Hi Folks--- I feel compelled to say that I would rather pay an annual fee to Renderosity that provides unlimited access to free downloads as a benefit of membership than to confront a banner every time I enter the FreeStuff section that won't go away until I buy something. I mean no disrespect to the contributing artists. I appreciate the hard work that goes into creating Poser props and such; I put a lot of work into my own props although I've never posted any of them here. I would submit that a better solution is to simply not put anything up for free if you think you ought to be compensated for your creative effort. I won't miss what I can't get, and if I want it badly enough, I'll pay for it. But I don't need to be constantly reminded of that. So what am I saying? I'M SAYING THAT BANNER SUCKS. Peter (Dr Zik)

Good, you can pay for me to come here too, and all the other people who can't afford to pay a fee. All banners suck, but it's something we all live with. Let's see, why don't you start a site and do it your way? What a lame thing to complain about. 8^| Marque

If you're having popup trouble either turn off java and javascript, or install a popup killer. You can find loads at download.com. One of the best is called adfilter, (free for the first 500 blocked) or there are other less comprehensive tools, which are freeware, just type in banner or popup into the search engine on the front page. later jb

Hi Folks! I don't agree with you marque. None of the other banners--including the ones that show up at the top of this page--are threatening to sit on my browser until I buy something. There's a word for that. It's like a damn mole; you can't help but notice it. And lots of people live with them. That's doesn't mean they have to like it. You're entitled to your own opinions: calling my opinion lame because you don't agree with it is uncivil and childish. If you want to get into a pissing contest with me, send me an e-mail and do it offline. Peter (Dr Zik)

I don't understand what banners you're talking about! I don't have any banners that "sit on my browser until I buy something. And I apologize for calling you lame, that was wrong, I just hate to see the freestuff go, sometimes that's the only way to learn something, by seeing how someone else went about it. I don't even notice the banners and I still say I would not want to pay to access this site. We already went through this discussion a while back and it was voted down. As for a pissing contest, I don't pee standing up so you would probably win. Marque

let's do like this: 1. whoever wanna pay let him/her/it pay 2. whoever wanna stay as is let him/her/it free one more thing: once this site becomes a pay site there will be no more free downloads beacuse it will sound ridiculous.

I feel rather left out, since I go to free stuff and go and go, and never get any popup banner wanting me to buy? Where is it? what does it do? what does it say? I want my banner... ;p

"I don't pee standing up..." Ha! I like that, and they say women don't have a sense of humour... ;> later jb

Since I am getting wonderful things for absalutely FREE, I do not mind in the least if there are banners, even pop up ones encouraging me to also purchase. You see, that is how it goes, scratch my back, and I don't bite your hand off. Really, think about it. It is not much different than the things I thought through whilst deciding who I wished to beta test Saluda. I expect something back. I am not giving her away totally scott free for my health to the beta testers, though I would love it if also respect and friendship blossomed between myself and the testers I chose to invite, I want them to give me REAL feedback I can use to get her out there into the public. So, they get her for free, but not really. See? I want them to work her out, work hard for that free model :) Same with banner ads in a way. It is a way to sort of nudge us, and encourage us, and even generate some revenue perhaps if we do not go on and buy after being nudged. They do not bother me, small price to pay to get something free :)

i don't think that Dr. Zik is refering to a pop-up.......it's a wide, green banner just above the linking images on the FreeStuff pages that reads something to the effect of purchasing something from the Online Store to make the banner go away........and i have to agree with the seemingly unanimous opinion.......the items that we get for free could very well cost quite a bit elsewhere......this community has been blessed with more talent that can ever be accounted for, and a big, honkin' green banner is much better than other, more expensive alternatives...........

Hi Folks! Apology accepted, Marque--and since you put it that way, I guess I would win! (LOL) Wolf is referring exactly to banner in question. I support in spirit its intentions. And, as I said before, the artists who provide stuff here deserve to be compensated. Certainly this should remain a free site, but if Renderosity needs money to keep it running then I am willing and ready to pony up to the bar with cash in hand. It's just the principle of the thing. The issue I have is whether or not I have a right to expect to have complete control over my computing experience--including what I can do in an online area that is supposed to be free. A significant number of people who visit Poser and Bryce forums do so to download free stuff. If Rendersoity wants something in exchange for those free visits, then perhaps they should put on a timer on each visitor's account so that access is disabled after 30 days. Or do what the adult sites do--make a finite number of freebies available and charge a membership fee to have access to the rest. But putting up a message that is too prominent to ignore and can't be turned off until I buy something is the kind of brutal marketing tactic I expect from a company like Microsoft--not a community of artists. Call me a whiner if you will--but something about that just doesn't sit well with me. Peter (Dr Zik)

adfilter will filter just about anything, banner ads of any size and dimension, applets, popups, all manner of embeded content, (shockwave, flash, etc.) you simply tell it what you don't want to see and it reworks the page on the fly, you point your browser to a local port on your own machine, and adfilter fetches the pages and munges them for you. It completely removes banners, no broken links, no empty boxes, just the content you allow and nothing more. Of course you have to pay after the first 500, but for what it does it's cheap enough (I think it's about $30) As for charging a fee to see the site, well, the problem there is that they have competition, who don't charge, so maybe they get a little cash, but they lose a lot of content & visitors. People will pay for content, but this place doesn't have any "original" content, only that which its users provide, less users, less content, less content, less viewers, and so on in a downward spiral. The only way pay per view works is if they have something you a) want to see, and b) can't get elsewhere. if either of those is false, then your premise for PPV fails, and you fail with it. later jb

Hi Folks! I notice the language in the green banner that greets me when I visit the FreeStuff section has been changed to something I can live with. Thanx, Renderosity. Peter (Dr Zik)

Sometimes banners are good, like when they inform you of a great deal on software or something like that.

How weird, I have never seen the banner. I have cookies set to prompt and I get a lot of "do you want this cookie?" I say no after the first two. But I've never seen the banner, that is too strange. I would probably be ticked off too, if you're going to buy something you should do it because you want it, not out of guilt. I think it's good to support the free stuff area, but I was under the impression that we support it by trading our skills, whatever they are...models, textures, tutorials, advice on stocks..er..no..strike that one! lol Oh well, at least they changed it. Now back to our regular programming. 8^) Marque

it is also another example of the fact this place, though it is a "global" community so to speak. the store itself is for the american market and the rest be damned. it is somewhat difficult for a foreign buyer to purchase something there and nearly impossible to put something there for sale if you are not from the United States. Now it is understandable as the U.S. is the largest market and the location of the site, but to put a banner up implying those who don;t buy are free loaders and parasites is downright insulting if you aren;t an american user/buyer.

I post stuff in the freestuff, I do it 'cos I've downloaded more than I've created and it's a way of saying thanks. It doesn't do the ego any harm when you see how many people have downloaded your creations either. The banner is just that, a banner. I don't like its tone and it is rather pervassive but hey, you can still download.

Hi Folks! I've weighed in enough on this already--and I appreciate all the points that have been brought out. X-per makes one that deserves further consideration. Peter (Dr Zik)

Anything that keeps this wonderful site here, moving, growing, and keeps us all collaborating as we do is fine by me, banners, no banners, monthly membership fee, whatever. I am fine on it all. I even go buy in the store when I have the money to do so.

X-perimentalman, I agree with your point. Being a non US resident, I became acutely aware, of this situation a few months again in relation to the store, when the moderators posted a message say, "Foreigner" could now place orders. This came as a bit of a shock to me, as I was always being told, and was under the impression, this community was one big family. Sorry to meander off topic a bit, but I'm obviously not the only one that noticed this sometimes. I know it's just semantics but it still matters:( Regards, Tribe.

pondering a thought - local tv programming is free but one has to sit through annoying "commercials" for this free service. Should one "pay" for local tv programming to avoid the "commercials", or accept them for face value. There are good and bad sides to this issue for each individual. -or- walking into a retail store is free. Even if nothing is purchased. There are sometimes annoying "muzac" commercials over the intercom systems there. Should one "pay" the store to enter it, so at not to hear the "muzac" and still not buy anything, but just browse around? just a though or two... TMG p.s. i say keep this site free. all the hard work the modelers and artists put here for free helps stimulate my own creative thoughts and ideas.

heyas; i'm ambivalent about the whole thing. yeah, i noticed it. then ignored it. i'm good at ignoring things ;) a note to people who promote ad suppressors... the green banner ad is NOT a banner or a pop up. i believe it is simply text in a table with a green background. ain't no banner blocker, pop-up disabler, or turning java stuff off gonna get rid of it.

bloodsong: I read though this whole thread and you slipped in at the last moment and beat me to it. [grumble, grumble] =) Looks like an instant message ('cept not blue) to me; but then I can only see the new, friendly version. Marque: If you know what your doing the odds in that contest are 50:50.

{walking into a retail store is free. Even if nothing is purchased. There are sometimes annoying "muzac" commercials over the intercom systems there. Should one "pay" the store to enter it, so at not to hear the "muzac" and still not buy anything, but just browse around?} Uh, this is even more complex than that... If a store plays a radio station, they can be sued by any artist who has their music played for royalties (I've only heard of one case going to court, and it was settled before it could be tried, but most states have a law to this effect, or so I've heard!). Muzak is purchased "royalty free" and most of the commercials that you hear on it are added in at the corporate level, and are only for that store, it's chain, and/or its affiliates. The cost of Muzak (or lawsuits!) is charged to the consumer - they pay for it whenever they purchase anything. There are some stores where I WOULD be happy to pay to NOT hear the Muzak if I had the option... Hmm. I seem to be rambling and on a tangent. Probably should just delete this but I'm an idiot (just ask my wife!).

you know... not to start nothin' here, but... if you want to pay a fee to not see the banner, just buy something in the store. anything. something you don't want, it doesn't matter. the 'fee' will be paid, and the banner will go away. okay, i'm not ambivalent any more. i think that banner/note/threat whatever you want to call it is no worse than when public radio/tv stations are in pledge drives. then it's like 'call in with your pledge now, or we won't show the second half of masterpiece theatre vs monty python.' it may be annoying, it may be dirty and rotten, but.... they gotta do it. i mean, it's not like renderosity is threatening to not let you download free goodies if you don't contribute. just my side, other opinions may vary.

also... i hope you won't take your banner displeasures out on the artists of the store. if your favorite snack food came out with a stupid commercial, would you stop buying it? if some actor whom you LOATHE plugged your favorite breakfast cereal, would you switch brands? advertising really has no effect on product quality, only public opinion. you guys are a tough audience. :)

ahhhh...bloodsong i have tried to buy from the store in the past..... and it was not a nice experience...simply because i do not live in the U.S. and the end result is i don;t have the item i wished to purchase... and i am also am not out any money... let me make that very clear... it didn;t cost me anything... it just didn;t work.... and it may or may not be better now... but i don;t feel like reliving the frustrating experience. i just don;t like the location of the message... only on the free stuff..not the whole site and all the implications that carries.

bloodsong: I've know people to hate a car based on one billboard (Dodge Neon 'Hi!'); so it may be worse than you think. Maybe the store could use PayPal to charge one US penny to turn off the ad for that visit only. Market segmentation, get in under their price point and watch the dough (people who visit times per cent who care times one penny) come rolling in.

heehe! yeah, then paypal wants a fee for so many transactions -- it considers you a business user. ah well. (gee, i thought those neon cars were cute in their ads.)

heyas; x-per and all, i was thinking about what you said... about foreign orders and troubles with the store and blah blah blah. and exchange rates, etc etc. and you guys are right! some people CAN'T buy from the store. and (DUH) i am one of them!!! now there's no sense holding people hostage who CAN'T pay their ransom. anyway, the banner is gone now, so... i should just shut up. but i wanted you guys to know that you won your argument. good job :) thanks tim, jeff, and crew for listening to the people's opinions, there. :)

yes... and thanks for telling me the banner was gone... since i had decided to not be a parasite... so to speak... and wasn;t going to the freestuff section at all.... and one day maybe.... foreign orders will be somewhat simpler or surer in there...because to be honest there is some things in the store that i truly covet..:}

Is the banner gone? Nobody tells me anything Anyway, I think I'll move this thread to the Team contact board.

Hmm.. the smiley didn't make it in my message. "Nobody tells me anything ;-)"

hey! i just told ya, didn't i? :) (gee, ya think it needs an announcement?)