i have tried saving images in smaller formats to be thumbnails, but nothing works ... the upload message chastises me for not fitting the 50 - 200 pixel range, and yet i have no idea how many pixels across the images are any help would be appreciated thanks

There are basically 2 ways to make thumbnails. You can save your full size image in your fractal generator and then change the size to 200x200, but that doesn't always get you under the file size of 15k. The other way is to take your full size image to a graphics program like PhotoShop or Paint Shop Pro and resize it there and saving it at the quality that will give you a file size of 15k. If you don't have those programs, you might want to google 'Gimp' or 'Irfanview'. These are both free graphics programs that many of the artists here use for postwork of all kinds. HTH

Fractals will always amaze me!

well 'Irfanview' doesn't work on a mac, ya may try 'Gimp' which is also available for Mac OS X ... 'Paintshop Pro' doesnt work on a mac either hmm... anyways, i make the thumbnails in photoshop, with the 'Marquee Tools' i select the pixels which are 200x200 and copy them, then open new file, and save it as a WebPage Image, with which ya can chose how big it will be in quality OR i open ImageReady, use the 'Marquee Tool' and select and copy the pixels of 600x600, then open new document, paste, then resize it too 200x200, then Save Optimized As ... you can change the quality of that thumbnail and the file grows smaller OR use FireWorks to make your thumbnail If you have any other questions for the Macintosh feel free to message me Harmen

thanks for the help i will try Fireworks, but decided to use the Photoshop option - didn't realize that it would work so easily thanks again