Date and time: Tuesday, August 22nd. 8am Pacific, 9am Mountain time.

Location: EFNET

channel #carrara questions
channel #carrara2 answers

DAZ special guests:

Dan Farr, President/Co-Founder

Bob Stockwell, Vice President of Sales and Marketing

Charles Brissart, Director of Software R&D

Chad Smith, Vice President of Creative

The DAZ executive team will be addressing current concerns of the
online user communities in addition to sharing future plans to better
serve its customers.

Need more EFNET and IRC info. http://www.swcp.com/~danm/chatframe.html

Ringo

Missed it. The lenghy process (a page of instructions and a dead link) to join and view made me not bother.
could someone post the text of the chat or link to the complete text, here for all to see.
Thanks

Frank Hawkins/Owner/DigitalDaydreams

Frank_Hawkins_Design

Frank Lee Hawkins Eastern Sierra Gallery Store

 

My U.S.A eBay Graphics Software Store~~ My International eBay Graphics Software Store

 

Attached Link: DAZ CHATEVENT 08-22-06

Hi,

The chatroom event was very informative. We had lots of great questions and answers.

You can download the full transcript at this location.

Very interesting reading.

It confirms that DS will be the main app integrated into Carrara and Poser will be phased out. Shame, I bought into Carrara for the Poser Factor, but that was just a coule of weeks before Daz bought. Times like this I wish I could see into the future, well at least a couple of week ahead. LOL.

What is the main reason that you need to use Poser with Carrara? If you could do 90% of what poser does in Carrara beside loading content via native import wouldn't  you be better off than having to use Poser ?

Quote - Very interesting reading.

It confirms that DS will be the main app integrated into Carrara and Poser will be phased out. Shame, I bought into Carrara for the Poser Factor, but that was just a coule of weeks before Daz bought. Times like this I wish I could see into the future, well at least a couple of week ahead. LOL.

No, Carrara is very slow and clumsy in posing the figures. It's faster and easier to pose in Poser and just tweek in Carrara. Also for the Poser Dynamics.

 

Yeah, but if u got those too :) I did not see that poser will be axed. So either I misread or there is some interpreting going on. The slowness and somewhat clumsiness is on their primary list from what I have seen and heard. Hair and cloth r very much requested...so I would be surprised if that wasn't going to be in C6. And if it wasn't much more poser friendly. I can see those points, but I for one, don't want poser for many reasons.

No need to think outside the box....
    Just make it invisible.

DAZ_Charl> well to start with we are going to work on better data exchange between
  our different packages
<DAZ_Charl> that means better import / export
<DAZ_Charl> and eventually we want them to be as integrated as possible

That last line right there, Same thing happened to Bryce. I don't use DS and I don't want it shoved down my throat like they did with Bryce.

Cloth and hair would be good. Im not trying to bash Daz, I usually support them. It's is just my opinion on what I read and what I have seen in the past.

But they won't be forcing anyone to use content as stated in this quote.

"<DAZ_Chad> We're also happy to provide content only to those with no interest in DAZ
  software. We want that content to be the best available.
<DAZ_Chad> Ideally users that come to DAZ from one specific background (either
  software or content), will learn the advantages of expanding their useage of DAZ
  products. And we want our software and content to work extremely well together.
<DAZ_Chad> As we all know, to make a 3D animation, a single person typically can't
  do it all from scratch, unless you have a year or so to devote to the effort.
<DAZ_Chad> So regardless of skill level or background, we see software as two great
  solutions that work well together. But they don't have to.
<DAZ_Chad> We just want you all to keep doing what you do so well. Keep it up! "

I have zero interest in DS.  Got Silo to replace Hex.  Now need to find a package to replace Carrara.

Daz will keep selling content for other users. Daz are not fools and are not going to cut thier throats, but what you have pointed out still proves my point farther.

<DAZ_Chad> Ideally users that come to DAZ from one specific background (either
  software or content), will learn the advantages of expanding their useage of DAZ
  products. And we want our software and content to work extremely well together.

Ringo don't you work for Daz or a mod there?

I can't turn the damn Italics off.

New post so it is writen in normal mode.

I like my Hex, I think my tutorial over at PoserPros would prove that. I like my C5Pro but I don't see support in my direction. P6 is pretty much not supported at Daz to begin with. Time will tell. There is always the Vue option.

Curious how DAZ doesn't support poser. Tons of poser stuff there and users. I actually like D|S over poser. Not as featured tho. 

Tunesy, No offense, but what is the point of those kinda comments. I am glad u got what u want and if u don't like the products fine. To just comment like that w/ nothing concrete or constructive seems immature. Why do we need to know what u r buying?

No need to think outside the box....
    Just make it invisible.

"Why do we need to know what u..."

That's a double edged sword, ren_mem.  Likewise, why do we need to know your thoughts?  The point is, I and many others are pretty disgusted in the direction some of our 3d software has taken with daz' purchase of Carrara and Hex.  I feel I've wasted a small chunk of money and a big chunk of time.  From what daz has posted so far it seems like their primary concern is support of their canned content, which is fine.  But their history of software development is not impressive.  Maybe that will change, but I'm not hopeful.  I'll be thrilled if daz continues with Carrara development at the same pace that Eovia was on, but does anybody really believe that will happen? ;)

Quote - " I'll be thrilled if daz continues with Carrara development at the same pace that Eovia was on, but does anybody really believe that will happen? ;)

You know who believes it.....us the Carrara betatesters believe it.:thumbupboth:

Cool.  But I'm the man from Missouri...show me ;)

ren_mem, I take it that you meant to say, "Curious how DAZ doesn't support poser 6.

I have to much Poser content from Daz in the past, what, 5 years, to say that they didn't support Poser. They have not put any effort into P6, which has been out for a long time, yet they still support new content for P4. P4 is what, 4 versions back? P4, PP, P5, P6.

We won't know what is in the furure of Carrara for a couple of years. Isn't that about how long for Bryce6. Though I think Bryce was most likely a complete mess when they got it. I will get that much time to play with my Carrara till then.

Thanks for the link Ringo.

Frank Hawkins/Owner/DigitalDaydreams

Frank_Hawkins_Design

Frank Lee Hawkins Eastern Sierra Gallery Store

 

My U.S.A eBay Graphics Software Store~~ My International eBay Graphics Software Store

 

No B, I wasn't under the impression that P6 was a problem, I don't use it tho so...can't judge. Plenty of people do tho and use the daz stuff so I wasn't sure what u meant.

Tunesy,
I am not trying to make anything of it. It isn't personal and I only said something because it is getting very counterproductive. But U have made it clear u r not happy over n over again (not the only one). So please don't make everyone miserable w/ simple complaining. It can't make u feel better nor anyone else. I am certainly not telling u not to share, but I hope u can share more than that.
 It doesn't add to the group imo. U have said that u don't like the company... so don't buy their products. Why hang out in a product forum and complain. There have certainly been some messes made here for all users of hex, at least, but it's just pointless now. There alot of new users that can use help I am sure...not feel bad about their purchase. I hope everyone can focus on making good stuff that's all. They r working on C6 as Ringo said and cool features are supposed to be a comin'

No need to think outside the box....
    Just make it invisible.

Well, if you don't use P6 then you wouldn't know that we have to fix the Mats for the bumps and some other things. It has nothing to do with using Daz stuff, it has to do with having to fix Daz stuff to work right in P6.

C6 cool features? That wold depend what those features are. Ringo asking what we need poser for when using carrara does not sound good to me coming from a beta tester. So, where do I get the cr2 from for the figure to import into carrara to begin with. Ringo probably can't say anything, I understand that. NDA I would guess. But That shows Daz has a very poor break down in communication with the users and that was mentioned in the chat. Keep people in the dark and they will seek light somewhere else.

I need to get back to my waterfall I've been creating in Carrara, but I need to use Poser for some dymamics to make it work.

Sounds like a total rewrite of Hex is required before a version 3 (which would fix things) is ever released.  DAZ might buy another modeling app instead of wait for a Hex 3.

www.youtube.com/user/ShawnDriscollCG

Let me clear up my  statement in regards to Poser6.

1. Carrara 5 support Poser6 that is why the carrara developers acquired the Poser6 SDK.

2. I was just wondering why  you depend so much on Poser6? Even if Carrara supports Poser6 would you like to have better character animation tools build into Carrara and not just dependt on Poser 6 for everything? That is what  I was getting at not that Poser6 won't be supported. I would much prefer having the best character animation tools in Carrara.
   I wouldn't mind loading content via NATIVE Poser import and doing kick butt animations in Carrara.
   3.  You should know by now that via NATIVE poser import you DONOT have to have poser install in order to use Poser contest .  Transposer poser imports requires  Poser4,5 or 6 to be install and it was updated to support Poser 6 for the use of Dynamic hair and clothing.

3. Relax Carrara isn't Bryce the Carrara developers are way to busy writting code . Charles just  took about  1 hour off yesterday for the Chat event and than went back to work.  All of DAZ is busy getting things set up for proving better customer support , updating  software, content  etc.

4. Just so you know I have been using and beta tested Poser3,4,5 and 6 so I am not new to Poser. But I just do not want to depend on Poser to do character animations if I am going to create the scene in Carrara I would prefer to have the character animation tools in CARRARA.

thanks for listening.

Quote - . Ringo asking what we need poser for when using carrara does not sound good to me coming from a beta tester. So, where do I get the cr2 from for the figure to import into carrara to begin with. Ringo probably can't say anything, I understand that. NDA I would guess.

I need to get back to my waterfall I've been creating in Carrara, but I need to use Poser for some dymamics to make it work.

OK, I understand what you meant now. That was a good explanation.

Thanks for filling in the blanks Ringo. ;-)

Attached Link: C5 Native Tut

B you can check out my tut on the cr2 thing to see if it helps. I will say that I have never seen textures or lighting tho that doesn't need adjustment. Often alot. The beauty of native is u can save it in Carrara. And u should be able to use particles and/ or micro displacement to make a waterfall in C5. :tt2:

No need to think outside the box....
    Just make it invisible.

Thanks for posting the link, Ringo. I'm glad I read the transcript. I'm even more glad I didn't attend the chat itself.

Rem-mem thanks, i have no problems importing my poser files, unless I screw up on a hacked Cr2, it happens. But I always read peoples tutorials, they take the time to write, the least we can do is read them. Sometimes there are little tips that you never thought of.

As for the water fall. Particles are to intensive on the system for what I'm doing. But I may need it for spray. Displacement, I'm already using. But, I'm creating the dry, wet rock with the water flowing in different steps and channels. I'm also importing terrain from carrara to Hex to cut and shape parts. This is not a quick setup thing I'm doing. It may take a couple of weeks to get it done.

B your're welcome. It is really a brief "cheat sheet" for people not using native. Water is very difficult. :D

No need to think outside the box....
    Just make it invisible.

no rigging tools for D|S discussed.

"Better integration between applications" doesn't say a lot about tools to rig or make files that go back an forth.

Currently Poser 4 Propack, Poser5, and Poser 6 are required because of the setup room to rig figures for posing and getting a poser file that can be imported into D|S, Carrara, D|S/Bryce.

In the current Daz software lineup there is no way to model in Hexagon or Carara or Bryce and rig for a poseable figure in D|S.

of course the minute that Daz does do this, there is no need for Poser support anymore and a division between Daz and Poser will become more previlant.

D|S 4 years of development, Vicki3 to Vicki4 - 4 years of developement.  I don't hold my breath for Daz to do anything inovative or quick.

The captured Chat was a big PR, didn't see anything that said otherwise to me.  Daz is Daz until of course they get enough to sell off the company.

I think Corel is ready to ditch Painter, Daz could have the entire Metacreation line, for all the good it did Metacreation.

<DAZ_Bob> Ringo?
Are there plans to have better character animation tools and support in
  both Carrara and D/S?
such as riggin tools.
<DAZ_Charl> yes we are working on improving the character animation for Carrara. Now
  that Carrara is owned by DAZ it has become even more important for us
YES!
<DAZ_Charl> and obviously Daz Studio is dedicated to character animation...
ty
Carrara has much better lighting controls and options than Studio, with
  DAZ now having Carrara, are additional light controls in Studio, specially things
  like falloffs being pushed back? The lack of controls in Studio really hurts
  developing lightsets in time and quality.
<DAZ_Charl> we are planning to move towards sharing code between the two
  applications so that we can have similar functionnalities across all our
  applications
<DAZ_Chad> Ultimately this will accelerate the time to market for functionality like
  better light controls in both Studio and Carrara.

Quote - no rigging tools for D|S discussed.

"Better integration between applications" doesn't say a lot about tools to rig or make files that go back an forth.

Currently Poser 4 Propack, Poser5, and Poser 6 are required because of the setup room to rig figures for posing and getting a poser file that can be imported into D|S, Carrara, D|S/Bryce.

In the current Daz software lineup there is no way to model in Hexagon or Carara or Bryce and rig for a poseable figure in D|S.

of course the minute that Daz does do this, there is no need for Poser support anymore and a division between Daz and Poser will become more previlant.

D|S 4 years of development, Vicki3 to Vicki4 - 4 years of developement.  I don't hold my breath for Daz to do anything inovative or quick.

The captured Chat was a big PR, didn't see anything that said otherwise to me.  Daz is Daz until of course they get enough to sell off the company.

I think Corel is ready to ditch Painter, Daz could have the entire Metacreation line, for all the good it did Metacreation.

MachineClaw,
I would say that in the case of the characters that is really marketing. The whole idea of models w/ names etc... They probably have enough time in between for content development for the characters for them and third parties, frankly if they had it too short then it would upset the whole market based on these characters. While other factors can be at play space between is really a must for that model. I seriously doubt it has taken them 4 yrs to develop a v4 series of models.

No need to think outside the box....
    Just make it invisible.

Ringo - rigging was mentioned for carrara and bettering the animation in D|S.

ren_men - Dan Farr mentioned 3d scans etc in a thread here at renderosity about 2 years ago for V4.  If after 4 years between releases of figures they haven't gotten the rigging and bending to work well, that's sad.  V4 ain't out so who knows.

my point is that Daz as a software company isn't really that reliable.  example Mimic for lightwave is for lightwave 7.5 and lightwave is now at v9.  3 major lightwave releases and Mimic for lightwave hasn't advanced.  Daz aquired Mimic.

D|S development for 4 years and no rigging tools for it produced yet.  Daz hasn't produced any D|S plugins for D|S, 3rd parties have and Daz has bought plugins by 3rd party people but Daz development internally isn't doing it.

People have been screaming for faster Byrce rendering for years, the Bryce 6 announcments all speak to posing figures in byrce with and through better integration with D|S.  Lego on Lego but not really any different or new Lego pieces.

Sorry don't mean to be so negative, just watched the Daz PR machine and the company in action for years.  I read the transcript and see it as more of the same stuff being said for years.

I understand concerns. I certainly hope w/ entire eovia us being acquired tho that this makes a difference. Only time will tell. Marketing is a good thing as long as there is somethin to back it up.

No need to think outside the box....
    Just make it invisible.

The things stated in the chat scare..... it feels like Carrara will become just another application to push D/S and through it DAZ's content. I don't like all the talk about sharing code between Carrara and D/S. I've seen it with Bryce and I've not been impressed at all. I'm still using good old Bryce 5.01..... well not as much anymore, since I've got Carrara now.

If DAZ decides to sacrifice the brilliance of Carrara also for pushing their own stuff (which is entirely their good right to do so), then I'm sure there will be an alternative around by the time DAZ's has destroyed Carrara.

Artwork and 3DToons items, create the perfect place for you toon and other figures!

http://www.renderosity.com/mod/bcs/index.php?vendor=23722

Due to the childish TOS changes, I'm not allowed to link to my other products outside of Rendo anymore :(

Food for thought.....
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pYZw0dfLmLk

I don't know that I'd be doomsday banner waver. ;) My understanding is that same software engineers that have matured Carrara from V3 through v5 are the same ones that will shepherd Carrara into the future. Bryce had no engineers to "inherit". D/S was coded from the ground up by folks that DAZ sourced. DAZ simply has more marketing money than Eovia did plus they have a very healthy customer base. Enviable assets for a parent company to have. I'll reserve my right to be cautiously optimistic. :D

My understanding is that same software engineers that have matured Carrara from V3 through v5 are the same ones that will shepherd Carrara into the future.

Yes they are, but they're paid by DAZ now......

Artwork and 3DToons items, create the perfect place for you toon and other figures!

http://www.renderosity.com/mod/bcs/index.php?vendor=23722

Due to the childish TOS changes, I'm not allowed to link to my other products outside of Rendo anymore :(

Food for thought.....
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pYZw0dfLmLk

From my perspective as a Mac user, one who primarily uses Carrara as a no-frills modeler (and only secondarily as a spectacular render engine), the movement from 3 to 4 to 5 has been marked by an increasing number of cool tools but a decreasing amount of core functionality. Little things like the way duplicates reverse their surface normals, group names are randomly deleted, welding operations become slower and slower to perform, and of course random crashes, means that for all the new toys I can get almost as much modeled in a earlier version. As a Mac user who attempts to actually finish and export models for use in other applications, my only remaining interest in Carrara 6 is if it offers more and more intriguing render options. I simply do not trust the current team to deliver a non-buggy model engine I can use on a daily basis, without having to deal with long-winded work-arounds and crash recovery routines.

Hello again.

I am also very optimistic about Carrara's future. Just like Mark is.
Bob has stated and so has the rest of the Carrara team and DAZ that CARRARA is not going to be turn into just a content users but it will be develop just as before with features that  the community has requested. If you look at the DAZ bio page you will also see that they have  added another  eng. to the  current  Carrara team.
Things are looking very good.

Ringo