Hello all. I've seen Andygraph's various cyborg/android sets out there, and have always been interested in them. I haven't bought any, mainly because I don't know what I need to buy to use them. I realize Andygraph's english isn't very good, so perhaps someone can concisely list what each of the sets consists of and what is required to use them (meaning which products are required AND what steps have to be taken to use them.) Then perhaps Andygraph can get someone to re-explain in the product descriptions or Readme files for the various items. Thanks! Jeff

I bought the bioborg. Bioborg does work with V1, V2 and the milkids. I asked him why he couldn't remap the file to V3, eventually with UTC, but fact is that he created his own UVMap, and UTC won't recognise that/cannot translate it. What you have to do is open the V3obj in UVMapper, load Andy's UVmap and then save the obj under a specific name in a specific location. You need a different V3 (the same obj file but with another uvmap). This he cannot do for you as the V3 mesh cannot be redistributed. When you don't use UVMapper you get the following result:

I have tried prudent planning long enough. From now I'll be mad. (Rumi)

The PT as example for the V2mesh:

I have tried prudent planning long enough. From now I'll be mad. (Rumi)

Bioborg WORK FINE WITH V1/2 and with V3toV2 cr2 of Victoria3 !!! tested from me, beta tester of RENDEROSITY and from all buyer of Bioborg ! The IT.A.03 bioborg UVS file fix little problem of uvs file from DAZ (about the lips and nostril): free uvs from daz for use the V1/2 textures on V3: mac- http://secure.daz3d.com/Update/Victoria3UVs.sit pc- http://secure.daz3d.com/Update/Victoria3UVs.exe Victoria 3 have a cr2 character for use the V1/V2 textures, runtime/libraries/character/DAZPeople/Vicki3toVicki2sr1.cr2

With V1/2 is not need use the uvs file ;-) just apply my textures to character

Thanks for the replies. Not so interested in the Bioborg, but the Ita.01 and .02 mainly.

Ok, back to my original post. For the Ita.01, What do you have to buy to use the textures?? Can I use the base pack without all the other parts and still have a full body texture? What do the other sets in .01 give you?

For IT.A.01 body skin only poser 4 For others mech items of IT.A.01 just Poser 4 and photoshop or another 2d paint software

Ok, so when your description says you need all the other .01 items to build the model, does that mean the .01 base skin is not complete?

I have ITA02 and 03, but not the first one. IMO, these are amazing characters. I have used them quite a lot, but not in gallery renders. What you get for 02 is a set of new textures and UVs to remap your V1/2. There's a special CR2 which sits a heavily morphed V1/2 inside another. The outer body takes one set of textures and a transmap, the inner takes the mechanical parts. I also produced a new texture set for ITA02, Sweetie Pi, which has a human/plastic outer skin and a "biomechanical" inner. Andygraph's original version is definitely mechanical, and has an insane level of detail. It does take a little time to set up but it's worth the effort because the results are stunning. I haven't yet set up Bioborg (03) but when I do, I will definitely be using it a lot.

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Thanks for the info, Sam, but I'm still not getting answers to the questions. But let's go with .02. What do you have to buy to get the basics out of this set? Do you need all 4 or however many there are? Will just one get you the basics? The descriptions are not obvious by any means. Thanks, Jeff

No need to panic! Yes, like I said, on V1,2 and the milgrls the texture works fine. On V3 not, unless, indeed you use this V3/V2 version which I never used before for anything. And this is NOT (I'll also use capitals, just like you) mentioned in the readme or the tutorial. In both you only speak of UVmapper, not of V3/V2. Besides: I doubt whether this is a full V3. I like the bioborg, and I'm happy with it, and I would buy it again. So: yes: it's very good. But you must understand that your English is even worse than mine, and that your readme's are difficult to understand.

I have tried prudent planning long enough. From now I'll be mad. (Rumi)

Ok, you're talking to Andy and not to me, right? ;)

Jeff, it's been a while since I bought and installed these, so I'm working from memory (ha!) here. The first pack is the textures and CR2 for the outer body. You get 3 different texture sets, all of which are compatible with V1/V2. This pack can be used as a standalone. The next ones are where it gets complicated. The add on packs require you to remap V1/2 and save the result as a different named OBJ. This will take the mechanical inner parts. Each of the add on packs has a texture file for the inner, and a transmap to work on the outer tex. The outer body uses the same textures as the first pack, ie, it's totally V1/2 compatible. So, the short answer is, yes, you'll get the basics if you buy the first pack, but you won't get the inner body or any of the mechanical bits. Hope that's helped.

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The obj source of V3/V2 is the same of V3 but it is only remapped on uv coordinate. So .. you can use bioborg with victoria 3

IT.A.01 products

Sam, that helps a bit. Thanks. Can I assume that the .01 and .02 work in the same fashion? You don't NEED all of the items to get the outer skin look, only if you want the innards too? Jeff

That's about the size of it, Jeff. You can use the inner bits as standalones, though. What you get is a remapped V1/2 with whatever mechanical parts you have mapped onto it. It's only the full cyborg that uses both inner and outer models. As Andygraph shows above, the ITA01 does something similar, although I believe the mechanical parts used in that version are new geometry.

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IT.A.01 Mech products (smart-props + textures)

I think I'm getting it now. Andygraph, would be nice if you offered these in bundles at a reduced price... Thanks all! Jeff

Cyborg IT.B.01 You will need to have this items, before you can get IT.B.01 for free:

IT.A.01 Body texture
IT.A.01 Mech Head
IT.A.01 Mech Arms
IT.A.01 Mech Legs

So, if you have all the stuff listed above, IT.B.01 is free for you.
Simply send me your request, and I will send you the new cyborg texture.

Message edited on: 06/13/2004 17:13

Message edited on: 06/13/2004 17:16

I can't change the price of my products .. and any my series have a product already in bundle ... Sorry but any good product have the own price, and who work, dear Jeff, like GC artist ... know it ;-)

Didn't quite catch all that, so I guess the answer is no.

One last question (well maybe not THE last), are there any plans to make all your cyborg stuff for the male characters as well (apart from the mention of the B skin.)? Thanks, Jeff

the new version IT.A.03 anatomy Head (for V3) use the same template of IT.A.02 mech head and will be the same in future for Torso, Legs, and Arms .. But V3 have the male morph pack, look here: http://secure.daz3d.com/shop.php?op=itemdetails&item=1143

I know there's a V3 male morph pack, but those don't really look male to me. Thanks anyway.

this is another ... Ghost V3 Male Pack http://secure.daz3d.com/shop.php?op=itemdetails&item=1324

lol, I'd rather not buy more stuff than I have to... That one requires the V3 male morph pack, that's $40 worth of stuff. No thanks. I already have M1, M2, M3....

I have to agree, they are priced out of my league as well. Marque

Very cool looking stuff.. but it's what, $55 for the set, and you also need the original characters as well? That does get a little steep...

Way too many people take way too many things way too seriously.

ITALIANO Sono interessato alle serie Cyborg ITA da parecchio tempo, specialmente agli arti meccanici, ma purtroppo sono per Posette (P4 Standard Female) che ormai non uso da anni, da quando ciosono passato ai personaggi di DAZ. Vorrei sapere se sarebbe possibile per te adattarli per essere usati con V3, Stephanie 3 Petite e il nuovo David (che decisamente meglio di M3) o in alternativa M2. Per le texture non dovrebbero esserci particolari problemi visto che V3 e S3 usano le stesse UV e quindi con UVMapper si potrebbe creare una versione dellobj compatibile con le textures. Capisco che richieda tempo e che creare contenuti per Poser non la tua attivitprincipale, ma penso che aiuterebbe le vendite della serie sapere che disponibile per il maggior numero di personaggi possibile. Gradirei sapere se cqualche speranza :) Grazie Stefano ENGLISH I have been interested in the Cyborg ITA series, in particular the mechanical limbs, for a long time, but they are set up for the P4 Standard female (Posette) and I havent used it since I purchased DAZ characters. I would like to know if it would be possible for you to adapt them to V3, Stephanie 3 Petite end the new David (since it is far better than M3) or as an alternative to M2. As far as regard the textures it should not be a problem since V3 and S3 use the same UV and with UVMapper I could create a create a version of the obj compatible with the textures. I understand that it would require time and creating Poser content it is not your main job, but I think that it would help sales of the whole series if the add on were available for the most of the current characters. Please let me know if there is a hope :) Thanks Stefano

Ciao Stefano ;-)

Per ora IT.A.01 solo per posette .... i props possono essere utilizzati percon altri personaggi, c'giusto un pdi lavoro da fare ;-)
qui c'uno schema su come i props sono collegati al personaggio posette:
http://www.renderosity.com/messages.ez?Form.ShowMessage=528949

IT.A.02 (standard,Fire,water) invece compatibile con V1/2/3:
http://market.renderosity.com/softgood.ez?ViewSoftgood=9162

le parti mech di IT.A.02 sono compatibili, per ora, solo con V1/2

Sto sviluppando IT.A.03 Anatomy: un nuovo set di texture map per Victoria 3

IT.A.03 Anatomy Head per Victoria3 gidisponibile su marketplace:
http://market.renderosity.com/softgood.ez?ViewSoftgood=28983

quest'ultimo prodotto compatibile anche con le texture meccaniche di IT.A.02 Mech Head !!

Message edited on: 06/14/2004 05:03

i prodotti IT.A.02 Mech IT.A.03 Anatomy usano un proprio e unico UV template

Yes, the stuff looks quite good. But way too expensive for me :o( Half the price might have done it for me. The secret is of course - low price sells many copies, which gives MORE profit. Not less. :] Fish

I'm a professional designer not make it for hobby ... If is a good way for you .. make it FishNose ;-) I hope only a your client don't undervalue your work. Andygraph

Grazie per le informazini e per il link al tutorial. Avevo capito che fossero gidei conforming characters per Posette e non solo delle parented props. immagino che importandole tutte nella scena e posizionandole accuratamente potrei esportare il tutto come nuovo obj e far puntare il cr2, per esempio, di M2 a questo nuovo character in modo da ottenere uno scheletro meccanico che pustare dentro M2... questo se sono stati mantenuti i nome delle varie parti, altrimenti sarebbe necessario creare nuovi gruppi prima di esportare. Devo cercare un po' sui vari forum informazioni su come maneggiare i cr2 perchnon ho mai fatto niente di cosavanzato... Ah, Complimenti per la nuova release :)

There is such a thing as what the market will support. Overpriced items will tend not to sell as much, regardless of how good they are. But again, it's your choice. I can say right now, that judging from this thread, lower pricing would have gotten you 5 or 6 more sales, and that's just the people that are responding.... Speaking for myself, if I could have gotten all the It.A.01 for $30, and all of the .02 for $30, I would have. Jeff

I want a good car but now i can't take it .. so i gone to merchant of car and say .. "If could have gotten this new car for 2000 dollars, I would have ;-)"

Yeah, it's called making a deal, happens all the time. And sellers of items try to make incentives for people to buy their stuff. Right now I have very little incentive, due to price, and work that has to be done after the product is purchased. It's almost like, you buy the car, but we don't paint it for you. Here's your bucket of paint and a brush, go for it. Jeff

Considering what a good hair model costs... at far less detail, I think the prices are fair. If sci-fi is your field and you need robots and sexy droids, then you can either put the time and sweat and skill into making your own, or purchase something well-made. At minimum wage, this is a day's pay. Could you make it yourself in a day? Nesting files so that the joints align is not the easiest job in the world. This is far more than a texture map! Carolly

And there are other products out there that are pretty good too. I think I'll look to them since they're more complete and easier to use. This may be incentive for other modelers to do something similar, or maybe Andy will have a sale or something. Who knows. Just voicing my opinion. And by the way, looked at the readme file for the .01, and there's no mention of having to do all the UV Mapping and such. one would think that's the place to find such things. I think better communication could have avoided this thread altogether. Jeff

many thx hauksdottir ;-) So Jeff i can't help you: if you want buy .. fine, if not .. is not my problem, bye.

lol, nice attitude andy, you made my decision for me. Very "Professional".

sure ... about you sure ;-)

Andygraph, Your models are great and very professional! Keep up the good work! Do not listen to anyone who says otherwise. We appreciate your work and think they are worth what you charge for them. :) Jay

Many thx Jay ;-)

Just an observation.. I have seen the products in the marketplace for a very long time... and I drool at the dream of someday owning them, however... I am on a severely fixed income (I have been disabled since I was 21) and will likely never have the $$ to spend on all 5 of the products. I watch the poser sites regualrly (Rosity, DNA, PoserPros, etc..) and never have seen them anywhere but at Rosity. Would it not be possible to market the products on several sites, at a cheaper price? Maybe offering a "full package" price of $45 (instead of the $67 it is now?) Andy stated that he is a "professional" and not a hobbyist, but I believe most of the members here at Rosity are hobbyists. With wider spread marketing, sales should increase which would (should) more than cover the costs of time and effort put into the initial creation of the products. I am not attacking anyone, and Andygraph can literally do whatever he wishes with his products, but listening to potential customers could have a drastic effect on sales for the better. Just my .02 Lee

My products are and wil be ever stand-alone no package no sale. Just my point ;-)

ahh .. i have forgotten .. longer to many hobbyst here, many many professional illustators and cg artists and 1 or 3 filmaker (i don't remember) have purchase my products ;-)

Message edited on: 06/14/2004 12:08

Wow... I hate to say it, but I will never purchase the products after that statement. Even had I the resources to do so. I don't know about Italy.. but they have this thing in the United States called "cutomer service" ... (http://www.eyefortransport.com/glossary/cd.shtml) Customer Service The way in which during a commercial relationship the wishes and demands of the (prospective) client are catered for. Supporting activities at the customer interface adding value to a product (CEN273). If that is the stand a vendor takes toward customer service, I see no point in supporting them, regardless of the quality of the product they make. I know the packs have been sold, and I see the reviews left stating the quality, but I will not support a vendor with such views. Ciao Lee

That's the way I feel about it Lee. After my last post I went and bought KromeKat's Andromeda IV texture. Sure it doesn't have all the internal niceties that the IT series has, but attitude is what drove me there. So my RPG book will have KromeKat's stuff in it and appropriate kudos and references. I've also found that very few reviews left by people are really honest. I've bought many products that had nothing but "Wow! This is great!" and was pretty disappointed. Sure, Andy can charge what he wants, and maybe his stuff is "professional" in appearance, though certainly not in documentation and service. Long way to go there, and not worth my money. Jeff

bye

Really incredible.

yes incredible

There's more to being "professional" than delivering a quality product. The devil is in the details ... one being service, another being courteous.

You've hit the nail on the head there PabloS.

I repeat 1 2 3 times ... now i don't want modify my price or undersale or make a pack to half price ... so: i have explane my points ... so who don't want understand ????

I'm not trying to say you should lower your price ... just that you should be more sensitive to potential customers before touting yourself as professional. Be willing to listen rather than going on the defensive is a start. These people were actually making sound statements providing recommendations that would increase your potential profitability (something a professional would be interested in) but you cut them down.

thx for your suggestions so ... but i too can give suggestions ;-)

I don't think there is any discourtesy intended here. You all have to remember andygraph is not a native English speaker, so sometimes the nicteies of communication are lost. I bought the complete ITA 02 package and got the freebie, and now I have the ITA03 package. Both are incredible in the amount of detail and flexibility they offer. There's a massive amount of work put into them and I for one think they are worth the price. I make and sell textures, so I know the amount of work goes into these things. Remember, I also made an alternate texture set for ITA02, and I was nearly tearing my hair out at the amount of work incvolved. I can understand how some potential buyers would think it's a high price, well, so did I but I bought the packs separately when I could afford them. I think it's unfair to say what a right or wrong price should be, and doubly unfair when you accuse a merchant of poor customer service when they won't give in to badgering. The price is right for some people, not right for others. The merchant has a right to set the price of their choosing, and that should be the end of the matter.

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many thx Sam ;-) I hope this your comment can to clarify all now.

SamTherapy, I've seen you on the forums and have a great deal of respect for what I've seen you both post and offer as products in the marketplace. I also noted that you were one of the purchasers that left a review on the product. But, I must disagree with the statement of "badgering." My initial post on the topic was intended as a suggestion that would (IMO) make all parties happy.. The Vendor would have almost guaranteed increase of sales.. and potential customers (like me) would have an easier time getting a higher quality product. This suggestion was met with, what in my opinion is, rudeness. I wish him all the luck with future sales... sincerely.. but I will not be one to do so simply for his statements.

LeeEvans, first to give a negative comment about a product is better try it first or your comment will not have a real value.

Andygraph, I can't test a product I cannot afford.. that was the point of my first post: "I have seen the products in the marketplace for a very long time... and I drool at the dream of someday owning them, however... I am on a severely fixed income (I have been disabled since I was 21) and will likely never have the $$ to spend on all 5 of the products." - In addition.. if you notice, I never said it was a poor product, quite the contrary... my "negative statements" have been due to my perception of your "customer service."

Message edited on: 06/14/2004 14:07

ok sorry ;-) but anyway i repeat again ... the products are stand alone LeeEvans ... so you can bulding character step by step ... you don't have 10 or 14 dollars for take your first part ?

Message edited on: 06/14/2004 14:14

Lee, I'll have to respectfully disagree with you about andygraph's rudeness. I honestly believe there was no intent there and it's more to do with something being lost in translation, as it were. And maybe you're right on my comment about badgering. It seemed that way to me at the time, though. I'm just trying to defend a merchant here but I'm not going to attack another forum member (you or anyone else) in the process. As for the product review I left, that's my total honest opinion of the set.

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Andy, Let me explain... I make $715.00 a month... After rent, utilities, food, and other required expenses.... I have very little left in the way of "free money" ... more accurate to say I almost never do... this is NOT your problem, and I understand this completely... But, with as many posts from people here on limited incomes, my suggestion was just that... a suggestion that I felt would benefit all.. you AND potential customers. Your responses to that suggestion has been, AGAIN IMO, rudeness... Yes, you have stated time and again that the product is "as is" an you will not bundle-package it for a lower price. Kudos to you for sticking to your guns. However, in being so rigid, you have shown me that you do not care what a customer, or potential customer thinks or feels.. you are (seem) to be more motivated by how much you get for it. THAT attitude is what I choose not to support. Do you understand my point? I realize that English is not your native language. Lee

Well, native english speaker or not, all I saw here from the merchant WAS rude comments. I sure hope it is due to language problems and that it is not reflecting the true attitude of the vendor. Professionalism is not just about how you CREATE your stuff.

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Pablos, all comments well presented and agreed with. As a Poser merchant myself, I always go back in forth in my mind how I can offer the best value for something I create. Sometimes (like with the hippolicious stuff) it creates A LOT more work on my part.. but I try to look at other products out that I've purchased myself, and what I thought was a good value for the money, and what I didn't. IMHO, that's part of being a professional artist and valuing opinions of potential customers is VERY important as well. Some people liek to keep everything under wraps until it's released.. I'd MUCH prefer getting feedback before I release something, and find out that I either screwed something up many people want, or that someone comes up with a great idea that I'd wished I'd implimented.

Way too many people take way too many things way too seriously.

I'm sorry LeeEvans, sorry if i don't understand you, i hope to you in future will not have problem to purchase any product on MP.

I agree with you ernyoka1 .. and i believe about respect for the work of a guy and his value too.

Gareee,
Ah! You brought up another good point. Value. A good number of people, probably the majority, also factor "service" into that equation. An arrogant, argumentative attitude doesn't instill confidence that service will be delivered and the market will determine it's value, not the merchant ... which is generally the case anyways (economics 101) and the point others were trying to make.

Message edited on: 06/14/2004 19:40

There are some tensions and implications in this thread which may or may not be merited. I do not wish to see it spiral downwards into an unprofitable argument from what are obviously fixed positions. Carolly Poser Coordinator

I don't want this thread to descent into mudslinging either. I admire the innovative thinking that made those cyborgs possible, it is a novel idea and apparently very well executed (I do not own them so I can only judge from the marvellous pictures) It only goes to show how carefull you have to be when you're not a native english speaker, to not thread on someone's toes. Now, being one of the foreigners myself, I do take care, yet I've probably crossed some limits over time too, due to ignorance. If you're finding yourself in something that is, or easily could develop into, an argument, it is often best to leave in silence, unless you're VERY sure of how to argue without throwing a fit. There are LOTS of threads here where I have wanted to say something, but has eventually stayed out of, because I wasn't sure how to phrase my words so that they wouldn't be misunderstood. This has nothing really to do with the Andygraph personally. It is triggered by this thread but could as well have been triggered by someone else. Andygraph makes some very fine products. If he chooses not to put them in bundles or on sale, then it is his descision is his, and his alone. He sticks to that descision, and that's admirable.

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This is really going overboard. I can certify that most of this is due to a language problem. Andygraph contacted me to try and explain me better in Italian how the product works and how to customize it for other figures. He was very kind and helpful even if Im not one of his customer and even if we remained on topic, that is his products and how they work, and didnt touched the corollary of customer service, from our discussion I think I understand his point. When he say that he is a pro illustrator he doesnt say it for vanity, but he means that he do it for a living and having been exploited myself in the past I can understand how one could make a principle of being paid what he thinks is due for his work. His livelihood depends on his ability to be paid fairly for the work he does. To say that he offer bad customer service because he does not want to sell at the price YOU WANT is wrong IMHO. We were all spoiled by DAZ and the other big Poser stores that have huge catalogues and resources and can afford to undervalue their best products and sell them as loss leader for 1,99 to increase sales of other items. He set his prices based on the time and effort invested and thinks that those prices are fair both for himself and his customer. Maybe he is wrong, maybe not. What he said is simply this: Do you think that the product is worth the price? Then buy it. Do you think that the product is not worth the price? Then no problem, dont buy it The fact that most people here are hobbyist is just OUR problem. I too right now have to buy what I need or could use for a picture, but it is only my fault if I cant find the time to improve my skill. Sorry I had to add my 2 cents because I read some unpleasant and really unneeded comment about how WE in Italy treat our client that really unset me.

Hmm A post like # 52 where Andygraph only says "bye"... I dunno.. Saying "ciao" to someone may be nice in italy, but to only post a "bye" in english would be considered rude by a lot of people, like he's dismissing them, turning his back on them. He does it twice really, some posts higher up So Jeff i can't help you: if you want buy .. fine, if not .. is not my problem, bye. , and at that point he should have discovered (IMO) that such an attitude (whether he intended it or not) was seen as rude, yet he posts a simple "bye" later on. I AM sure it's all caused by language problems. It just (unfortunately) doesn't change the fact that he has alienated a lot of potential customers here. And that's a real shame, I think. Those cyborgs are awesome. Expensive, but again, if you can't afford them, don't buy them. At least there's SOME consolation in a merchant that doesn't put his (or her) stuff on sale all the time - Noone will buy it when it's a the regular price if something is on sale every second week. Now we KNOW we won't have to wait for Andygraph to have a sale :o) The price will remain the same. And that's not necessarily a bad thing.

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Jeff i'm sorry, wrote what you don't have understand in readme file of my products and how i need write it. About the prices of my products, how i has say,i don't will make any sales or pack to low price: for the real value of my product, and respect for who has purchase it before. Best Regards; Andygraph

To those who are griping and crabbing about the cost of Andygraph's stuff, let remind you that 'rosity takes 50%, that's HALF of price on anything sold here so on a $40 sale you come up with -$20 for 'rosity's cut leaving $20 for the merchant THEN, you take off whatever the exchange rate is for the home country of the item's creator, the Euro in this case, so a $40 item ain't getting the creator any more than a $20 dollar bill and that's ONLY if the creator lives in the US. btw, that $20 is currently only 16.47 euro so Andygraph ain't making a lot per sale

Why shouldn't speech be free? Very little of it is worth anything.

True, Charlie :o) But that goes for ALL the merchants here though. And still imo it's better to sell 10 sets of 20$ than 2 of 40. But that's just me.

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You just can't put the words "Poserites" and "happy" in the same sentence - didn't you know that? LaurieA
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Maybe there's a few more bites taken out of that 20 other than the conversion rate that has to be figured in too

Why shouldn't speech be free? Very little of it is worth anything.

My opinion: I am European, and we do have a less strict "code" of behaviour when it comes to rudeness etc. The aruments Andy uses "when you don't buy it's not my problem, bye" is typical and normal when adressing people who want to bargain prices etc on markets. Some of you here want him to become cheaper. Your argument about "lower incomes" is also an argument of bargaining. Did you ever think of the hours Andy put into this? About the fact that he probably isn't a millionnaire himself who creates out of a strong sense of charity? The textures he creates, and the msehes most probably also are without doubt amongst the most difficult ones to create and he succeeds with flying colours. So, to come to the point: he uses the normal evryday speak of mediterranean people when someone wnts to bargain, and his top-quality works come at a price. If you can't pay for it, well, most people in the world don't even have a computer. Or even good food or medical care. Your country's economic power lies in its freedom of trade, and those who are shipwrecked can do their round of dustbins each day. Please recognise your desire to possess Andy's work and if you want to bargain: do it by e-mail or private messages, not in public.

I have tried prudent planning long enough. From now I'll be mad. (Rumi)

Aeneas: You said it: ""when you don't buy it's not my problem, bye" - he uses the normal evryday speak of mediterranean people" :o) Well, I'm European too, and if a RL merchant spoke to me that way, I would walk away in fury and never set foot in that store again. It may be normal in Italy but I can assure you it is NOT in Denmark, and I've never encountered it in other northern european countries either. And once again it just goes to show how carefull you have to be when you are dealing with foreigners. They may not understand you or your intentions. I am sure by now, that Andygraph didn't in any way mean to insult people, but the fact is that it was CONCIEVED that way. The damage is done so to speak. Apologies (and I'm not saying Andygraph should apologize) doesn't always heal broken relations.

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You just can't put the words "Poserites" and "happy" in the same sentence - didn't you know that? LaurieA
  Using Poser since 2002. Currently at Version 11.1 - Win 10.

sorry ernyoka1 but who have insult first me or JeffAlberts? this is the REAL question ;-)

I don't have make any insult.

Andygraph, I am sure you have not intended to insult anyone. But you may have. By accident, the way you replied. That's all.

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You just can't put the words "Poserites" and "happy" in the same sentence - didn't you know that? LaurieA
  Using Poser since 2002. Currently at Version 11.1 - Win 10.

I don't have any comment about pricing, but I do want to say that andygraph really went out of his way to help me with his products. I think it was the 02 series (don't exactly remember, not at my Poser computer right now)...it comes as separate textures that you map onto a copy of the obj. I was TOTALLY confused, and had a lot of trouble with the readme instructions, and tried to get the hang of the process for days. Finally, I wrote to andygraph, and after trying to assist me via IM, he took several hours with me on chat and walked me step by step through the entire process. While his native language is not English, he explained himself well, and was VERY patient. I would not have been able to utilize the textures without his help. There may be misunderstanding here because of some cultural and language differences, but my experience with andygraph shows that he cared about making certain I was able to use his product, and the amount of time he spent with me made it very clear to me.

Sgiathalaich

many thx Djeser ;-)

please ernyoka1 ... read all steps here and read better who have give support to begin and who have only obstinately UNDERVALUE with conceit and obstinately my products to 50 percent and more under of REAL value.

Ahh and more, i don't take the 100 percent of my sale!

If you say "my read me file is not wrote fine"good i can rewrote it if you explane where is wrong, but about other points .....

Message edited on: 06/16/2004 12:55

Folks, it's andygraph's choice what price he asks. Personally, I wouldn't be as definite about never reducing the price. I can see the markets shift as new versions of Poser, Vicky, or anything else, are released. Eventually, it might be a choice between cutting the price of an old product and not selling it. And it's still andygraph's choice. But how much Poser 3 stuff is selling now?

many thx AntoniaTiger ;-)

Hey! I haven't objected a second to Andygraphs prices. Nor have I said anything bad about his products. I am TRYING HARD to explain to him why some people see it as an insult when all he says is "bye" But since it's like talking to a wall, I will now leave this thread with a bye.

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You just can't put the words "Poserites" and "happy" in the same sentence - didn't you know that? LaurieA
  Using Poser since 2002. Currently at Version 11.1 - Win 10.

I understand your point ernyoka1 ;-) But first i has wrote "bye" (... hmm .. this insult ?!) ok, anyway, another "guy" have wrote things many more heavy to me ..

I hesitate to trample upon free speech, but feel that it is better to lock this thread before people say things which may be regrettable. Positions are hardening, and nothing constructive is coming from continued conversation despite my reminder 20 posts ago. Therefore, I am locking this thread. Carolly Poser Coordinator