like vicky 3's eyes then mike 2. there is some sort of femininity about it.

Marque - something about that picture is really striking. I really like how it came out.

Yes, I like it too. Your pic Marque. Love esther ps I don't think the M3 has to be feminine. Just morph him how youu want him. It'll be okay. Honest

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Thanks, could use a lot of work but I'm getting him to where I like him. Marque

I don't think he's feminine...just maybe incomplete. Uh, is it just me or did the morph packs for V3 have a lot more morphs...

Give him time guys and gals. Anything is possible over time.

sniffle eyes...just....so....vickyish

Oh, I think this guy has a lot of potential...In fact a ton of potential...Wait a few days and see what some folks come up with....My first amazement with him is the fact you can raise his arms above his head without his pecs becoming completely distorted....That to me is a major plus...

Mike 3 was never ment to be Butch He was ment to be the petite man.

Doesn't the fact that a lot of real-life perfectly masculine men have eyes like that mean anything to anyone? My older brother is the most macho guy I ever met, and he's got pretty eyes with long eyelashes. Big deal. Jeez, all you folks who are judging the mesh so harshly one day after the release ... I don't know what to say except that you've still got M2. A lack of exaggerated musculature does not necessarily connote femininity.

Well Mesh, Your most recent postings of M2 make me agree with you...There is something about his body that isn't happening with M3....

Well, I think object22 has the right to object. Personally I think M3 is alright. You just have to tweak it a bit more to get good results. M3 has a great deal more potential than M2.

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I don't think he is, i reckon he's a 24 year old, either way i think he's as good an improvment over m2 as V3 was over V2.only problem i have is his boddy shape is no where near the shape of M2 so cloth converting just got harder ......Steve

Steve, mebbe you can convert some of V3 clothes to M3....

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Oh and the render ;o)......Steve

Maybe the Suit JV, i'll try that later.....no i don't agree MM, first time i tried the V3 man i wasn't impressed and never thought he/she looked right, but M3 looked good from the start, subtle differences i think, but enough of them..Steve

Stephanie Dionne tex. M3 with Catharina's Senior and V3 with Mythologia tex. Not exactly a sexy m3 with that tex, but don't think he looks at all fem. Now that I got the inj's working, I'm pretty happy with him.

I see where living on cardassia now.

Where did you get that top that M3 is wearing. that looks nice. Well what I can see of it anyway. Love esther

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sure he looks ok but the traps have got to go.

"becaquseyhou" translation= because you I was wondering who that was for a sec. LOL SOmeone needs some rest I can see.

Not sleep renderosity has a slow forum page, It does not like a fast typer, type too fast and some letters and spaces get missing.

But this page is faster then others, Gayposer.com is the slowest page I ever went to.

Yeaaay - Steve Shanks is already working with M3! Whatcha going to have for us, huh? Some stylish everyday clothes I hope.

Return it and get your money back....That is one thing I really like about Daz...They do stand behind what they offer....

I was all excited over mike3 but boy what a let down, I won't do that again

I see it to Cherokee, it shows in some poses of clothes too, a definet thing to be fixed..gryffnn, just a conversion to start with then i'll do some basic stuff..heres the first http://www.poserworld.com/steve/m3model.jpg didn't want to post an image and hijack the thread....Steve

believe it or not, those eyes are a big problem in V3 when doing different races. I have come up with morph combos that do help erase that almond eye look, but you really have to work from photos and go through the morphs. I guess eventually I will post some faces and settings I've been working on, and see how well they translate to M3... I'm sure they will. on the other hand, those almond eyes are a godsend when doing asian men. So its a minus when working on caucasian eyes and a huge plus when morphing in a decent epicanthic asian eye. 6 in one hand half a dozen in the other I suppose. my biggest complaint with M3 is with the neck and shoulders, personally.

cherokee69, it's not that someone is afraid to say anything, it's that you have mentioned it numerous times and some of us are checking it out to see if we can do something with it. No model is perfect right out of the box, and if you look back at any of the models I defy you to find one that is. When you put polygons together sometimes they don't work in all poses or tweaks, and that's when folks start working together. Give us and Daz a chance to figure out what happened with it and how it can be fixed. In the long run if you can't live with it then get your money back. There are down sides to every model that has been put out, but in the long run I think that although M3 and V3 won't completely replace M2 and V2 I will be using them more. Like my mom always said... you can please all of the people some of the time, and some of the people all of the time, but you can't please all of the people all of the time. 8^) Marque

I think the pecs have an angle to them that if it can't be adjusted out, then the original model can probably be adjusted. Just remember that if you make an adjustment in one place it will probably affect something else. We try to catch everything in beta, but sometimes it's the most obvious things that catch us. And I still think Mike3 is masculine. You don't have to be covered with hair and look like an ape to be more male than the next guy. 8^) Marque

Oh and Mesh just curious, how long did you tweak Mike 2 to get him to look like the pic you keep showing? Marque

Yes, he does look a little fem in his default pose. M2 had problems looking young and soft. No model is perfect. However, he can look pretty butch too, it just takes a little work. And I expect there to be some new packages with new morphs that will REALLY butch him up pretty quickly. Remember how amazed we were when Borus came out? And Massive Mike? And Musclebound Mike? I definitly agree about the problem with the pits. Most models have problems with joint distortion at the pits, groin, elbows, and knees. M2 has adjustments to help with those. I've got the feeling M3 will have a fix for some of those problems too, either by Daz or others. They'll get fixed, and probably pretty soon. Daz is very good about things like that. Remember V3's SR1? It came out in a couple of weeks and fixed a number of problems that weren't caught. It's not like CL and three service packs and a fourth on the way over a year later. Personally I was hoping for better genitalia than was included in the package (or the package in the package). However, I can morph that for myself (today's project). And there's always the third party penises (peni? what is the plural?). It is good to have the problems pointed out, both to Daz directly and to here. Daz, so they have an official record to do the fixes, and here to let others know what you've found so they won't think they're the first and only ones with the same problem. Give it a couple of weeks. Have a nice cup of tea or a cold beer. Go out and get lai.. uh, never mind. ...(Oops)....

cherokee69 should have said something to you earlier, wasn't trying to ignore you. 8^) If I don't get my eyes today I'm going to go crazy, trying to type and it's blurry...heh pdxjims I would love it if you could do a morph on the foreskin, to either remove it...ouch! or pull it back? Thanks, Marque

Cool!! thanks that was making me crazy. Oh and Mike says there is nothing wrong with being in touch with your feminine side 8^P Marque

I mentioned the chest/armpit problem in my post yesterday after looking at some of the popups for some M3 textures at DAZ.

M3 Hmm... thread

If you look at it, on top of everything else, and with no besmirch to Fauve's image, look at the hands in the image. Can anyone see those hands brandishing a sword? I suppose they can be beefed up but I guess I wish M3 was more masculine out of the box and the slight, "femmy" build was the option that required so much work...

Thank goodness my parents didn't look at me too closely when I was born...lol Marque

I've been one of the people encouraging those with lots of complaints to relax and give the mesh some time, but Cherokee69 and others are right...there are issues with the mesh. The first thing I noticed was the bizarre inner elbows. Sorry, but they sort of remind me of Vicky 1's strange elbows. Very odd, considering the excellence of the mesh in so many other areas. But as others have said it wouldn't surprise me if DAZ offers some joint fixes sometime soon. Either that or some clever person will figure out some Joint Editor settings to make the armpits and elbows look more natural. Oh, and as to the most crucial issue metioned in this thread, "penii" is the plural. If this is pronounced the same way that Latin or "scientific" names are in botany, it would be "pee-nee-eye." (I'm laughing out loud as I type this.) However, I'm sure nobody would fault you for saying "peen-eye" or for using the plural "penises." OK, I'll stop.

by the way Marque, I like your image. With those glasses and techy-top, he's not unlike a full-powered, adult Harry Potter.

(sidenote: I'm not however, in any fashion a Harry Potter fan. I couldn't get past the third chapter of the one I tried - finding it rather forced. I could see Rowling in that coffee shop coming up with names, "doobledee, dimbledot, humbledum, DUMBLEDORE!") How surprising that that's what the world was waiting for...

But in any event, it's a nice image and good morph work. : )

This statement is on the DAZ site for those of you who may have missed it: "Lastly, with all DAZ products there is an unconditional, 30 day money-back guarantee. If you don't feel absolutely satisfied with your purchase, simply tell us that you want your money back. We will refund you immediately with no questions asked. And that's more than a guarantee. It's our personal promise." Thought maybe a lot of you had since you keep bitching and moaning about the product but aren't doing anything productive about it.

3ddave - there was a brief flurry on Rowlings's names in the Guardian's letters page a few days back. Dumbledore is in one of Hardy's novels (Return of the Native?) and I think there was also a Hogwart reference.

Thanks 3ddave, I have seen the movies but have yet to read one of the books, same reason...lol He wasn't meant to be a Harry Potter just something out of my head but now that you mention it... 8^) Marque

I think he is a handsome guy! Wish his default tits (oh, sorry, pecks!), were a little flatter maybe, but I like him. I aught to mention that the way Poser works on joint parameters is that morphs don't figure into the fall-off zones, Poser adjusts the bend based on where the un-morphed mesh would be. That may explain what some of you are seeing in his bending. You can't have it both ways.

Well, to put in my $0.02 worth in I do not think that M3 is too femminie. Just take a look at your local gay bar (if you frequent those places. I do!) and you will see MANY feminine guys there! If you read how M3 came about is is because of their new UNIMESH that they make into V3 and M3. My opinion is that some of the problems that we are seeing are from that base mesh. I also think that most of what the complaint is here is that DAZ needs to rethink the Unimesh idea. Granted, it takes less time making a model from a known starting point, but I think that you can't beat making a completely new model from the ground up. All in all, I like M3. V3 as a male really did not do anything for me. I have her, but I was not too thrilled with the male morphs. Well, I can only hope that SOMEONE will do some penis morphs. PDXJIMS: I would like to see some foreskin and penis morphs too. Love to all, Tankred

I think feminine is just an inaccurate description of what M3 is. Had V3 not been released before M3 then maybe the complaints would be completely different. I like M3, but I don't think he has nearly the number of head morphs that came with V3. It's a bit hard when you have to use negative ethnicity morphs. V3 came with some morphs that were distinctly caucasian (french, germanic, celtic, slavic, etc.).

BTW, how am I doing on this character? Trying for a more sculpted look with the face. The area under the eyes and the cheeks kind of envelop the nose a bit. If that could be flattened I would be perfectly happy with this figure.

he looks good, i'm gonna have to agree, seems the face is very limited

Yep thats about my only dissapointment too, the lack of face morphs, maybe we'll see a second package.....Steve

Thanks papabluemarlin and steve, i thought maybe it was me, not injecting everything into the face, seems very limited to me, unless you make him old or an alien, all the faces have much of the same features. Classic romanesque features, classic hollywood, so far no luck here, yep hoping for more morphs or mike2's head on m3's body

I'm playing with a lot of negative numbers. We probably will see more morphs, happens with all the new characters. I think he's great but everyone has different ideas and as people put in their thoughts he will grow just like V3 and all the other Daz characters. Steve get back to work! lol Bye the way thanks for doing that first set, it's so cool! Marque

When V3 first came out there were some problems and a service release was posted soon after. Since he was just released on the 10th I'm sure Daz will check out the problems and work on them, but they won't be in til Monday so don't expect anything over the weekend unless folks here do the morphs. 8^) Marque

They will know on Monday, and will be able to start working on them, or figuring out a workaround. As for being feminine, here is my newest.... 8^) Marque

I finished work Marque ;o) hint ;o)......Steve