I am trying to reproduce a selenium style toning (ie: rich brown darker tones while retaining grey lighter tones) using PSP9 can you give me your opinions if you think this is close or if you: like it/hate it/indifferent. I'll put up 2 images for you to look at, not so much worried about the compo or subject as the toning. Many thanks :)

And every one said, 'If we only live,
We too will go to sea in a Sieve,---
To the hills of the Chankly Bore!'
Far and few, far and few, Are the lands where the Jumblies live;
Their heads are green, and their hands are blue, And they went to sea in a Sieve.

Edward Lear
http://www.nonsenselit.org/Lear/ns/jumblies.html

Second Image: This one is slightly different to first one - less yellow.

Message edited on: 04/20/2005 11:39

And every one said, 'If we only live,
We too will go to sea in a Sieve,---
To the hills of the Chankly Bore!'
Far and few, far and few, Are the lands where the Jumblies live;
Their heads are green, and their hands are blue, And they went to sea in a Sieve.

Edward Lear
http://www.nonsenselit.org/Lear/ns/jumblies.html

Great effect! I like both, though the second seems truer to what you are trying to do. What is your process for achieving the simulated selenium toning?

Kort Kramer - Kramer Kreations

Thx Kort is it because you feel the greys are lost in the first one? I am desaturating the image then adjusting colour balance moving sliders from cyan to red and blue to yellow.

And every one said, 'If we only live,
We too will go to sea in a Sieve,---
To the hills of the Chankly Bore!'
Far and few, far and few, Are the lands where the Jumblies live;
Their heads are green, and their hands are blue, And they went to sea in a Sieve.

Edward Lear
http://www.nonsenselit.org/Lear/ns/jumblies.html

Yes, it is...but tht could just be because of the clouds in the first one. Both are terrific. If you move the cyan to red and blue to yellow, I'm not sure why your sky still appears bluish. ;) It seems like there may be a missing step here. I tried it here with this image...doesn't quite looks the same as yours.

Kort Kramer - Kramer Kreations

Hmmmmmmmmm I just tried it with that image too - it doesn't work. Perhaps because you do not have the same range of tones. It only suits some images.

And every one said, 'If we only live,
We too will go to sea in a Sieve,---
To the hills of the Chankly Bore!'
Far and few, far and few, Are the lands where the Jumblies live;
Their heads are green, and their hands are blue, And they went to sea in a Sieve.

Edward Lear
http://www.nonsenselit.org/Lear/ns/jumblies.html

Sorry, that is the result of my attempt, not the original. :) I guess it is on a image by image basis, adjusting as you go along. :]

Kort Kramer - Kramer Kreations

Here is the original if you want to give it a go. Thanks. :)

Kort Kramer - Kramer Kreations

I do like them both ;-) Good job!

Attached Link: http://www.renderosity.com/messages.ez?Form.ShowMessage=1795189

i prefer the tones in the first while the 2nd looks more like a desaturation... oh, it is :]

reminds me...
trying to find DHolman's magic tone series...
has some zipped presets
might find something of interest here to further knowledge of toning

(doug can we put this in the tut's or links in the resource center? couldn't find it there, could've sworn 'chelle put it there :/ )

Message edited on: 04/20/2005 14:51

Best I could do with this one Kort - Adj saturation -100 adj layer colour balance merge normal opacity 100% adj = shadows = cyan -red +15, magenta - green 0, yellow - blue -15, preserve luminance checked. Thanks Cyn :) I just checked through that link it is exactly what I am after. It has one problem though it is for PS so I can't see any of the curves he has used :( I have searched the web and again there is help for PS and as with Donald's examples to download, but PSP can't read those curves. So back to reinventing the wheel with PSP :) I didn't have much joy using curves command would love to know some of those values if anyone has them.

And every one said, 'If we only live,
We too will go to sea in a Sieve,---
To the hills of the Chankly Bore!'
Far and few, far and few, Are the lands where the Jumblies live;
Their heads are green, and their hands are blue, And they went to sea in a Sieve.

Edward Lear
http://www.nonsenselit.org/Lear/ns/jumblies.html

well no wonder i couldn't get those zipped files to work in PSP! LOL :]

I love both of them!!! That's exactly the kind of toning that I love!! If I had to choose though, I would pick the second one!

Downloaded the DHolman curves. Will check them out later...thanks!

Kort Kramer - Kramer Kreations

Selenium toning (and I'm speaking of wet darkroom work here) is what is used on fiber prints to provide longer archival tendencies. Depending on the dilution of the selenium with water, you will also achieve a *purplish* sometimes attractive, sometimes not hue. It really depends on the image, the artists preferences, etc. IMHO none of the above has a selenium toned look to it.... this is what it should look like.... Keep in mind color images are not normally toned in selenium... converted to bw and selenium curve added. This is the straight curve, you can add more or less to taste. Rich dark brown tones are different (which you mention in your original post)..... sepia toners, or a straight brown toner, would create that look that I think you are trying to achieve.... I think.

I am, therefore I create.......
--- michelleamarante.com

This is what the selenium curve does to a color image.....

I am, therefore I create.......
--- michelleamarante.com

Yup, 'chelle is correct. Purple. Or, with higher dilution, just a little purple. Actually, with the right image the purple looks really nice; I like it for cityscapes.

Oooooooh!! Now that changes everything!!! Thx 'chelle for the info!! Another great tip! ;)

Richard, the first image you posted DOES it for me!!!! oh man....LOVE that one! 2nd one is also wonderful, but there's a richness to the first one....not sure i can articulate what it is...maybe the tones seem a bit more muted in the 2nd one????? they're both breathtaking images!!!

Thx Michelle & Misha - that explains why I didn't think the curve I was given was working.
The curve does one thing the text says another.
Hmmm interesting .........
Have to look at toning again when it's a rainy day. I learned quite a bit from that even though it wasn't how to make a selenium tone image :) Oh hang on I did learn that too - just didn't think I did and thx again cos I learned it was suppose to look purplish :) Message edited on: 04/21/2005 03:55

And every one said, 'If we only live,
We too will go to sea in a Sieve,---
To the hills of the Chankly Bore!'
Far and few, far and few, Are the lands where the Jumblies live;
Their heads are green, and their hands are blue, And they went to sea in a Sieve.

Edward Lear
http://www.nonsenselit.org/Lear/ns/jumblies.html

Perhaps a small point, but essential: Convert the original color image to B&W using some method. --> Make sure the B&W image is in RGB color mode. Apply the Donald curves.

Attached Link: http://www.renderosity.com/viewed.ez?galleryid=938518&Start=1&Sectionid=8&filter_genre_id=0&WhatsNe

I like the purple for city-scapes.

Thx misha - yes I agree on that image it looks fabulous.

And every one said, 'If we only live,
We too will go to sea in a Sieve,---
To the hills of the Chankly Bore!'
Far and few, far and few, Are the lands where the Jumblies live;
Their heads are green, and their hands are blue, And they went to sea in a Sieve.

Edward Lear
http://www.nonsenselit.org/Lear/ns/jumblies.html