FranOnTheEdge opened this issue on Nov 19, 2007 · 86 posts
FranOnTheEdge posted Mon, 19 November 2007 at 1:29 PM
Does anyone have or know where to get a free light dome for Bryce?
Measure
your mind's height
by the shade it casts.
Robert Browning (Paracelsus)
electroglyph posted Mon, 19 November 2007 at 3:29 PM
The freestuff link seems to be gone so you can get it from my site. This is zenith by madmax.
There are different light rigs attached to a big invisible arrow in the center of your scene. Rotate the arrow to aim the light rig. More directions included in the readme in the zip.
http://geocities.com/electroglyph2002/freestuff/zenith.zip
danamo posted Mon, 19 November 2007 at 4:36 PM
Oh good, glad you have it too. I was looking through my archives for Zenith and finally found it.
I highly recommend the Zenith light rigs.
rubidium posted Mon, 19 November 2007 at 4:47 PM
Hello,
If I understand correctly, the effect of the light dome is to give the scene an even illumination, without harsh shadows. Is it equivalent to use the IBL feature of Bryce 6.0?
Best regards
Ramon
Rayraz posted Mon, 19 November 2007 at 6:48 PM
yea a light dome is pretty much meant to do a similar thing as IBL. The light dome usage found its brycean use in the days before IBL.
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FranOnTheEdge posted Mon, 19 November 2007 at 7:33 PM
Quote - The freestuff link seems to be gone so you can get it from my site. This is zenith by madmax.
There are different light rigs attached to a big invisible arrow in the center of your scene. Rotate the arrow to aim the light rig. More directions included in the readme in the zip.
http://geocities.com/electroglyph2002/freestuff/zenith.zip
I've got zenith, but none of those are a light dome - they are all a cluster of lights with a single directional arrow.
I'm looking for an actual dome.
By the way, have you got MadMax's daylight and moonlight scenes etc?
Measure
your mind's height
by the shade it casts.
Robert Browning (Paracelsus)
alexclark posted Tue, 20 November 2007 at 6:04 AM
rubidium posted Tue, 20 November 2007 at 8:25 AM
Rayraz, thank you for your answer. Is IBL more efficient (faster) than the light dome? Because IBL is very slow...
FranOnTheEdge, I have found this tutorial by Nick Jushchyshyn about light domes, perhaps you can find it useful...
http://www.hiddenphantom.com/Tutorials/BryceDomelight/BryceDomelight.htm
Best regards
Ramon
kiwi_gg posted Tue, 20 November 2007 at 11:00 AM
Fran,
I have the light dome preset I think you are looking for , however I'm away from home for the next few days. If you IM me a reminder I'll send it to you when I get back unless someone else has been able to help you first.
Cheers
GG
WHO said Kiwi's can't Fly ?????
Rayraz posted Tue, 20 November 2007 at 11:40 AM
Quote - Rayraz, thank you for your answer. Is IBL more efficient (faster) than the light dome? Because IBL is very slow...
FranOnTheEdge, I have found this tutorial by Nick Jushchyshyn about light domes, perhaps you can find it useful...
http://www.hiddenphantom.com/Tutorials/BryceDomelight/BryceDomelight.htm
Best regardsRamon
Both are slow. Generally IBL can get a more pronounced effect because its easy to have a variation of color and intensety in your lighting while a light dome is usually constructed with only one color. Ofcourse you could do all that manually for a lightdome too, but i think it'd take a lot of time.
Sometimes a dome will be faster, but it depends on the amount of lights in your dome and if they have soft shadows or not. When using smooth noiseless textures, you will need soft shadows and/or a lot of lights to get a smooth shadow, which means killer rendertimes.
In some more advanced applications animated lightdomes are used in combination with motionblur to get softer shadows with fewer lights, but this trick doesnt work in bryce.
Btw, I suspect DAZ from using a method similar to a procedurally generated light dome for IBL rendering in bryce, because the shadows from brycean IBL are still faceted, especially at low quality settings...
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dvlenk6 posted Tue, 20 November 2007 at 1:04 PM
Are shadows from a light dome ever really soft?
I don't think so; even when they are set to soft shadow of 100. I don't see any difference in the shadows whatsoever. They are hard as can be.
Light Dome render times:
Reg. AA w/o soft shadows: 2 seconds - 3.26 million shadow rays
Reg. AA w/ soft shadows: 1 min. 48 sec. - 2.09 trillion shadow rays
9 RPP w/o soft shadows: 19 sec. - 2.80 billion shadow rays
9 RPP w/ soft shadows: 19 sec. - 2.80 billion shadow rays
But the softness setting does nothing to the final appearance. 0 softness looks identical to 100 softness. You can see that same number of shadow rays is used w/ premium soft shadows as premium w/o soft shadows. That is with both the lights and the render setting w/ or w/o soft shadows. Swithcing one or the other on or off makes no difference either.
Obviously there is something not working correctly w/ shadows and light domes (IBL too).
So the fastest by far is Reg. AA w/o soft shadows.
The slowest by far is Reg. AA w/ soft shadows.
But; there still isn't any difference in the appearance whether the dome lights are 'hard' or 'soft'.
IBL lights don't have soft shadows either. It is only when you turn the quality (equals # of IBL lights) up that the many overlapping edges make the shadows look soft. There is no setting for softness in the IBL system, so the times behaves as regular light domes using no soft shadows.
As far as I'm concerned, IBL in 6.1 and after is completely broken, or at least not usable in anything approaching reasonable time. To get a decent IBL effect, the quality must be cranked up, and then it takes FOREVER to render.
EDIT -6.0 IBL wasn't like that. They should have left it alone.
Friends don't let friends use booleans.
FranOnTheEdge posted Tue, 20 November 2007 at 5:44 PM
The point is - a light dome can be used in Bryce5, IBL can't.
Measure
your mind's height
by the shade it casts.
Robert Browning (Paracelsus)
vncnt9663 posted Wed, 21 November 2007 at 1:21 AM
Fran,
I think this is what you're looking for.
http://www.colacola.se/howto_brycelights.htm
electroglyph posted Wed, 21 November 2007 at 8:13 AM
Sorry Fran,
I never downloaded the scenes. 3D fightclub is gone. I even tried the wayback machine but madmax pages were never archived.
Drac also had a dome (free/for sale?) that I can't find now.
What are you after in your scene? Very soft shadows? absolutely no shadows at all? I've had good luck with a mirrored sphere and a single infinite light set at an intensity of 1 or 2. The light bounces off the surface and back to the object again and again. If you put the object in the center and the light off center the intensity is greater in the direction of the light. It calculates out much faster than the 200+ lights you need to create a dome.
FranOnTheEdge posted Wed, 21 November 2007 at 2:08 PM
**rjay9663,
**Thanks for the link, unfortunately, the link to the file give a 'file not found' although I've emailed bazze - see what he says.
**electroglyph,
** Yes, I wanted to try to get softer shadows without using 'soft shadows' in the sky lab - just to see what was possible, and if you can get close to B6's IBL.
Yeah, Drac had a light set up, don't think he still has it though, since he recently drastically revamped his website.
Measure
your mind's height
by the shade it casts.
Robert Browning (Paracelsus)
vncnt9663 posted Wed, 21 November 2007 at 2:24 PM
Fran,
I downloaded the file back in the B5 days. I know I have it filed away somewhere. I believe it's on my old computer. I'll have a look for it. If I find it I'll let you know. I think it's the one you're looking for.
FranOnTheEdge posted Wed, 21 November 2007 at 3:21 PM
**rjay9663,
That'd be great, thanks.
**
Measure
your mind's height
by the shade it casts.
Robert Browning (Paracelsus)
Rayraz posted Wed, 21 November 2007 at 6:00 PM
Quote - Are shadows from a light dome ever really soft?
I don't think so; even when they are set to soft shadow of 100. I don't see any difference in the shadows whatsoever. They are hard as can be. Light Dome render times:
Reg. AA w/o soft shadows: 2 seconds - 3.26 million shadow rays
.................... etc. ....................
To get a decent IBL effect, the quality must be cranked up, and then it takes FOREVER to render.EDIT -6.0 IBL wasn't like that. They should have left it alone.
Thats strange.. I dont remember having that kinda problems in bryce 5... they must've screwed up the soft shadow rendering!
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dvlenk6 posted Wed, 21 November 2007 at 10:44 PM
Apparently it is the size of the light dome. When the dome is small, the shadows can indeed be soft. When the dome is large, then there is no softness in the shadows. IBL dome is infinte size, so there can never be soft shadows from the IBL lights.
I'm actually getting the same effect from normal omni light too. If the light is close then the shadows can be soft; distant omni = no soft shadows.
When the omni is at 50,50,50 then the shadows look nice and soft (softness 100). Put the same light w/ same settings at 5000,5000,5000 and the shadows turn hard.
Friends don't let friends use booleans.
Rayraz posted Thu, 22 November 2007 at 9:53 AM
similar to how the suns lightrays seem parallel at its distance from earth :-)
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dvlenk6 posted Thu, 22 November 2007 at 1:24 PM
But the Bryce sun is infinite distant light, and it can have soft shadows...
Does that mean that Br sun is actually an area light, while omnis are point lights?
Friends don't let friends use booleans.
Rayraz posted Fri, 23 November 2007 at 8:05 AM
I dont know how the brycean sun light works actually... maybe it is an area light! but then again.. bryce's soft shadows are technically also area shadows...
This is an interesting conundrum indeed...
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FranOnTheEdge posted Sun, 25 November 2007 at 10:12 AM
Quote - Something like this is easily done using the multi replicate tool, if thats what you're after?
Alex - I meant to say before - in fact was saying but something crashed.
I'd really appreciate trying out your light dome. I've sent you an IM/site mail thingie.
I'm particularly interested in yours because of the number of lights it appears to have.
Is there any chance you could send it to me?
Fran
Measure
your mind's height
by the shade it casts.
Robert Browning (Paracelsus)
Claymor posted Sun, 25 November 2007 at 12:39 PM
http://www.renderosity.com/mod/forumpro/showthread.php?thread_id=1985510
A tut I posted here long ago on how to use wings to create a light rig for Bryce.
I'd suggest replacing the sphere with a softened Cube...you get more even light spacing.
I have several rigs done if you still need one
alexclark posted Sun, 25 November 2007 at 1:01 PM
Sure - I've sent it to your email. Alex
alexclark posted Sun, 25 November 2007 at 1:07 PM
@Claymor - thats a great technique you've got there. Nicely avoids the 'maths' of the multi replicate tool.
vncnt9663 posted Sun, 25 November 2007 at 2:07 PM
Fran,
I'm sorry to say, I wasn't able to find the light dome amongst my stuff. Sorry. Problem is I don't remember what it was titled. It's not titled "Light Dome", or I would just do a word search. However if I should come cross I will be sure to to post it.
FranOnTheEdge posted Sun, 25 November 2007 at 9:14 PM
Quote - http://www.renderosity.com/mod/forumpro/showthread.php?thread_id=1985510
A tut I posted here long ago on how to use wings to create a light rig for Bryce.
I'd suggest replacing the sphere with a softened Cube...you get more even light spacing.
I have several rigs done if you still need one
I'm still looking, yes, I want to try out the different types of light dome to see the differences - if any.
So if you have some I'd very much like to try them out - I'll send you my email - via IM.
Measure
your mind's height
by the shade it casts.
Robert Browning (Paracelsus)
vncnt9663 posted Wed, 09 January 2008 at 6:47 PM
Fran,
I found it!!
Don't know if you still need the light dome. But I fould the light dome I was looking for earlier. It's part of a .br5 file named "lighttest_115". I'll send it to you in a zip file.
ThunderStone posted Thu, 10 January 2008 at 10:40 AM
Quote - Fran,
I found it!!
Don't know if you still need the light dome. But I fould the light dome I was looking for earlier. It's part of a .br5 file named "lighttest_115". I'll send it to you in a zip file.
Could you send it to me also? I am looking also for the light dome... Thanks!
About the Zenith zip... Thankee thankee thankee!!!! I have been looking for that! :b_drool:
===========================================================
OS: Windows 11 64-bit
Poser: Poser 11.3 ...... Units: inches or meters depends on mood
Bryce: Bryce Pro 7.1.074
Image Editing: Corel Paintshop Pro
Renderer: Superfly, Firefly
9/11/2001: Never forget...
Smiles are contagious... Pass it on!
Today is the tomorrow you worried about yesterday
vncnt9663 posted Thu, 10 January 2008 at 11:29 AM
ThunderStone,
Sure. Send your email address through the site mail and I'll get it off to you.
ThunderStone posted Fri, 11 January 2008 at 9:45 AM
rjay9663: Thanks for the file. I got it. and am using it... As for Zenith lighting rig, it is very high in rendering time. I tried out all 4 versions of it and each one of them rendering time was double what it would have been with my own version. (Of course, it depends on the objects and the size of the images)... I will conduct an experiment over the weekend to prove to myself that it was a fluke.
Right now I am rendering a complex sphere scene with my own lighting rig which consist of a smaller dome of light like a sliver from a whole dome.and rotated sideways over the objects. Need 2 of these to adequately light the scene.
:b_sad:
**
**
===========================================================
OS: Windows 11 64-bit
Poser: Poser 11.3 ...... Units: inches or meters depends on mood
Bryce: Bryce Pro 7.1.074
Image Editing: Corel Paintshop Pro
Renderer: Superfly, Firefly
9/11/2001: Never forget...
Smiles are contagious... Pass it on!
Today is the tomorrow you worried about yesterday
FranOnTheEdge posted Fri, 11 January 2008 at 4:11 PM
**ThunderStone,
**Hmmm, that sounds very interesting, using a sliver from a dome eh? I'd like to try that.
Measure
your mind's height
by the shade it casts.
Robert Browning (Paracelsus)
ThunderStone posted Fri, 11 January 2008 at 4:30 PM
Quote - **ThunderStone,
**Hmmm, that sounds very interesting, using a sliver from a dome eh? I'd like to try that.
Fran, yes it does... But then that what experimenation gets ya...LOL
What I did was:
Create the dome as per Hidden Phanatom MSP Glow tutorial... Then I selected about 10 that are in a curve. Group them, delete the rest, then duplicate the "sliver" as needed... It works somewhat and rendering time is shorten (IMHO). I also save the sliver to the preset so that I don't have to re-create it each time I need it.
You can call it the Sliver Dome Technique? :b_funny:
===========================================================
OS: Windows 11 64-bit
Poser: Poser 11.3 ...... Units: inches or meters depends on mood
Bryce: Bryce Pro 7.1.074
Image Editing: Corel Paintshop Pro
Renderer: Superfly, Firefly
9/11/2001: Never forget...
Smiles are contagious... Pass it on!
Today is the tomorrow you worried about yesterday
vncnt9663 posted Fri, 11 January 2008 at 4:41 PM
ThunderStone,
I would love to see how the test came out. Would you post your test scene here?
ThunderStone posted Fri, 11 January 2008 at 5:10 PM
Quote - ThunderStone,
I would love to see how the test came out. Would you post your test scene here?
Will do so ... going to work on a basic sphere, cylinder, pyramid, and cube ...metal theme.
===========================================================
OS: Windows 11 64-bit
Poser: Poser 11.3 ...... Units: inches or meters depends on mood
Bryce: Bryce Pro 7.1.074
Image Editing: Corel Paintshop Pro
Renderer: Superfly, Firefly
9/11/2001: Never forget...
Smiles are contagious... Pass it on!
Today is the tomorrow you worried about yesterday
vncnt9663 posted Fri, 11 January 2008 at 5:12 PM
great. I'll keep on eye out for it.
FranOnTheEdge posted Fri, 11 January 2008 at 7:06 PM
Yeah, I want to see that scene too. Also what tutorial is that? Do you have a link to it?
Measure
your mind's height
by the shade it casts.
Robert Browning (Paracelsus)
ThunderStone posted Fri, 11 January 2008 at 7:18 PM
Quote - Yeah, I want to see that scene too. Also what tutorial is that? Do you have a link to it?
In the progress... Here's the link to the tutorial. It was mentioned on page 1 of this thread... Hidden Phantom - MSP Glow Tutorial
TS
===========================================================
OS: Windows 11 64-bit
Poser: Poser 11.3 ...... Units: inches or meters depends on mood
Bryce: Bryce Pro 7.1.074
Image Editing: Corel Paintshop Pro
Renderer: Superfly, Firefly
9/11/2001: Never forget...
Smiles are contagious... Pass it on!
Today is the tomorrow you worried about yesterday
ThunderStone posted Fri, 11 January 2008 at 9:42 PM
This is my set up for the experiment.
Bryce version: 5.5
The sliver: 9 radiallights in a semi circle with 1 in the center (Sort of a pivot light) Only 1 group will have the 10th light with the Fall off set to None
The objects: A cube, sphere, cylinder, pyramid
Plain Plane
Image size: standard 640 x 480
Sky Lab:
Sky and Sun: Atmosphere off.
Ambient color: 127, 127, 127 Sky Dome: 0 0 0
Sun: off
Sun/Moon : Intensity: 100 Soft Shadow: on
View: Camera: Parameters: -153.60, 20.48, 153.60 Y rotate: 135, FOV: 61%, Scale:100% Locked
Render mode: Normal
This is the basic set up for the experiment.
I will upload the pictures as soon as I have rendered them.
===========================================================
OS: Windows 11 64-bit
Poser: Poser 11.3 ...... Units: inches or meters depends on mood
Bryce: Bryce Pro 7.1.074
Image Editing: Corel Paintshop Pro
Renderer: Superfly, Firefly
9/11/2001: Never forget...
Smiles are contagious... Pass it on!
Today is the tomorrow you worried about yesterday
FranOnTheEdge posted Sat, 12 January 2008 at 8:59 AM
It's pretty simple really. Got myself a dome done.
(still want to try your sliver technique though)
Here's my test scene, simple light dome, intensity4:
Measure
your mind's height
by the shade it casts.
Robert Browning (Paracelsus)
vncnt9663 posted Sat, 12 January 2008 at 9:51 AM
Looks as good as HDRI to me. Nice job. :)
FranOnTheEdge posted Sat, 12 January 2008 at 9:54 AM
Well, the model looks okay, but the shadows on the floor don't look right to me.
I think the dome need to be smaller.
Has any one tried Claymor's wings3d method?
I can't get the cubes to change into lots of lights, only one light. Stumped with that...
Measure
your mind's height
by the shade it casts.
Robert Browning (Paracelsus)
FranOnTheEdge posted Sat, 12 January 2008 at 9:57 AM
Quote - http://www.renderosity.com/mod/forumpro/showthread.php?thread_id=1985510
A tut I posted here long ago on how to use wings to create a light rig for Bryce.
I'd suggest replacing the sphere with a softened Cube...you get more even light spacing.
I have several rigs done if you still need one
Yes!!! Don't understand how I missed your post before. I've now tried your Wings3D method and struck a problem with it, sent you an IM about that, but yes, if you have light rigs I'm very much into testing out different set ups, and would appreciate being able to test out your different set-ups.
Measure
your mind's height
by the shade it casts.
Robert Browning (Paracelsus)
ThunderStone posted Sat, 12 January 2008 at 2:35 PM
===========================================================
OS: Windows 11 64-bit
Poser: Poser 11.3 ...... Units: inches or meters depends on mood
Bryce: Bryce Pro 7.1.074
Image Editing: Corel Paintshop Pro
Renderer: Superfly, Firefly
9/11/2001: Never forget...
Smiles are contagious... Pass it on!
Today is the tomorrow you worried about yesterday
ThunderStone posted Sat, 12 January 2008 at 2:36 PM
===========================================================
OS: Windows 11 64-bit
Poser: Poser 11.3 ...... Units: inches or meters depends on mood
Bryce: Bryce Pro 7.1.074
Image Editing: Corel Paintshop Pro
Renderer: Superfly, Firefly
9/11/2001: Never forget...
Smiles are contagious... Pass it on!
Today is the tomorrow you worried about yesterday
ThunderStone posted Sat, 12 January 2008 at 2:39 PM
===========================================================
OS: Windows 11 64-bit
Poser: Poser 11.3 ...... Units: inches or meters depends on mood
Bryce: Bryce Pro 7.1.074
Image Editing: Corel Paintshop Pro
Renderer: Superfly, Firefly
9/11/2001: Never forget...
Smiles are contagious... Pass it on!
Today is the tomorrow you worried about yesterday
ThunderStone posted Sat, 12 January 2008 at 2:39 PM
===========================================================
OS: Windows 11 64-bit
Poser: Poser 11.3 ...... Units: inches or meters depends on mood
Bryce: Bryce Pro 7.1.074
Image Editing: Corel Paintshop Pro
Renderer: Superfly, Firefly
9/11/2001: Never forget...
Smiles are contagious... Pass it on!
Today is the tomorrow you worried about yesterday
ThunderStone posted Sat, 12 January 2008 at 2:40 PM
===========================================================
OS: Windows 11 64-bit
Poser: Poser 11.3 ...... Units: inches or meters depends on mood
Bryce: Bryce Pro 7.1.074
Image Editing: Corel Paintshop Pro
Renderer: Superfly, Firefly
9/11/2001: Never forget...
Smiles are contagious... Pass it on!
Today is the tomorrow you worried about yesterday
ThunderStone posted Sat, 12 January 2008 at 2:41 PM
===========================================================
OS: Windows 11 64-bit
Poser: Poser 11.3 ...... Units: inches or meters depends on mood
Bryce: Bryce Pro 7.1.074
Image Editing: Corel Paintshop Pro
Renderer: Superfly, Firefly
9/11/2001: Never forget...
Smiles are contagious... Pass it on!
Today is the tomorrow you worried about yesterday
ThunderStone posted Sat, 12 January 2008 at 2:42 PM
===========================================================
OS: Windows 11 64-bit
Poser: Poser 11.3 ...... Units: inches or meters depends on mood
Bryce: Bryce Pro 7.1.074
Image Editing: Corel Paintshop Pro
Renderer: Superfly, Firefly
9/11/2001: Never forget...
Smiles are contagious... Pass it on!
Today is the tomorrow you worried about yesterday
ThunderStone posted Sat, 12 January 2008 at 2:43 PM
===========================================================
OS: Windows 11 64-bit
Poser: Poser 11.3 ...... Units: inches or meters depends on mood
Bryce: Bryce Pro 7.1.074
Image Editing: Corel Paintshop Pro
Renderer: Superfly, Firefly
9/11/2001: Never forget...
Smiles are contagious... Pass it on!
Today is the tomorrow you worried about yesterday
ThunderStone posted Sat, 12 January 2008 at 2:43 PM
===========================================================
OS: Windows 11 64-bit
Poser: Poser 11.3 ...... Units: inches or meters depends on mood
Bryce: Bryce Pro 7.1.074
Image Editing: Corel Paintshop Pro
Renderer: Superfly, Firefly
9/11/2001: Never forget...
Smiles are contagious... Pass it on!
Today is the tomorrow you worried about yesterday
ThunderStone posted Sat, 12 January 2008 at 2:55 PM
===========================================================
OS: Windows 11 64-bit
Poser: Poser 11.3 ...... Units: inches or meters depends on mood
Bryce: Bryce Pro 7.1.074
Image Editing: Corel Paintshop Pro
Renderer: Superfly, Firefly
9/11/2001: Never forget...
Smiles are contagious... Pass it on!
Today is the tomorrow you worried about yesterday
Claymor posted Sat, 12 January 2008 at 3:04 PM
I emailed you a br5 and a br6 file today.
The one rig done from the old tut
The other done by changing mats
FranOnTheEdge posted Sat, 12 January 2008 at 8:16 PM
Quote - I emailed you a br5 and a br6 file today.
The one rig done from the old tut
The other done by changing mats
Got 'em, thanks Claymor.
Measure
your mind's height
by the shade it casts.
Robert Browning (Paracelsus)
FranOnTheEdge posted Sat, 12 January 2008 at 9:22 PM
Measure
your mind's height
by the shade it casts.
Robert Browning (Paracelsus)
FranOnTheEdge posted Sat, 12 January 2008 at 9:23 PM
Sliver, with 23 lights at intensity 2 - took 56 seconds to render in B6:
Claymor's took a couple of minutes, intensity 2 with 26 lights.
Measure
your mind's height
by the shade it casts.
Robert Browning (Paracelsus)
FranOnTheEdge posted Sat, 12 January 2008 at 9:29 PM
But such a nice soft look...
Measure
your mind's height
by the shade it casts.
Robert Browning (Paracelsus)
ThunderStone posted Sat, 12 January 2008 at 11:31 PM
Quote - This is Bazze's light dome sliver, from his colacola website (- unfortunately no longer available) Uses 115 lights at intensity 1 - took a long time to render - unfortunately I forgot to put the report render time on - so I'm not sure exactly how long - but the longest yet.
But such a nice soft look...
So render time depends on the number of lights, polygons and mat. ?
===========================================================
OS: Windows 11 64-bit
Poser: Poser 11.3 ...... Units: inches or meters depends on mood
Bryce: Bryce Pro 7.1.074
Image Editing: Corel Paintshop Pro
Renderer: Superfly, Firefly
9/11/2001: Never forget...
Smiles are contagious... Pass it on!
Today is the tomorrow you worried about yesterday
Claymor posted Sat, 12 January 2008 at 11:56 PM
Absolutely.
You can even see considerable difference in render time just by modifying the resolution of a garphical mat.
There are times when I'd be willing to bet you can get away with uber high poly count if you use simple mats one no additional lights.
Reflective mats like mirrors, metals, glass...all increase render time.
Add extra lights to those and it gets worse.
RodsArt posted Sun, 13 January 2008 at 6:09 AM
Agreed, as with any render "In any software package", the more detailed you make the recipe, the longer it takes to cook.
Taking all of these into consideration with each project, you can teach yourself where you want cut corners to accomplish desired results.
Also remember that the end all project can be created in individual parts and assembled in a 2D editor with layers. On the same note, many effects can be created in a 2D postwork enviroment with much more control.
Example: You want to create a lightning or laser effect in a scene. You can place lights close to the ambient effected subjects in the scene with out the actual bolt or beam, then add these elements in postwork. This saves a lot of render time.
All in all, the most important factor in any creation is knowing your tools. Once you logged many hours of practice, your experience will shorten each task. Finally take into account there is usually someone out there that's already done something similar to what you're trying to accomplish. Take full advantage of this and induldge in every tutorial, written, stills & video.
There's tons of stuff out there.
If you can Envision it, You CAN create it!!
p.s.
Light domes can create fantastic real-light effect & shadow. Experimenting with these in scenes with objects with no/or base materials can give you a lot of insight of what your software & hardware is able to produce in a reasonable time.
___
Ockham's razor- It's that simple
RodsArt posted Sun, 13 January 2008 at 6:23 AM
Here's a thread link to some methods I use, with some links attached.
http://www.renderosity.com/mod/forumpro/showthread.php?message_id=3057151&ebot_calc_page#message_3057151
___
Ockham's razor- It's that simple
ThunderStone posted Sun, 13 January 2008 at 7:51 AM
Quote - Here's a thread link to some methods I use, with some links attached.
http://www.renderosity.com/mod/forumpro/showthread.php?message_id=3057151&ebot_calc_page#message_3057151
Thanks for the tips and the links. It's very interesting... I have discovered masks and am trying to put them to good use... Sometimes it's very effective, as seen in my Kwanzaa series (Distance mask) Am fixing to use the Object mask. Don't know what I'll use it for, but it will be something that I feel is needed.
===========================================================
OS: Windows 11 64-bit
Poser: Poser 11.3 ...... Units: inches or meters depends on mood
Bryce: Bryce Pro 7.1.074
Image Editing: Corel Paintshop Pro
Renderer: Superfly, Firefly
9/11/2001: Never forget...
Smiles are contagious... Pass it on!
Today is the tomorrow you worried about yesterday
FranOnTheEdge posted Sun, 13 January 2008 at 8:54 AM
Render Times
Number of lights - intensity of same.
If soft shadows are on - it shoots up.
Type of mat - lots of glass shoots it up as does lots of reflections - so high shine does.
Complexity of mat - detailed Seriously Real mats take longer than most other ground mats (but worth it IMO).
Volumetric World ups it too
Volumetric mats instead of surface also do.
Lots of things in the view will up render times too, the more detailed the higher the render time. (Polygons)
Number of rays per pixel will also do it, enabled by picking "Super" in the render options.
Also picking "Premuim" in there enables all the soft shadows (as well as the soft shadows option in the light lab) the blurry reflections, blurry transmissions, true ambience and depth of field - all of which increase render times.
So does increasing the maximum ray depth... Total internal reflection....
Things in the light lab that increase render times:
Using a gel,
turning on soft shadows
Increasing intensity
Turning on Visible object: surface
Visible object: volume
Infinite light: - this actually decreased the render time
Basically just turning Bryce on, increases your render time! Lol. But try things out, see what happens.
Measure
your mind's height
by the shade it casts.
Robert Browning (Paracelsus)
ThunderStone posted Sun, 13 January 2008 at 10:24 AM
Gonna try it with Infinite Light and see if that helps with complex lighting situation.
:b_grin:
===========================================================
OS: Windows 11 64-bit
Poser: Poser 11.3 ...... Units: inches or meters depends on mood
Bryce: Bryce Pro 7.1.074
Image Editing: Corel Paintshop Pro
Renderer: Superfly, Firefly
9/11/2001: Never forget...
Smiles are contagious... Pass it on!
Today is the tomorrow you worried about yesterday
FranOnTheEdge posted Sun, 13 January 2008 at 10:42 AM
Intensity 25 - single light, infinite light in the light lab render options, not visible, and with soft shadows set to 8. Fall off: linear. No gel used.
With the bump off (and set to 1.6) it took 38 seconds, with it on, it took 1.02.
Measure
your mind's height
by the shade it casts.
Robert Browning (Paracelsus)
FranOnTheEdge posted Sun, 13 January 2008 at 10:47 AM
Measure
your mind's height
by the shade it casts.
Robert Browning (Paracelsus)
FranOnTheEdge posted Sun, 13 January 2008 at 11:51 AM
Just did another test with my new light sliver (- 23 lights) this time set to soft shadows 8 like the last single light test. (all 23 lights are at intensity 2)
Render time: 41:09
See? It don't half increase the time!
It's quite a nice effect though.
But imagine a whole scene lit like this, you'd still be there 6 months later!
Measure
your mind's height
by the shade it casts.
Robert Browning (Paracelsus)
Claymor posted Sun, 13 January 2008 at 12:15 PM
Wait until you start experimenting with subtracting lights from the dome in specific spots, changing colors on a few lights to add directional color change, spreading the whole group further or closer, ranging some lights not ranging others...you could be experimenting at it FOREVER!!!
Try turning off cast shadows too...it sometimes winds up almost looking like a film negative kind of image
ThunderStone posted Sun, 13 January 2008 at 12:58 PM
Quote - Blimy!
Just did another test with my new light sliver (- 23 lights) this time set to soft shadows 8 like the last single light test. (all 23 lights are at intensity 2)
Render time: 41:09See? It don't half increase the time!
It's quite a nice effect though.
But imagine a whole scene lit like this, you'd still be there 6 months later!
Have you tried to decrease the number of light in your light sliver to 10? I used 10... 9 arranged in a semi circle with 1 in the middle at the base of the arch, closer to the "ground" That light has the falloff parameter set to None, with cast shadow on. And everything else set to whatever the above experiment values I had set before.
See what you get when you tried that. You may have to increase the number of sliver but it shouldn't be too long a render time under default; until you get to superfine... That's where the problem lies...among other things... :m_wink:
===========================================================
OS: Windows 11 64-bit
Poser: Poser 11.3 ...... Units: inches or meters depends on mood
Bryce: Bryce Pro 7.1.074
Image Editing: Corel Paintshop Pro
Renderer: Superfly, Firefly
9/11/2001: Never forget...
Smiles are contagious... Pass it on!
Today is the tomorrow you worried about yesterday
FranOnTheEdge posted Sun, 13 January 2008 at 2:10 PM
Claymore... Hmmm never thought of that - colour change some, not others... Tried the changing the size bit - did you know that B6 brought my wings dome in with a yellow colour all over all the cubes? and that stayed there even after converting them to lights - puzzled the heck out of me for a while.
That's when I discovered you can change the shade(?) of the diffuse in the mat lab - I mean first I corrected the yellow by picking white, then I tried decreasing the strength by picking a grey instead of a white - made quite a difference!
No idea why B6 decided to colour everything yellow - it does what it likes these days, totally ignoring the actual colour put onto the cubes in Wings3d.
I wonder what would happen if......
Measure
your mind's height
by the shade it casts.
Robert Browning (Paracelsus)
ThunderStone posted Sun, 13 January 2008 at 2:18 PM
I also found out size does matter when it comes to rendering time. Increase the size, you increase the rendering time 10x. I think.... So when you factor all those things in, you might as well have a dedicated machine just for Bryce and check your rendering every 2 days... BOL
:b_funny:
===========================================================
OS: Windows 11 64-bit
Poser: Poser 11.3 ...... Units: inches or meters depends on mood
Bryce: Bryce Pro 7.1.074
Image Editing: Corel Paintshop Pro
Renderer: Superfly, Firefly
9/11/2001: Never forget...
Smiles are contagious... Pass it on!
Today is the tomorrow you worried about yesterday
FranOnTheEdge posted Sun, 13 January 2008 at 2:55 PM
I changed the diffuse colour of the light sliver in the mat lab to red...
So changing the diffuse colour of the lights in the mat lat to red increased the render time from 41:09 to 43:56. Interesting....
Measure
your mind's height
by the shade it casts.
Robert Browning (Paracelsus)
FranOnTheEdge posted Sun, 13 January 2008 at 3:33 PM
It took 33:45 to render - weird huh?
Measure
your mind's height
by the shade it casts.
Robert Browning (Paracelsus)
ThunderStone posted Sun, 13 January 2008 at 4:01 PM
Quote - I just turned all those lights in my sliver - negative - same intensity though (2) and this is the result.
It took 33:45 to render - weird huh?
Interesting... You could use that for the "black glo" look of the hippie's 60's LOL "Black light"?
===========================================================
OS: Windows 11 64-bit
Poser: Poser 11.3 ...... Units: inches or meters depends on mood
Bryce: Bryce Pro 7.1.074
Image Editing: Corel Paintshop Pro
Renderer: Superfly, Firefly
9/11/2001: Never forget...
Smiles are contagious... Pass it on!
Today is the tomorrow you worried about yesterday
FranOnTheEdge posted Sun, 13 January 2008 at 6:07 PM
I love playing with negative lights, it's been a long time since I had the opportunity.
Measure
your mind's height
by the shade it casts.
Robert Browning (Paracelsus)
ThunderStone posted Sun, 13 January 2008 at 6:30 PM
You know, Fran, you could make a hippie scene in Bryce, complete with black light, poster et al.
I wonder what how that would look in an abs?
Gonna try it
===========================================================
OS: Windows 11 64-bit
Poser: Poser 11.3 ...... Units: inches or meters depends on mood
Bryce: Bryce Pro 7.1.074
Image Editing: Corel Paintshop Pro
Renderer: Superfly, Firefly
9/11/2001: Never forget...
Smiles are contagious... Pass it on!
Today is the tomorrow you worried about yesterday
vncnt9663 posted Sun, 13 January 2008 at 9:15 PM
Wow! I've been out of town over the weekend and looks like you all have been busy.
ThunderStone,
Thanks for showing use your lighting test. I know the work you posted will come in handy.
Fran,
Wow! Wow! Thanks a whole lot a bunch. I feel like I've been watching the great chefs cook.
I need to try some of my own.
FranOnTheEdge posted Mon, 14 January 2008 at 11:05 AM
I still want to try out some of those options Claymor suggested, turn off a few here, change colour here and there, etc etc
I might try it with the postbox reverted to grey... dunno, still thinking about that one.
Do join in rjay9663, it's such fun seeing what effects you can get.
Measure
your mind's height
by the shade it casts.
Robert Browning (Paracelsus)
FranOnTheEdge posted Mon, 14 January 2008 at 11:18 AM
You can see that a cluster of lights at the back have been set to blue, the lights opposite the blue ones are set to a pale yellow and two on the right are left white, but increased to intensity 3.
Giving a blue back light, a yellow fill light and a normal main light.
Measure
your mind's height
by the shade it casts.
Robert Browning (Paracelsus)
ThunderStone posted Mon, 14 January 2008 at 11:46 AM
Interesting 3 point lighting system, Fran. Got to try that. Is this from the lighting rigs? or sliver?
===========================================================
OS: Windows 11 64-bit
Poser: Poser 11.3 ...... Units: inches or meters depends on mood
Bryce: Bryce Pro 7.1.074
Image Editing: Corel Paintshop Pro
Renderer: Superfly, Firefly
9/11/2001: Never forget...
Smiles are contagious... Pass it on!
Today is the tomorrow you worried about yesterday
FranOnTheEdge posted Mon, 14 January 2008 at 12:02 PM
23 light Sliver - I might try it with the whole dome, only that means completing the Wings model - laborious.
Measure
your mind's height
by the shade it casts.
Robert Browning (Paracelsus)
vncnt9663 posted Mon, 14 January 2008 at 12:08 PM
Fran,
I would love to. I need to find a job. So not much time for fun these days. But you have to know I'll book mark this fourm. Great stuff.
FranOnTheEdge posted Mon, 14 January 2008 at 12:51 PM
Measure
your mind's height
by the shade it casts.
Robert Browning (Paracelsus)
FranOnTheEdge posted Mon, 14 January 2008 at 12:54 PM
**Well I'm at university at the moment so I do the fun stuff at other times. Just spent all day moving paint around on a glass sheet, not as much fun as you might think, since I came away with a numb arm.
So here's the full dome - but I've again reduced the diffuse to a soft grey, rather than white - looks rather nice to me...
Measure
your mind's height
by the shade it casts.
Robert Browning (Paracelsus)