There's a bit of a bun fight going on with the Halloween contest and we need a clear ruling on what is considered nudity. Ok we’ve be told that all figures have to be covered up. Regardless if they have genitals or not, this would cut out a lot of entries. These are the rules

 

From the guidelines:
*Any fleshy beast that has “human attributes” or is a "humanoid-type figure" must follow the above Male and Female coverage guidelines. {which states: *Male genital region must be totally covered - with an opaque material}  

 

Ok clear this one up first, “any fleshy beast that has “human attributes”

What are human attributes? if this means genitals than characters that don’t have genitals the rule is not applicable

 

Male genital region must be totally covered - with an *opaque material

If there are no genitals than how do we tell where the genital region is?

Odiously we know where human ones are, but for made up character it could be their head for all we know.

 

If  we cover the region with a smoke or material that can’t be seen through is that ok

 

I have no trouble changing or covering up but don’t accept my entry in the first place if it doesn’t meet the rules it feels like the rules were changed halfway. So a bit of clarification would be appreciated.  

Im not sure why you chose to bring this here, as it was already explained to you via IM, but I will try and do it again here.

First off, there was some confusion with the nudity guidelines, after several images came in we discovered this, and attempted to rectify it by posting the visual guidelines located here:

http://www.renderosity.com/news.php?viewStory=12176

Now, its pretty straight forward to know where the genital region is in a human and also the rules state that if its a humanoid character,  the same coverage applies. Genitals or not, that area must be covered. {This also includes certain images where characters are wearing thongs just for an fyi}

Smoke, fog, flames,hair, an arm, or leg in the way, props etc..these are not clothes and if the character appears to be nude behind any of these things then the image will need to be revised.

We have had to send off several noitifications, and had the intention of doing so in a timely manner. However, all the judges cannot possibly be here 24 hrs a day, and one judge cannot possibly check every image that comes in {there are almost 300 now}

If an image was passed before, and a quick review is done and that image fell outside the guidelines then the member is notified {which in this case you were notified} so the image can be revised.

If you have any further concerns you may direct them to the admins at admin@renderosity.com

~Jani

Renderosity Community Admin
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also the rules state that if its a humanoid character,  the same coverage applies. Genitals or not, that area must be covered.

3PO! put the damn trunks on!

And thats C3-PO {and I dont know about actual robot characters...hmmm will have to check on that one...{however, a M3 with a robot texture/material for example would have to be clothed }

What we are talking about here is the likes of demons, trolls, partially decomposed corpses, etc...

Full body skeletons of course do not have to be clothed.

~Jani

Renderosity Community Admin
---------------------------------------

...

ok the joke was lost. forget I said anything.. I'll be in the corner being serious.

and btw in the movies he was called 3PO often. (a correction to your correction)

Well people you are going to have to take out every skeleton that doesn’t have its genital region covered and I don’t see that happening. I think you missed the whole point of this, it wasn’t a shot at you guys. I’m not going to resubmit because obviously I would get discrimination against So thanks for the help  

Nah, no need to go into the corner...come outta there... I caught the joke.. Im just going blind from image overload I guess and my brain is about to explode..so Im terrified to laugh :lol:

And I stand corrected on the 3PO..you are correct

~Jani

Renderosity Community Admin
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Again, whole bodied skeletons {nothing but bare bones} do not need to be clothed Midnight.

I do not understand the point you are trying to make apparently, and I have answered you the best way I can.

I would hope you would reconsider and resubmit your image.

~Jani

Renderosity Community Admin
---------------------------------------

A skeleton is a humanoid figure it has two leg two arms and a head humanoid. I was making the point you were taking the rules to the extreme and not in the good nature of the contest. Your right guys it just an art contest not a war I’ll put a pair of Speedos on him and we'll call it even.

but a skeleton is not fleshy ....

and jumpstart.. said "Full body skeletons of course do not have to be clothed" which agrees with the posted contest rules.

Ok after six hours of trying to figure out what you guys were on about. I got home, to look at the picture and I had no idea that there was anything between his legs how it got there I have no idea. Now I see why you let the other one like mine go, they didn’t have anything between their legs. I can see how you can misinterpret it, as something else. This was not something I did on purpose the model physically has no genitals so until I saw the picture I had no idea why I was being targeted. I want to apologize for the ruckus I’ve caused, and any hard feels that may have been misinterpreted. You guys were spot on with the rejection all I can say is the devil made me do it. You guys have to cover your ass and we do to literally.    

No worries Midnight, slap some cool speedo's or sompin on that bad boy and get him reposted

~Jani

Renderosity Community Admin
---------------------------------------

my pref would be for boxer shorts on the skellingtons, but I reckon speedos would suffice :lol:

So, if I wanted to submit an image with Daz's free Creeper, I'd need to stick some clothing on it because it's vaguely humanoid?

Anyone know where I could find a decent pair of boxers for said Creeper?

________________________________________________________________

If you're joking that's just cruel, but if you're being sarcastic, that's even worse.

Quote - So, if I wanted to submit an image with Daz's free Creeper, I'd need to stick some clothing on it because it's vaguely humanoid?

Actually, I think the real question is, if you've got a pair of humanoid shorts, would you have to slap some Creeper on them?

:lol: <ducking, now...> :lol:

Captain Jack

 

I think the RR rule makers are seeing sexual content where there is none. Even the most ardent Bible thumper could  not possibly be offended by a naked, skinned zombie!!! Get real, admins. Does George W. Bush now own RR???? And the Creeper, oh my God, he really makes me think naughty thoughts - "Sticks finger down throat...."

And PS, jumpstartme, I am glad this problem is out in the open.

First off I dont mind it being out in the open per say, what I wondered about was why it was brought here by a member who had already been responded to. But that part is over with so I wont go back to that.

I posted to the other thread you started Drifterlee, but I can repost it here as well about the nudity clause.

From the Figure Coverage Guidelines For Contests:

http://www.renderosity.com/news.php?viewStory=12176

Male Coverage

•  
• Male genital region must be totally covered - with an *opaque material
• Male buttocks must be covered - with an *opaque material
• No use of: transparent clothes, blurring of nude areas, or the use of “blots” or “Censored” wording or props to cover areas that are otherwise not clothed.
• *Opaque: a solid, non-transparent material [in other words, material that is not see-through]

Humanoid Beasts

•  
• Any fleshy beast that has “human attributes” or is a "humanoid-type figure" must follow the above Male and Female coverage guidelines.
• No use of: transparent clothes, blurring of nude areas, or the use of "blots" or "Censored" wording or props to cover areas that are otherwise not clothed.

~Jani

Renderosity Community Admin
---------------------------------------

Also note: Any fleshy beast that has “human attributes” or is a "humanoid-type figure" must follow the above Male and Female coverage guidelines.

{This would mean that complete bare bones skeletons are not included in the nudity clause and do not have to be covered}

~Jani

Renderosity Community Admin
---------------------------------------

Who has made these rules???? Zombies have no sexual attributes! Quoting rules does not really explain the reasons.

The reasons for the nudity clause is: {and this directly from the admins in reply to the judges questions} the graphic contests entries can be viewed by all members; from young children to adults ...
And ... Many of our generous sponsors have requested a "No Nudity" clause in the contests that they sponsor.

Now, as to whether or not zombies have genitals or not...lets think about this...zombies are humans back from the dead are they not? Im assuming those pre-humans had genitals....but getting past that...the models used in these images may or may not have genitals {there have been some that had to be revised} but the rules state any fleshy human or humanoid type figure must be covered in the genital region..it does not specify genitals...just the region. {which if the region is covered, if there are genitals they will be covered.

~Jani

Renderosity Community Admin
---------------------------------------

Come on. I know you are an employee and have to follow the rules. But ugly zombies???? The rules are overdone here. Are we protecting the rights of zombies, if they exist??? I never get mad, usually. I am a 55 year old mother of two daughters. I also have 3 cats, 2 rabbits, one new very green 5 year old horse, a hamster with a poop problem, and I don't need this silly stuff. I have been married for 25 years to the same man. I believe in God and I pray to hiim or her, as the case may be. But I think these rules are silly, and I would really appreciate if you would talk to whoever put them in place. My ugly zombies are not sexual at all. Can you explain why zombies are offensive?

Just popping in quick to say that I have requested the LillianH or cartesius come in here and help explain the contest rules.

 

 

Thanks

Quote - Also note: Any fleshy beast that has “human attributes” or is a "humanoid-type figure" must follow the above Male and Female coverage guidelines.

{This would mean that complete bare bones skeletons are not included in the nudity clause and do not have to be covered}

So, no Creeper's mooning people?

Bummer, and I had just the image planned. :tt2:

edit: And it just occured to me, seeing a naked zombie can be rather traumatic, I think I'd pass on that. :scared:

________________________________________________________________

If you're joking that's just cruel, but if you're being sarcastic, that's even worse.

Yes, someone really needs to explain why an ugly zombie with no marked gender needs clothes on. I really WANT that explained.

Hold tight drifter, help is on the way:)

Thank you. I have stood fast through the Thorne and sarsa characters looking too young and I can understand that. But UGLY ZOMBIES??????

Having seen drifterlee's image I think it would be good to see/hear how these rules came about as well.  This just seems like all the zero tolerance rules popping up all over the place these days.  Nobody wants to take the time to actually consider things on an individual basis, so they outlaw everything.  Common sense has to be involved.

John

Real life Santeria zombies are fully clothed and tended to & fed by the family.

Hollywood, movie, game etc zombies have some form of shorts on.

it seems pretty simple to me.... zombies are human shaped.... rules says human shaped figures must have their bits covered..... the solution to this is...... put some clothes on em and enter the contest......or...... DON'T put some clothes on em and DON'T enter the contest

God i love this site.

A werewolf with clothes looks something strange!, speaking about werewolves can you tell me how I can know if a werewolf is male, female or shemale?

Stupidity also evolves!

thats easy kawecki...if the werewolf attacks guys then its a female.... if it attacks girls then its male....if it attacks both then its shemale.............unless its gay! :D

Since I primarily model, and only play in Poser occasionally, I thought I'd never see the day when the "nudity rule" would impact me.  I was wrong.  I like to make anthromorphosized creatures, ie...with humanoid faces, expressions.  Please see my "fishface" avatar....who is naked.  Now, according to this:  quote:  Any fleshy beast that has “human attributes”....little fishface is a violation.  Am I reading this correctly?  Or do you mean fleshy beasts shaped like humans in general?

Hi drifterlee,

 

I posted in another thread, but would also like to post this here.

 

These rules were created to provide a consistent and fair way to administer large community contests in which there is "no nudity allowed".

 

We are not making any distinctions about whether zombies or monsters or werewolves have "sexual attributes". We are simply clarifying what is considered nudity for the purpose of this contest and what kinds of characters must be clothed.

 

These definitions were made based on years of experience with Renderosity contest administration and reviewing several thousand submissions and with the input of several very experienced admins and artists.

 

After viewing vast amounts of contest submissions, yes...I can honestly say that some artists DO give their monsters very well endowed "human attributes", hence the need for the clarification.

 

To get to the point, if we want to continue to offer these kinds of generous prizes from so many different sponsors then we will continue to run these as "no nudity" contests. In today's business climate, we simply wouldn't be able to get this many prizes without this rule in place.

 

We have plenty of other contests on our site that do allow nudity. However, these large community, manufacturer sponsored contests do not.

 

Please let me know if you have any further questions.

Lillian Hawkins
Marketing Manager
By serving each other, we are free.

so, to clarify,

Grey Aliens, Golems. the Devil, Deamons, Ghasts, Gugs and Great Cthulhu, all need clothes even tho they are sexless and only resemble a human in the department of how many limbs they have...?

glad I'm not gonna be entering on time issues.. thats my entry right up the creek. (where am I supposed to get shorts for a Gug? they don't exist! (the shorts that is. and well, the Gug don't ether but you know what I mean...))

oh and Nyarlathotep (in the form of the 3 legged man with  massive tongue) and Ithaqua...  and oh.. don't forget Nightgaunts...

Well, I painted on loin clothes over their dead groin area and resubmitted it. So, I guess it has something to do with the advertisers who gave prizes, according to LIllianH. I still think it's stupid. Take a look in my gallery at "Do You Think I'm Sexy" render. It's not the contest entry but I used the same zombies. I can't find anything offensive as they have no genitals. So I guess I don't understand these advertisers.

HELLO!!!!
ting! Shop!
anyone home?

still waiting on an answer here !

to repeat -

so, to clarify,

Grey Aliens, Golems. the Devil, Deamons, Ghasts, Gugs and Great Cthulhu, all need clothes even tho they are sexless and only resemble a human in the department of how many limbs they have...? (oh and Nyarlathotep (in the form of the 3 legged man with  massive tongue) and Ithaqua...  and oh.. don't forget Nightgaunts...)

I believe the answer to that would be yes...they're just as humanoid as zombies are.

John

want it from an admin tho. none of those figures I have even have gentials or clothes... (well a few for the greys... but nothing for the Cthulhu ones....)

and they are only as human as in having 2 arms 2 legs. Zombies are humans. ppl are forgetting that ;)

Khai,

Just FYI that I contacted LillianH and let her know that she is needed back in this thread:)

 

She should be responding soon

 

 

Well, I only called them Zombies because that's what the merchant called them. They are like "NIght of the Living Dead". They really have no flesh left. My real shock was that Ladona's image with GHOST BRUSHES (?????????) was pulled becauset he ghosts have breasts. Ghosts are not fleshy, and I saw the picture, and they did not appear to be naked to me.

Personally, I would consider nudity to be defined by the state of being naked.  But that's just me. 

However: I have to admit that it's an extremely complicated & involved issue at its base: and that it's very difficult to figure it all out.  Can a naked figure be defined as being "nude"?  And is a nude figure necessarily naked?  It's a toughie.......

Speaking for myself: I'm just dense enough so that the matter comes out pretty clear to me.  But there are obviously finer points and nuances connected to this situation which are sailing right over my head.  It's all just so terribly confusing........:scared::blink:

Something To Do At 3:00AM 

yup it is.. since according to the rules, a gorilla must be clothed..... or Great Cthulhu... (you wanna try getting trousers for him???)

"Great Cthulhu" was dreamed up in the imagination of a man who died at a young age of Bright's disease and cancer.  "Great Cthulhu" existed in Lovecraft's cigarette smoke.  Putting pants on imaginary characters has never been a hobby of mine. 

And hey -- gorillas in diapers -- it's a sure-fire contest winner.

It's actually pretty easy to cipher this out.  Really: it is.  With very little strain or effort -- all of the complications can be shown as being infused.  Not as being inherent.

The basic is pretty basic.

Something To Do At 3:00AM 

Hello Khai,

We tried to cover all the bases in the guidelines, but as you have pointed out, yes there are going to be some bases that may...for lack of a better term...remain uncovered. Those situations will be open to the judgement and interpretation of the Contests Managers.

so, to clarify,

Grey Aliens, Golems. the Devil, Deamons, Ghasts, Gugs and Great Cthulhu, all need clothes even tho they are sexless and only resemble a human in the department of how many limbs they have...? (oh and Nyarlathotep (in the form of the 3 legged man with  massive tongue) and Ithaqua...  and oh.. don't forget Nightgaunts...)

If the creatures have fleshy humanoid features they would fall into the must be covered category. Painting a loin cloth, or tattered clothing on them is a viable option that has been done quite well by other artists.

Gorillas would not need to be covered, because they are already covered with fur (unless someone gets creative and adds a set of boobs or genitals ;-)

Werewolfs likewise would not need to be clothed, unless again someone has taken the creative liberty of adding female breasts or genitals. Then, YES it would have to be covered.

If you have a particular image in question, we will be happy to review it.

As for the ghost image in question, when I saw the image, even though it was a lovely image, there were clearly visable nipples showing. Yes, there were "ghostly" nipples...but nipples none the less. The rules clearly state these will not be accepted. The artist was given the option to rework and resubmit the image.

We appreciate all the concern and input into the contest rules. We do our best to make sure the rules are clear and consistently applied. As with all rules...these do evolve and change with input and feedback from the community.

Lillian Hawkins
Marketing Manager
By serving each other, we are free.

You just need to amend the rules to state "All monsters and ghosts must have breasts and genital area covered, even if they are not meant to be human or alive."

thank Lillan. I won't be entering then.

When I first put this in I had no idea that it would blow out to this. I’m really glad people got the point about things being taken to the extreme and that we have the right to question the rules. I think the main reason this happened is because the images were accepted in the first place and after a week or two they were rejected. It seemed like somebody had changes the rules. I had no problem with them rejecting my entry as there was something that could have been misinterpreted as genitals; I was totally oblivious to that fact till it was pointed out to me. The judges have an incredibly hard task of interpreting the rules if they are not clearly written. We should never point our anger at them they are doing the best they can. Before you put rules up, do your homework or create clearer ones which lead to less problems. I noted that the Nimbus characterI use in the contest has no nudity warnings in the market place why do you have one set of rules for the market place and one for contest, shouldn’t it be one universal rule for the site and not be dictated by sponsors. You still have not clearly defined what human attributes are and if I turn that some character into a statue the fleshy rule no longer applies but the same sexless character is there just in a different category. Well all this seems rather insignificant after one of the members threatened my life. I hope people start pulling together as we are here for a good time, not a long time and we’ve got better things to be doing.    

Threatened your life? Are you serious????

Hi midnight_stories,

My sincere apologies for any inconvenience.

We're human and sometimes things get past us, too.

The definition listed under no nudity are no female breasts and no butt cracks or genitals. There are visual aids provided in the guidelines if in doubt. (Of course, I guess I should put a disclaimer that with some monsters there is the potential for those locations to change ;-)

Each contest has it's own rules, it's own theme and it's own requirements. As long as they remain within the TOS guidelines, we like to allow for as much diversity and creative freedom as possible based upon the sponsors requests.

It is important to read the rules of each contest before entering.

Lillian Hawkins
Marketing Manager
By serving each other, we are free.

Most people do not think of monsters as having genitals or being offensive - except in ugliness, of course! I would be more concerned if people are threatening violence as midnight's post indicates.

Quote - I believe the answer to that would be yes...they're just as humanoid as zombies are.

 

How many humans do you know that have three fingers, two toes and a head thats about three feet in diameter sitting on a neck thats about six inches in diameter? I don't know too many that do.

"In times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act" ~George Orwell

One begs the question as to how goods for sale here are allowed to show FULL nudity when our images made with them are not allowed in the galleries!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

The store is open to public view of all ages, is it not?????

RedtailHawk,

This thread is about the Halloween Contest which has "Contest RULES" so I really don't think this is the thread for your question.

 

 

Thanks

 

Quote - How many humans do you know that have three fingers, two toes and a head thats about three feet in diameter sitting on a neck thats about six inches in diameter? I don't know too many that do.

None myself, but that's irrelevant to the discussion as human and humanoid are not always interchangable terms.  Humans are humanoids, but not all humanoids are human.

John

ok staci... i saw this heading only... 'Subject: what is considered nudity'.... nowhere does it say halloween... :(

Quote - > Quote - I believe the answer to that would be yes...they're just as humanoid as zombies are.

 

How many humans do you know that have three fingers, two toes and a head thats about three feet in diameter sitting on a neck thats about six inches in diameter? I don't know too many that do.

 

ya should come live near me...ppl looking like that is pretty mild round here

No problem Redtailhawk, I just assumed you read the original post that started out with

 "There's a bit of a bun fight going on with the Halloween contest and we need a clear ruling on what is considered nudity. '

No worries though, have a great evening

"Yes, there were "ghostly" nipples...but nipples none the less"

It must be scary to see your hand pass trough....

Stupidity also evolves!

Quote - > Quote - > Quote - I believe the answer to that would be yes...they're just as humanoid as zombies are.

 

How many humans do you know that have three fingers, two toes and a head thats about three feet in diameter sitting on a neck thats about six inches in diameter? I don't know too many that do.

 

 

 

ya should come live near me...ppl looking like that is pretty mild round here

 

LOL Ok I stand corrected there are people out there that look like that.

"In times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act" ~George Orwell

Like I said before, state that all monsters and ghosts need clothes covering breasts and genital areas. Most artists don't think of ghosts and monsters as being offensive in a sexual nature. That should have been stated. Humonoid is not clear.

Quote - God i love this site.

So do I.
Where else can you get into a heated argument over naked zombies? I bet they don't talk about this over at those fancy 3d sites like CGTalk!
 
I do think it's interesting that we're applying nudity guidelines to horrific images. It's okay to show zombies with their flesh dripping off and eating people's brains... just make sure they're clothed!
On the other hand, have you ever seen a zombie movie where the zombies did not wear clothes? Personally, I do not want to see any naked zombies. ;)
 
--John

VanishingPoint... Advanced 3D Modeling Solutions

> Quote - > Quote - God i love this site. > > > So do I. > Where else can you get into a heated argument over naked zombies?

Oh....pretty much anywhere.  At least among the major Poser-related sites -- which is admittedly limited to two (possibly three).

Quote -  I bet they don't talk about this over at those fancy 3d sites like CGTalk!

Probably not -- because much of what's permitted in the galleries here most likely would not be permitted at cgtalk.  Not to mention the fact that the forum moderation at cgtalk is far stricter than it is here.  A thread like this one would be stillborn over at cgtalk.  It's simply not allowed.

Something To Do At 3:00AM 

jeez, look at all those guys who showed up here july 4th! I musta missed that day. :lol: just lookin' at the first page of cgtalk's 3d gallery/forum; some images have over 30,000 views; no poser renders visible (but I didn't look beyond page 1). I'm guessing there ain't any nude aikos, nude zombies or nude skellingtons there, either. :lol:

Well, my zombies had all their naughty parts rotted off, LOL!!!

Quote - Nah, no need to go into the corner...come outta there... I caught the joke.. Im just going blind from image overload I guess and my brain is about to explode..so Im terrified to laugh :lol:

And I stand corrected on the 3PO..you are correct

 

May the force forbid it! Sith brains all over the place! We can't have that, no not at all, that just wouldn't do..............

 

On a serious note however, Jumps, so am I too take it that men now have to have shirts on? And why is it that there are full frontal nudes in some galleries here if thats not allowed anymore?

 

As usual confused...........

"In times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act" ~George Orwell

Sorry about the confusion BDC, the nudity clause that is being discussed is for the contests only..which differs a bit from the normal Renderosity standards in the galleries here.

No, males...including humans, zombies, trolls, ghosts, etc..  do not have to have a shirt on, but they have to be covered front and back on the genital and buttocks areas {genitals or not} with something that looks like solid clothing {no smoke, fog, shadows, props, blurring, smudging, or appendages like arms or legs covering those areas.

Females must have this same area covered, and this includes no thongs {If there is a slight upper hip area showing from the side that would be ok...but if the whole side per say were showing, and no hint of clothing, then it would not pass}

Female's also must have the entire breast area covered, not just the nipple area {slight cleavage from the top is ok} This includes humans, zombies, ghosts, trolls, etc, and cannot be covered by smoke, fog, shadows, props, blurring, smudging, or appendages like crossed arms

Whole bodied skeletons {bare bones} do not have to be clothed.

Beasts with full bodied fur do not have to be clothed {unless someone gets a wild idea to add obvious genitals LOL}

Hope that helps

Toddles back over to her cauldron

~Jani

Renderosity Community Admin
---------------------------------------

Thanks jumps!

Running Moonshine is still illegal aint it?

 

LOL

 

 

"In times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act" ~George Orwell

Wait, so a man's nipples are fine, but a woman's aren't? :blink:

It's the same freaking thing! Why is one acceptable and the other not?

________________________________________________________________

If you're joking that's just cruel, but if you're being sarcastic, that's even worse.

Ok, if its the same thing...then ask a man and a woman to walk down the street  in the city, say...in Tenn... both with no top whatsoever on, and see who gets a ticket and jail time for indecent exposure.

~Jani

Renderosity Community Admin
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But see, technically both should, or neither should.

Just another example of how FUBAR'ed our society is.

________________________________________________________________

If you're joking that's just cruel, but if you're being sarcastic, that's even worse.

Well, guess we can blame Adam and Eve...if they had gotten rid of the snake we'd all be ok :lol:

~Jani

Renderosity Community Admin
---------------------------------------

And we should be still apes....

Stupidity also evolves!

Quote - Well, guess we can blame Adam and Eve...if they had gotten rid of the snake we'd all be ok :lol:

Nah, I'll blame those people wh think they know what's best for me, and only want me thinking a certain way.

________________________________________________________________

If you're joking that's just cruel, but if you're being sarcastic, that's even worse.

ojalque tantos no sean monos, ricardo. :lol:

Quote - Ok, if its the same thing...then ask a man and a woman to walk down the street  in the city, say...in Tenn... both with no top whatsoever on, and see who gets a ticket and jail time for indecent exposure.

Actually jumpy, as a coordinator, you have a responsibility to be accurate. While that may be the case in Tennesee, there are many places in the United States, Canada, and other countries where being "top free" is not illegal. In US cities and states where women are arrested for being "top free" they are more frequently arrested for disorderly conduct or being a public nuisance as opposed to 'indencent" exposure because there is no state law or local ordinance against it. 

I am not arguing for or against Renderosity's policy, or the fixation for and against nudity by members. I do wish we would stop criminalizing women's breasts and teaching our children to be ashamed of their bodies.

I would like to point out the following as examples concerning women's exposed breasts and the law.

In New York City there is an old law on the books that allows a women to be "top free" in public, providing it is not being used as a business. Women's right to be topless in public was legalized in New York state in 1992. In Arizona, female breasts don't constitute "private parts" under state law according to the Arizona State Supreme Court. It is not illegal for woment to be "top free" in Hawai, Ohio, Texas, or Eugene, Oregon. It is legal for women to be "top free" in Daytona Beach, Florida if  you are engaging in a protest or demonstration. It is not illegal for women to be "top free" in South Beach or Miami Beach, Florida, or in Washington, D.C.

Thanks in part to Desiree Davis, a 34 year old woman who mowed her lawn "top free" it is not illegal for women to be top free in Newport, Maine. The law in Maine prohibits the display of genitalia or the committing of sexual acts in public. It was found that breasts are not genitalia, and lawn mowing was not a sexual act. Debra Ballou and Kathryn Mann naked joggers attending the University of Maine won a case against indecent exposure. Judge Jesse Gunther of the 3rd District Court in Bangor said that a woman naked in the street is not an indecent act under Maine law because a woman’s genitals are primarily internal.

In Liverpool, England, women can sell items and be topless...but only in tropical fish stores.

In may European countries and Australia females may go "top free" at beaches, parks and swimming pools amond other places. It is not illegal for women to be "top free" in British Columbia, Ontario, or parts of Manitoba. Theoretically it's not currently illegal anywhere in Canada since sexual equality is an amendment to the Canadian Constitution.

Ironically, a fully clothed Miss Universe 2005, Natalie Glebovawas, was briefly barred from attending the opening of a Thai festival at Nathan Phillips Square in her hometown of Toronto thanks to an almost 2 decades old ordinance that considered the pagent among "activities which degrade men or women through sexual stereotyping, or exploit the bodies of men, women, boys or girls solely for the purpose of attracting attention". To be fair, the city conceded she could attend but she couldn't wear her sash or tiara, and couldn't be referred to as either Miss Universe or a beauty queen. They were permitted to to her as "an individual of note contributing to our community." Go figure...maybe if she would have been "top free" there wouldn't have been a problem.

It's all fun and games...
Until the flying monkeys attack!!! 

Hi tainted_heart,

jumpstartme2 was being accurate, topless women walking around in public can be arrested for indecent exposure, at least in Nashville. Here's the law:  http://www.nac.oshkosh.net/StatesFrames/State_Laws_Frames/Tennessee_Laws/body_tennessee_laws.html

(A) "Nudity" or "state of nudity" means the showing of the bare human male or female genitals or pubic area with less than a fully opaque covering, the showing of the female breast with less than a fully opaque covering of the areola, or the showing of the covered male genitals in a discernibly turgid state. "Nudity" or "state of nudity" does not include a mother in the act of nursing the mother's baby;

But, it gets even funnier, a man has been arrested for indecent exposure because he bared his female looking breasts:

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,161748,00.html

Anyway, this is an interesting and thought provoking discussion.

As it relates to the contests its a rather simple matter. If we want big prizes from corporate sponsors, we will present images that will not get them in trouble for "sexual harrassment" while showing the images in their board room.

Best wishes,
Lillian

Lillian Hawkins
Marketing Manager
By serving each other, we are free.

We have plenty of other contests that do not have such strict guidelines around nudity.

However, when we have these large community contests with lots of corporate sponsors, the rules are strict.

When everyone around the planet is comfortable with public nudity and nudity in the workplace I'm pretty sure we can relax these large contest rules.

Good, bad or otherwise, it is the reality in which we find ourselves at this point in time.

Lillian Hawkins
Marketing Manager
By serving each other, we are free.

Quote - jumpstartme2 was being accurate, topless women walking around in public can be arrested for indecent exposure.

She was accurate regarding the state of Tennesee, which I agreed was the case; however, she seemed to be making a broad, generalized statement and used Tennessee as a single example, and there are many other cities and states that do not follow the example of Tennessee as I pointed out in my earlier post.

Quote - If we want big prizes from corporate sponsors, we will present images that will not get them in trouble for "sexual harrassment" while showing the images in their board room.

While I have no objection to Renderosity obtaining big prizes from sponsors, I find the idea of showing a work of art that contains a humanoid creature that has no genitals and is not covered from the waist down, in a board room leading to a "sexual harrassment" charge ludicrous, and hardly credible. I can't believe you could say that with a straight face and expect anyone to really believe it. I can't even imagine a company showing an image that contained an exposed pair of zombie breasts and won their prize, to their board being concerned about sexual harrassment.

Renderosity is certainly welcome to have whatever rules they desire for their contests, but better to say "these are the rules we choose because we want to judge images on their merits and not be concerned about images that cross the line or push the envelope of our version of decency" then a lame excuse like sponsors are worried about sexual harrassment charges in the board room. Puhlease!

Best Wishes

 

It's all fun and games...
Until the flying monkeys attack!!! 

Ok, genitalia must be coveredby clothes, but can someone tell me where aliens have their genitalia?

Stupidity also evolves!

I agree with you on this tainted_heart...the laws are so varied it's hard to keep up with where you can bare it and where you'll get locked up.

I'm just sharing a concern previously expressed by a few of the sponsors. The comment was not made about monsters (with or without genitals), but about showing digital art work containing nudity...in a business situation and a corporate setting.

Lillian Hawkins
Marketing Manager
By serving each other, we are free.

maybe those wishing to use nude zombies could cover the boobs-n-pubes with some strategically-placed tree branches or tombstones. but I agree about not trying to force nudie pix upon those who don't wanna see 'em or sponsor 'em. in answer to ricardo's question, our current state of knowledge indicates that there are no aliens within travel distance of this planet, but if the lisenko-ists are correct (they aren't), then the aliens' equipment is in the same place as humans.

Ok, bring on the cat pictures!!!

Quote - I agree with you on this tainted_heart...the laws are so varied it's hard to keep up with where you can bare it and where you'll get locked up. I'm just sharing a concern previously expressed by a few of the sponsors. The comment was not made about monsters (with or without genitals), but about showing digital art work containing nudity...in a business situation and a corporate setting.

Well since the first post in this thread concerned the Halloween Contest rules requiring humanoid monsters and beasties to be clothed, I thought I'd throw that in. I can force myself to believe, with a stretch, there might be one sponsor concerned about sexual harrasment charges as a result of displaying digital art containing nudity to their board...although I still find it ludicrous and unlikely. It's much easier to believe there are some sponsors that just don't want to deal with the issue of nudity, in today's moral and politcal climate; and because there are few places one can use a prize winning image containing nudity for promotion of their product or their generosity.

I don't think anyone has a valid concern or objection to Renderosity's policy of no nudity in contests. There is a concern when nudity rules are being applied to figures that have no genitals when those figures are...well...creatures and beasties, and they are "blank" between their legs. Nudity is widely defined as the exposure of genitals and when said figures not only are creatures and beasties, but have no genitals to expose, they can hardly be considered to be nude just as. It taxes my mind to it's very limt to believe any "corporate sponsor" could be so ultra-prudish or be the least bit concerned about sexual harrassment charges resulting from displaying such an image. I honestly cannot, even in my wildest dreams, come up with any sane reason that would justify such a requirement. :blink:

Cheers.

It's all fun and games...
Until the flying monkeys attack!!! 

Ahh I was just coming in here to post that very link Lillian :biggrin:

@Tainted: Actually, I used Tennessee for one reason, and thats because Bondware and Rendo are located there.

As for indecent exposure in other places, sure..laws differ...and in some states, yes you can go topless..doesnt mean everyone is going to accept it tho..and it doesnt mean that you can do that just anywhere either..some states have specific places people can go...now, iirc Texas {where I am} has topless beaches...but not all beaches here in Texas are topless...you go to one where topless is not allowed, take off your top and be free,.. you can get into trouble.

Then you have some areas in certain states, where the state itself might allow topless, but then in the small towns and larger cities it wont fly....for instance, you cant go to Houston, Tx and take your top off and walk down main street...and in my smaller town outside Houston, you would rather eat a dead snake than get caught running around here with your top off. :biggrin:

Im not claiming I know all the laws in all the states of the US, because Im not a lawyer, and its not my job to know such things, but the linl Lillian posted was the one I was going to post, because it pertained to the situation and the area . We might not agree with the laws, but we do have to follow them.

~Jani

Renderosity Community Admin
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Quote - Ok, genitalia must be coveredby clothes, but can someone tell me where aliens have their genitalia?

Hmmm... don't know about most places, but the girl I used to date from Deneb 3 kept 'em in her purse. Said it was much more convenient that way, and she could just loan 'em out if she had a headache.

giggle

Captain Jack

 

Quote - As for indecent exposure in other places, sure..

And, did you know, there are actually places on the Internet where people go topless? Can you imagine? The things ya learn every day...

 

Totally mind boggling innit? :biggrin:

~Jani

Renderosity Community Admin
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"Nudity is widely defined as the exposure of genitals and when said figures not only are creatures and beasties, but have no genitals to expose, they can hardly be considered to be nude just as."

Moralists are perverted people that are able to see perversion where nobody does.
You see a moster that has no sex, they see their sexual organs.
You see Donald Duck sleeping in bed with his nephews, they see an act of paedophilia.

Stupidity also evolves!

Hey folks,

As this thread is centered around the Halloween contest, it is being moved to the Contest forum.

Thanks,
Lillian

Lillian Hawkins
Marketing Manager
By serving each other, we are free.