Attached Link: http://www.renderosity.com/index.ez?viewStory=6517&AID=71

May 26, 2004

We are pleased to unveil the Renderosity Extreme MarketPlace Makeover.

After 2 years with the same general MarketPlace design, we decided it was time to give the Renderosity MarketPlace a major "facelift".

See the Before and After shots and get the full story, including a money saving coupon for you to use when you shop in the new Renderosity MarketPlace. (But, youll have to hurry, this is a limited time offer!) http://www.renderosity.com/index.ez?viewStory=6517&AID=71

Best wishes,
Lillian Hawkins
Renderosity Marketing & Promotions
Accelerating the evolution of art!

**** NOTE **** : The migration of products into the new layout is being done at this time and we expect to have it completed by 6:00pm server time.

Message edited on: 05/26/2004 16:12

Lillian Hawkins
Marketing Manager
By serving each other, we are free.

Forgive me for saying so but this facelift has a very high suck value.

My custom background color is black. It is not used in the marketplace (this off-white makes me puke) but in the Shopping Cart/Wishlists and Purchase History I have lovely black text on a black background.

Where is the frigging 'Whats New' for everything link?

The Product Reviews are the same way in the store, can't read them.

Hang tight. We are still working on the migration. Once that is complete we can address any concerns. There will be a "What's New" for all products. Just hang tight, we're getting there. Best wishes, LillianH Renderosity Marketing & Promotions

Lillian Hawkins
Marketing Manager
By serving each other, we are free.

Well, went in to fetch an old download that I can't seem to find in my files...can't find it in my purchase history either since I can't read anything in there. Sure hope the very first thing that gets fixed is to match settings with our personal preferences. I trust you guys, so pleeeeeeeeeeeeese don't let me down!

Here's a (temporary) work-around: Try highlighting the text. At least you'll be able to read it.

Something To Do At 3:00AM

hmm.... as has been said my default background is also black.. and now the site looks a big mess again.. whats the thing about cream, it does make the place look awfully untidy and becauseof the layout of the site it now looks very unprofessional and unpleasent on the browsing eyes to me (i know DAZ is white, but their layout is totally different)..

I can no longer see my wishlist or my purchases etc.. because the text is also black and apparently i can't change it...

not happy :(

Message edited on: 05/26/2004 18:08

My Gallery

Please correct me if I'm wrong, but it appears that you can no longer browse in a broad catagory. I do not want to be forced to choose which app, then which character (in the case of Poser,) then which of your chosen catagories for that character to shop from. I just want to browse "3D Accessories" as I could in the past! Please, plesae restore that capability, or if I'm misunderstanding this new interface, let me know how I can do it. My apologies in advance if I'm missing something, but from what I've seen, I'm very sorry to say, this facelift is a horrible mistake.

Don't "New Rollouts" need to work before they get rolled out?

If you are all sitting around reading the negative posts, trying to decide what to do - SWITCH BACK!

I've noticed that "surfers online" has dropped by about 3,000 members since I loged on this afternoon. BAD SIGN!

The new MarketPlace interface is up. We will continue working on the product category optimization and making the final adjustments over the next few days. We greatly appreciate your patience and understanding as we take care of the polishing touches. Best wishes, LillianH Renderosity Marketing & Promotions

Lillian Hawkins
Marketing Manager
By serving each other, we are free.

That coupon is not even attractive :( 10% off $50? I'll pass....

Software: Daz Studio 4.15, Photoshop CC, Zbrush 2022, Blender 3.3, Silo 2.3, Filter Forge 4. Marvelous Designer 7

Hardware: self built Intel Core i7 8086K, 64GB RAM, RTX 3090 .

"If you spend too much time arguing about software, you're spending too little time creating art!" ~ SomeSmartAss

"A critic is a legless man who teaches running." ~ Channing Pollock

My Gallery My Other Gallery

Please *DO put in an overall "What's New" link.

That's where I do 99.99% of my shopping.*

Something To Do At 3:00AM

I agree TOTALLY with Xenophonz - I surf on the "what's new" all catagories as well. Would love to see that implemented.

Select the ">" next to 3D Accessories for show all/whats new. Clint

Clint Hawkins
MarketPlace Manager/Copyright Agent

All my life I've been over the top ... I don't know what I'm doing ... All I know is I don't wana stop!
(Zakk Wylde (2007))

Does the ">" next to 3D Accessories cover every category and every item -- including everything under "Software", "CD Corner", "2D Accessories", etc., etc........?

In other words, does this link include all of the items in all of the categories? Or just the items in "3D Accessories"?

Even if the ">" under 3D Accessories includes all items, I believe that a newbie to the site might experience some difficulty in figuring this out.

Wouldn't it be easier, and more user-friendly, to simply have one overall button clearly labeled "What's New"? An overall button located on the front page of the Marketplace?

In my humble opinion -- it would.

Something To Do At 3:00AM

"Wouldn't it be easier, and more user-friendly, to simply have one overall button clearly labeled "What's New"? An overall button located on the front page of the Marketplace?" Yep, Its coming. Clint

Clint Hawkins
MarketPlace Manager/Copyright Agent

All my life I've been over the top ... I don't know what I'm doing ... All I know is I don't wana stop!
(Zakk Wylde (2007))

Thanks!!!!!

Something To Do At 3:00AM

Well, I can't see my purchase history either. Not even highlighting the cells helps. Once again, a very poorly thought out plan is implemented. Kate

Yup, I also can't see my purchase history. And also can't see my wishlist and shopping cart. eh, I guess no shopping for me. Haven't you guys learned yet from the previous site "makeover"?

Is search engine going to get an update? To, say, boolean like every other proper search engine on the web? And, errr, doesn't Renderosity have a test server somewhere for this stuff? To get the bugs and so forth out before it goes live? bonni

"When a man gives his opinion, he's a man. When a woman gives her opinion, she's a bitch." - Bette Davis

ack....nightmare... you've broken one of the BASIC rules of online marketing...more than 3 clicks to a product and you're NOT getting a sale...along with the fact thatthere's not even mini pics to pull you along deeper... see post #8 for clarification...PICTURES sell...not a lot of type..until the buyer is ready for it...you probably lost about half your browsing shoppers and alienated the other half...I'd do a SERIOUS rethink before keeping this scheme in place without thumbnails to welcome visitors as the few on the side are just not enough to even catch my eye. If one had to navigate a real store like this and read complicated instructions before even SEEING any merchandise...one would quickly shop somewhere else methinks....just my 2 cents

Rendo Store | Freebies | RDNA Store

I don't often post but damn it, it's hideous and a complete PITA to navigate.

Why oh why did you all do this?!?!? ....... You will bet if it stays this way I will find the other sites that my favorite vendors sell at cause this bites the big one!

In a word, Ewwwww. :P

Calypso Dreams... My Art- http://www.calypso-dreams.com

Renderosity Gallery

I don't care for the new look.

Hi...I just have a quick question...are we going to have the option to change the color scheme soon? I have very sensitive eyes and so I can't look at the marketplace for more than a couple of seconds now...the set up looks okay it's just the color scheme is extremely harsh...I know it's new but I wanted to know if and when we'll have the option to change it...Jenn

Hi Jenn, Not at this time. We dont have plans to make custom color setting available while in the MarketPlace. Clint

Clint Hawkins
MarketPlace Manager/Copyright Agent

All my life I've been over the top ... I don't know what I'm doing ... All I know is I don't wana stop!
(Zakk Wylde (2007))

Well, now I can see the cart/wishlist and purchases pages, but I hate the navigating around. Logging in from the front page leads to the marketplace. Logging out from the front page leads to the marketplace. While in the marketplace, the renderosity ART COMMUNITY logo in upper left conrner leads to.... the marketplace. If you where anywhere else but the marketplace, that logo brings you to the frontpage. While in the marketplace, I noticed "community" on top which does lead you to the frontpage. While on a product page, I have to go back to the marketplace page or frontpage (community link on top) to get to my cart/wishlist page. Should I go on w/ my navigating adventures w/ "What's New"? Yup, sure is an "extreme" makeover. I think I'll wait awhile before I go shopping again, even though I'll miss some sales and that coupon.

On a decent sized monitor, all those white pixels really are a little too harsh on the eyes. The black background was one of the things that made new products one of the first pages I look at when I browse in the morning. My eyeballs aren't as young as they used to be! Not having the toolbar on the side for the rest of the site means more clicks to get where you want to go, which as previously stated, is not a good thing. -Jeff

"Logging in from the front page leads to the marketplace" Fixed. "Logging out from the front page leads to the marketplace." Fixed. "While on a product page, I have to go back to the marketplace page or frontpage (community link on top) to get to my cart/wishlist page." Fixed. The cart options are now available on the product promotional pages. Using black as a background color for an E-Commerce web page is a big design no no...there is plenty of data available to support this. Light colors have historicaly proven to be best for shopping. Clint

Clint Hawkins
MarketPlace Manager/Copyright Agent

All my life I've been over the top ... I don't know what I'm doing ... All I know is I don't wana stop!
(Zakk Wylde (2007))

I think the problem that most are pointing out is not that the colors are light, but more that there is too much white space. It's like being snow blinded. Seriously, I had to put on my sunglasses to cut down on the glare. A light background is fine if it's left in the background, but when it becomes more than 50% of the image it becomes foreground and is very very hard on the eyes. Personally, if it had to be a light color I think y'all would have done better to go with a soft gray. Even my word processing programs have been adjusted to use a soft gray rather than stark white so that I don't have to deal with the glare when writing. Kate (who suffers from photosensitivity and cannot take the stark white)

Yeah, I have a widescreen monitor, set to 1440 wide, and the three little 100x100 thumbnails across get swallowed up by all the white, especially with no sidebar anymore. More stuff on the page would be better.

a couple of things, yes the whiteness, why oh why! no side bar! and the $50 voucher thing, there is no way half of us spend that amount in one go, and 10% of the $50, hhmmm! i shop here when i can, and have only ever used one voucher on my old name, yes ok it was time for a face lift, by by 'eck, personally i dont like the new layout, at all! i do preffer the old one thats been up for two years! oh well!!!

In the words of DarkStarRising:
"Sadness within sadness,
Darkness within darkness,
a shadow of a form lays upon the floor,
looking at herself
looking at her own shadows of loneliness"

How do I: 1) put it back the way it was? 2) get rid of the white background?

[Using black as a background color for an E-Commerce web page is a big design no no...there is plenty of data available to support this.] I think you guys should run a poll and I think you'll find that web design no-no or not - a majority of your customers prefer a darker background to the glaring white. At least allow us to set the colors the way we want!!!

I would think that a bigger "E-Commerce" no no would be completely ignoring the complaints of a number of your customer base especially when they are asking for something they have had (custom colors)for at least 2 years (from what I can tell. I haven't been around that long). I find the fact that the PTB either ignore or pooh pooh members/customers an interesting thing to watch. I boycotted the RMP some months ago because I didn't like the way some things were being handled unevenly. I just the day before this new design rolled out found a few items I would like and had decided that I would give them a go again. I planned to pick them up and then the makeover rolled out and I have watched how they have handled the concerns expressed by both merchants and customers. Now that I have seen that they still have the same attitude toward their customer base I will once again remove the items from my wishlist and spend my money in other places. If something comes out that I desperately want I will contact the artist and find out if I can purchase it another way and if not let them know that while I would love to buy their item I won't buy from R'osity so they have lost a sale. On another note I think that not beta testing a big new rollout is probably also a big E-Commerace no-no

As a web designer and general HTML monkey, if I suggested to a client that we put a site up, or modified their existing site to see what people thought of it I'd happily help them boot my a$$ out the door. Any new commercial site or redesign of a commercial site MUST go before a focus group before it gets anywhere near the user base, that way you should avoid 90%+ of the negative comments. A focus group is a bunch of people that hopefully don't know your business, but know how to navigate a web site...and sometimes it's great to throw in the "little old lady" factor where you have to give someone the basics of navigating a site and then see how they do. A focus group is NOT a bunch of designers slapping themselves on the back saying "looks OK to me Fred, I love the part you made" is it guys? ~lol~ If the marketplace vendors take the time to have people beta-test their products before release you'd think the store would catch on that it's the thing to do. That's my $0.02 any way.

The liver is evil - It must be punished.

Dear Towal, "completely ignoring the complaints"...I would dare say not. I have been personally responding to each concern in the opinions posted to the FrontPage article, as well as several threads. There have already been several concerns that have been taken care of. Amoung them being: - The thumbnail size changed from 100x100 to 200x200. - "What's New" link added to main MarketPlace page. The background color is being reviewed. But, will probably not be changed. There has been a lot of research done regarding background colors on e-commerce sites and our choice was not made arbitrarily. Here is a good reference that gives some insight into this decision: http://www.sitepoint.com/article/colour-checklists-web-design/2 Also, it may be helpful to know that more than 94% of our active members use the default off-white background. However, we do understand that, unfortunately, this particular color may not be desirable to all of our members. As for a focus group, I rather like that idea slinger. I think it is a good suggestion. Thanks for sharing it. Best wishes, LillianH Renderosity Marketing & Promotions

Lillian Hawkins
Marketing Manager
By serving each other, we are free.

Well 80% of those 94% throw one look at that deadly white and never come back.
(And those active members numbers from Renderosity are rather suspect.)

Dear MadYuri, My bad...I should have posted the buyer stats: 83% of the buyers use the off-white background. Thanks, LillianH Renderosity Marketing & Promotions

Lillian Hawkins
Marketing Manager
By serving each other, we are free.

"Also, it may be helpful to know that more than 94% of our active members use the default off-white background. However, we do understand that, unfortunately, this particular color may not be desirable to all of our members." My first thought when seeing this is that at least 80% of those members are not truly active (just because you have an account that doesn't make you active). Probably 20% of those people even see the marketplace on a regular basis. I would think that most people who truly participate (post in gallery/forums and/or use marketplace) on this site have personalized their screens. Personally the background color hurts my eyes and since there seems to be no forthcoming solution such as personalizing the colors to something less harsh my only option is just to add merchants that I like to my favorites list and then directly purchase that way and if I miss new merchants oh well. This sucks since I usually visit the marketplace 3-5 times a day. I guess if there's a great product out there I'll see it in a gallery image so maybe I won't miss out too much. I think this way new merchants lose out but market research is market research...I think an opinion poll completed by members would probably have different results. I think the renderosity staff has done a good job of responding to comments and making certain changes but as to this matter I simply don't understand why allowing those who truly have issues with the color scheme to change it as they see fit is a problem. If research says white is best then that should be the default not the only option especially when the majority of members disagree. Jenn

What some of us are not happy about, is before the makeover, we had the option to choose our own color sets. After the "improvement", we don't.

Others have expressed this well already so I won't rehash a lot. Marketing research is all well and good, but when you have a portion of your base saying this thing IS a problem that is something that you should consider instead of some general market research that was not done on YOUR specific customer base. I have not seen anyone suggest that black be the default color for the marketplace background. They have asked for the option to change their own personal settings. Personally, until recently I used the default scheme and it didn't really bother me very much, but my eyes are getting older and so I have changed to a darker background with lighter links. I had the default colors when visiting the old marketplace and never felt like I was going snowblind from visiting because while there was white space it wasn't overwhelming. I visited after the makeover to see what people were complaining about and I couldn't find the back button fast enough...it was incredibly blinding to the point that by the time I had hit the back button I was seeing spots. I would suggest that based on what I have read I'm not the only person that feels that way. No matter how badly I want an item I'm not going to go blind/risk a migraine trying to purchase it. I haven't been shopping here for some time because I don't like how some issues were handled in the past so I'm sure you won't miss my not shopping here now either. There are some items I would like and a gift I wanted to get for someone, but not enough to deal with the blinding. I will say that many concerns regarding the marketplace have been handled in a much better fashion for the most part than I expected they would be based on past experience....of course those other things weren't based on money and the MP is.

I argued design merits with my instructors in college everytime they said that light colors were preferred over black. They would point out sites like eBay, travel sites, amazon, etc., typical e-commerce sites. THEN, since I was heavily into designing a site focusing on graphics and art, we went to places like (my page at) Renderosity, 3DCommune, Renderotica, Animotions, to name a few, and what do they have? Very dark or black backgrounds. None of them could argue my point that for graphics intensive viewing, the dark was better. I think the biggest problem here is that we, as artistic types, do not like anything interfering with our viewing of images - including marketplace product ads. Can you imagine for one minute what it would look like if you were watching a wide-screen movie on your tv and the top and bottom bars were WHITE?! Knowing how a pretty large portion of computer users have not the slightest idea of how things work, they just "click and go", I'm not surprised that so many keep the the light background. It prolly scares them to death to try to figure out how to change the colors. And really, since when is market research, (or consulting for that matter), ever anything more than the "Fad du Jour"? I am soooooo happy with the fixes, and especially the What's New button, so I know you guys are paying at least some attention to us. But really, the light background IMHO, has got to go, or let us set the colors please.

I am seeing steady improvement with the new changes. Each day, as the fixes roll in, it gets better.

The site speed fix is the most obvious improvement to me. Frankly, I am surprised that this highly NOTICEABLE change hasn't generated more comments.

Kicking is a lot more fun than taking note of the good aspects of the situation, I suppose.

Something To Do At 3:00AM

"The site speed fix is the most obvious improvement to me. Frankly, I am surprised that this highly NOTICEABLE change hasn't generated more comments."

I'm on cable and the site is still the slowest site I visit on the net. There has been no spped change for me, thus I have not commented on that. If they do speed it up so that it's faster for everyone then I certainly would comment on that huge improvement.

Interesting.

I have a cable connection at home, and a DSL connection at the office.

The site's speed has increased greatly for me at both locations. No more waiting around for the last two days or so. This is a very welcome change.

However -- apparently, this isn't the case for everyone.

Something To Do At 3:00AM

P.S.--

This thread "pops up" for me with only a second or two of hesitation. In the past, the page might have taken a minute or more to load.

Do I notice that kind of a difference? Yeah. I "notice" it a lot.

Something To Do At 3:00AM

I want to thank all of you for your insightful, well thought out feedback. It does have an impact and is taken into consideration. XENOPHONZ said "I am seeing steady improvement with the new changes. Each day, as the fixes roll in, it gets better." Thank you for noticing. This is what we are striving for, to continuously improve and keep things vibrant. I agree with you Towal, that even with the best research, each site is unique and has it's own needs that should be taken into account. It's definitely necessary when trying to address the needs and desires of an entire community. As we are all aware, not all members of any community will always agree on how things should be. This is when it becomes necessary to go with what is in the best interest of the community as a whole rather than what may be desirable to a small portion within the community. Please don't get me wrong. I would love to make everyone happy. However, I don't think that's very likely, as many folks simply have some very different ideas and opinions of how things should be done. Not to discount anything, but there is a reason for the old saying..."You can please most of the people, most of the time. You can please some of the people, some of the time. But, you can't please all of the people, all of the time." I wish it weren't true. But, it is. As you can see from our responses, we are paying attention. We do value your feedback. We may not always be able to accommodate every request. But, we will always continue to make improvements and keep things dynamic. I really appreciate your kind support as we continue working through this process. Best wishes, Lillian

Lillian Hawkins
Marketing Manager
By serving each other, we are free.

But, you can't please all of the people, all of the time." In this case you can. Just give us back the ability that you took away. - The ability to choose our own colors! You can then have your default white, and we can have our dark backgrounds if we so desire.

Calypso Dreams... My Art- http://www.calypso-dreams.com

Renderosity Gallery

As we are all aware, not all members of any community will always agree on how things should be. That's certainly true, but on the other hand, there are some pretty good guidelines in the web development field as to how things should be done (none of which were observed for this change). I think that eventually the marketplace will be functional with working navigation, but in the meantime, it's a mess. That shouldn't happen on a live, working website. In the future, please, please, set up a test version and let people log in there and check it out, get the feedback THEN, fix it, and then, only after you've got good feedback and suggestions and the proposed new site has been fully tested, launch it onto the main site. In other words, don't tear down the house before you have a new one built. bonni

"When a man gives his opinion, he's a man. When a woman gives her opinion, she's a bitch." - Bette Davis

Bless you, bonni well said. You would think that testing before implementing is a no-brainer, but apparently nobody at Renderosity could be bothered. A test site would have eliminated ninety percent of the user outrage and frustration of the past few days. At least Renderosity can be used by web design teachers as a textbook example of how NOT to "makeover" a website on-the-fly.

Hi Caly, I would have normally agreed with you, except as odd as this may sound, not everyone wants customizable colors in the Marketplace. On the community side I think we all agree, customizable colors are a great feature and are here to stay. However, it proved not to be so great in the Marketplace. After that was implemented (about 2 years ago) there have been a number of requests from Merchants to change it back. There were issues with buyers not being able to properly view graphics, or colored text depending on the member's settings. It greatly limited the ability of Merchants to be creative with the backgrounds and texts of their promo images and thumbnails. They had no idea what color combinations their products would be viewed with. They could no longer integrate the background color to create 3D illusions and transparent overlays, etc. The Merchants are an important part of the site (go figure, the money keeps the site running). They have a vested interest in it. Their requests, of course, weighed heavily in that decision. Additionally, I have not seen any another e-commerce site that allows people to customize the colors in it's Marketplace. When we reviewed the request and found 83% of the buyers already use the default off-white background anyway, it made sense to make the adjustment as part of the "Makeover". The customized color settings are still available within the community. But, the Marketplace now has it's own unique feel and style. Best wishes, LillianH Renderosity Marketing & Promotions PS. I hear you Bonni. While we did quite a bit of testing prior to launch, it was obviously not of the magnitude necessary to gauge the overall effect properly. Based on this experience, we are taking steps to correct that with future changes. Point well taken.

Lillian Hawkins
Marketing Manager
By serving each other, we are free.

While we did quite a bit of testing prior to launch, it was obviously not of the magnitude necessary to gauge the overall effect properly. Based on this experience, we are taking steps to correct that with future changes. Point well taken. I'm really glad to hear this. The best anyone can expect is that people (and managements, which are made up of people ;-) learn from mistakes. bonni

"When a man gives his opinion, he's a man. When a woman gives her opinion, she's a bitch." - Bette Davis

"Additionally, I have not seen any another e-commerce site that allows people to customize the colors in it's Marketplace." 3DCommune's store carries any custom selected colors through-out. (even lets you upload a background image...)

That's a feature I've never noticed at 3d commune. Could you point me to the link that lets members customize the marketpage page? I really hate the red and black default.

Thanks!

Message edited on: 05/31/2004 12:37

http://www.3dcommune.com/3d/options.mv It's labeled My Account Options on the menu. From there you can customize your account with a lot of different options... like select a menu type, (the Collapsed menu is cool), adjust forum and gallery parameters like how many per page and default sort orders, site colors and/or background image, and much more.

Thank you! I am so happy to get rid of that background. Haven't seen that option anywhere else. I appreciate your help.

A few things to consider: Renderosity has been around for how many years and they have how many members? Why aren't they testing their code and colors BEFORE uploading it a live site? Or, do the PTB enjoy pissing off members? Just see the blow-up about the "mud" color scheme for the most recent issue. Somehow, someone thought that dark chocolate/ mud colors showcase artwork really well. And in this case, someone somehow thinks that a bunch of text links will show off graphical products really well. I want to click on a thumbnail of a character that looks cool and not have to click on Poser, then Vicky, then Characters, whoops, I meant to click on Vicky 3, no wait, I meant to click on Textures. "Also, it may be helpful to know that more than 94% of our active members use the default off-white background." This statistic was brought up back when the color scheme was changed. I don't know if the question was asked then, but: How many people know how to change the colors? And, out of the people who know how to change the colors, how many don't, because they have to complete the marketing information for their settings to save? "Additionally, I have not seen any another e-commerce site that allows people to customize the colors in it's Marketplace." Yeah, why be different and give the users a cool feature. No one else does, why should we? On the other hand, if users can customize their colors on the regular site, why can't they customize their colors on the marketplace site?

Just see the blow-up about the "mud" color scheme for the most recent issue. Somehow, someone thought that dark chocolate/ mud colors showcase artwork really well. The thing is, they insisted on keeping that to "let people get used to it" and then ended up changing it anyway. If they'd listened to the enormous chorus of complaints the first time or if they'd used the designer's actual designed color scheme (they decided to change it for reasons unknown; designer was not happy about it as I recall), they could have avoided a great deal of negativity and avoided a lot of hassle. This is the pattern, though. Implement some new thing without adequate testing or input from the community, then act surprised when people object, and treat all negative feedback as if those making the observations are just uneducated, reactionary, emotional artiste sorts who don't know what they're talking about, anyway. Then, eventually, implement most of the suggestions but act like it was part of the plan all along. It seems to me that for the sake of PR and professionalism, it would make a lot more sense to set up the proposed changes on a test server, invite people to log in and check it out, and gather the feedback (negative and positive) there, rather than launching onto a live site. bonni

"When a man gives his opinion, he's a man. When a woman gives her opinion, she's a bitch." - Bette Davis

The Merchants are an important part of the site (go figure, the money keeps the site running). They have a vested interest in it. Their requests, of course, weighed heavily in that decision. I was going to let that comment go, but I just couldn't. That comment is a really good way of starting an "us vs. them" controversy again. I'm sure you didn't mean to imply that the customers and the community as a whole is less important then the merchants, at least I hope not. The "merchants" are important, but it's not their money that makes the site run, it's the customer's money. You don't get that percentage from the merchant in the form of cash, you get it from the customer. I would think that having an option of changing colors to please the customers would be just as important as pleasing the merchants. You have people saying that because of the new changes, they aren't going to purchase here anymore...I think that would definately interest the merchant also. Even if it's one, that is important. Having an option would be a good marketing strategy I would think. The other thing to take into consideration, by and large this is a community of artistically inclined people, so what a market research company thinks is good for Ebay et al,may not exactly be good for an artistic community. In any case, glad the PTB's and the merchants are happy about it....because as a high volume customer I'm sure not. Pendarian

I am doing what I've always done: I go straight to the "What's New" button. Everything else -- I ignore.

Something To Do At 3:00AM

I always went to the "Digital Products" link on the sidebar. Never through the front page of the marketplace. I could browse the entire marketplace from that link if I wanted (well, except for Rendo merchandise and books, etc.). Can't do that now. Now I have to go through each freakin' category that I use - Poser, Vue, 3DS, etc. That's just way more convoluted and time consuming, so, until I'm able to browse the entire marketplace the way I used to, I won't be spending any more money here either. Kate (who will continue to spend thousands of dollars on stuff, but will do it elsewhere)

Is BETA test over yet? shrug rolls eyes logout from front page leads to... marketplace, but only happens w/ mozilla firefox. with IE6, logout from front page, well, leads to front page. tried with 3 different computers (2 W2K and 1 XP Pro), clearing cookies, cache, and history. while using mozilla firefox, hovering pointer over "logout" indicates link to http://market.renderosity.com/logout.ez. with IE6, it goes to http://www.renderosity.com/logout.ez. so, with mozilla firefox, when i logout, i'm dumped to the marketplace. and should I want to log back in to the front page of renderosity, i have to retype www.renderosity.com because that graphic on the upper left corner that says "renderosity art community" doesn't bring me to renderosity art community. nope. back to marketplace. sigh i'll start shopping again when BETA testing is over

oh yeah, i know there is a logon link at the marketplace, but i don't want to login to the marketplace.

As a designer a basic rule in my work is always "form follows function" (not very new, i know). With the new marketplace i have the feeling that it is the other way round. Here i think we have a lot of form in terms of structure and less function. Here is how i am normally buying things. I go through "What's New" and decide what i like. Especially because i use several applications and mostly can't decide beforehand what i want. But i know approximately what i want to spend. The result from my last buying was, that i, after browsing through the Poser section, forgot to switch over to Vue and finished my buying - and bought less than planed. Exactly what not should happen. Another basic thing is to go live when the beta test is over - again, not the other way round. Great to here that there are improvements every day, but they should have been done in a beta test state, not when it is already live. It confuses me and that means i prefer going somewhere else. Conclusion? I personally have not so much fun in browsing through the new marketplace anymore. With the result that i spend more money in other places. I think the general figures after a while will tell you this statistically as well. Maybe then you latest should talk to your web-designers again. BTW, i like the new look and feel and have absolutely no problem so far (Mac, Safari)- only some functions should be back to make me a happy camper.

One day your ship comes in - but you're at the airport.

Maybe it is a complot to make Poser 5 look good in comparison.

A list of some bugs:

Still only about 100 products in the general "What's New" section.
"What's Hot" doesn't work, those are just the same products from the "What's New" section.
No general Warehouse link (not that I would buy anything from this section).
The background color ist just so awful.

Hi MadYuri, I'll address your list. 1) Still only about 100 products in the general "What's New" section. Thats working properly. It lists the last weeks worth of product releases since these would be considered "New". Products older than that are no longer considered "New". 2) "What's Hot" doesn't work, those are just the same products from the "What's New" section. The Whats Hot section doesnt list the same products in the Whats New section. Its listing products based on their sales volumes. 3) No general Warehouse link (not that I would buy anything from this section). Correct. The Warehouse sort selection is available in each product category. 4) The background color ist just so awful. Not a bug. Just a change to help us and the merchants present products to the customers in a more predictable environment. Clint

Clint Hawkins
MarketPlace Manager/Copyright Agent

All my life I've been over the top ... I don't know what I'm doing ... All I know is I don't wana stop!
(Zakk Wylde (2007))

[The site speed fix is the most obvious improvement to me. Frankly, I am surprised that this highly NOTICEABLE change hasn't generated more comments.] Just tried to see D&M's latest product and after three refreshes and 5 minutes I still couldn't get the third image to show - real big speed improvement! lol [The Merchants are an important part of the site (go figure, the money keeps the site running). They have a vested interest in it. Their requests, of course, weighed heavily in that decision.] I'm with pendarian on this one. It's not the merchants that float the site it's the customers (i.e. members) that float the site. Doesn't do you any good to have a 1000 merchants with 5000 products if no one buys anything! lol

"4) The background color ist just so awful.

Not a bug. Just a change to help us and the merchants present products to the customers in a more predictable environment."

I still don't understand why there's not an individual option to change the colors. Merchants can still present their products in a way to compliment the default color scheme and those who chose not to have it just miss out on the overall effect but at least they would bother to look. The way it currently is I don't look at the marketplace unless I get a message that my favorite merchants have something new out and this is quite a change considering that before the change I looked at What's New at least 3-5 times a day. I don't understand why it's a major problem to give all those who want to change the colors the option...that way everyone is happy. I know the saying you can't please all the people all the time but in this case it seems so easy to do so...just give the people who want the option to change the colors the right to do so...it doesn't truly effect me because I'm going to be broke this summer and won't be purchasing anything for a while but it just irks me that the PTB won't even consider just giving the option when all it requires is a simple change in code...the way the issue is handled pisses me off more than the changes themselves...that's just my 2 cents...Jenn

*[The site speed fix is the most obvious improvement to me. Frankly, I am surprised that this highly NOTICEABLE change hasn't generated more comments.]

Just tried to see D&M's latest product and after three refreshes and 5 minutes I still couldn't get the third image to show - real big speed improvement! lol*

It's working for me. The site has been consistently much faster for the last several days.

Prior to last week, I regularly experienced time lags just as you describe. But not now.

Also, I am seeing the same speed increase from both of my ISP's -- one a cable connection, and the other a DSL.

Something is different. Personally, I'm glad about the difference. Too bad it doesn't seem to be working for everyone.

Something To Do At 3:00AM

Hi Clint.

What if I was away for longer than a week? How can I see older "new products"?
"What's hot" is still the same as "What's new", just the sequence is different.
I don't really mind the missing general Warehouse link. This stuff is better best forgotten anyway.
This background color is a abominable abomination. I fucking hate it with a passion.

1. What if I was away for longer than a week? How can I see older "new products"?

I'm sort of inclined to agree with you on this one.

But it won't ruin my day if they decide not to change it.

3. I don't really mind the missing general Warehouse link. This stuff is better best forgotten anyway.

In the past, I've found some great deals in the warehouse.

Once in a while, yard sales have something worth buying. And one never knows -- that paint-by-numbers picture might be covering up a Picasso.

Something To Do At 3:00AM

"What if I was away for longer than a week? How can I see older "new products"?" Select the All ICON next to the Poser link from the main MarketPlace page and go back to the date you need to browse from. That will display only Poser based products. How long do you feel that something should be considered "New"? Clint

Clint Hawkins
MarketPlace Manager/Copyright Agent

All my life I've been over the top ... I don't know what I'm doing ... All I know is I don't wana stop!
(Zakk Wylde (2007))

How long do you feel that something should be considered "New"?

Admittedly, any "What's New" time frame is an arbitrary time frame. One week? Two weeks? Three weeks? What if someone takes a 3-month trip down the Amazon, and isn't near a computer for that entire period?

For this reason, I am curious as to why one needs any time frame at all? Why not just arrange all products by date, with no time frames?

As I indicated in my last post, this isn't the type of issue that will cause me to threaten to "go away forever!" or to "spend my money somewhere else!".

I've never found the petty to be intolerable. Good thing, too. If I did, I would never read the forums.

Something To Do At 3:00AM

XENOPHONZ, Your funny. :) The way I understand it is that it would be taxing on the servers to display everything from day one when showing whats new. Its for this reason that we limited it to 7 days. We have to find a balance with site performance and functionality. Clint

Clint Hawkins
MarketPlace Manager/Copyright Agent

All my life I've been over the top ... I don't know what I'm doing ... All I know is I don't wana stop!
(Zakk Wylde (2007))

*XENOPHONZ, Your funny. :)

Yeah......people tell me that all of the time.

*The way I understand it is that it would be taxing on the servers to display everything from day one when showing whats new.

Its for this reason that we limited it to 7 days.
We have to find a balance with site performance and functionality.*

Sounds perfectly reasonable to me.

I suppose if one takes a two-week vacation, and needs to catch up afterwards, then one will have to search products by category.

Personally, I don't take enough two-week vacations to make this a matter of great concern to me.

Something To Do At 3:00AM

I'd say that a period of about 30 days would be sufficient for "what's new". That seems like a reasonable length of time, and has plenty of precedent. bonni

"When a man gives his opinion, he's a man. When a woman gives her opinion, she's a bitch." - Bette Davis

Forum: Community Center

Subject: The Renderosity