Hello everyone,

I'm not new around here but I don't post in the forums hardly ever.  But I need some help and advice.

I'm not an artist. not by any stretch of the imagination but I can follow a tutorial and I do okay with creating graphics. nothing as outstanding as some of the work I've seen here though.  I'm not trying to be an artist either, I just enjoy the creation process.

anyway I'm using Koshini.  for some reason I like the shape of her face.  I always have a hard time getting her arms and hands the way I want them.  Is it just me or are they unusually large? 
When I try to make the hands smaller by moving the dial down they get larger.  If I try moving the dial up they become extremely distorted. I've tried everything I can think of to get her hands looking somewhat decent.

The arms will go smaller by using the dials but it seems the elbows become distorted when I pose her.  With some poses I can cover the weird looking joints when I take her into photoshop and paint clothes on her.

Can anyone help me understand how to make Koshini's arms and hands not look so strange?  I can't find any good tutorials to follow on this. 

All I'm trying to achieve right now is I want her arms so that one is across her belly with her hand cupped around her side and the other arm across her belly the same way but just slightly above the other arm so that they aren't crossed over each other.  I end up with mangled wrists and elbows.

Since I'm not an artist I try to mimic those I like and what I'm trying to do is create a pose like this one:
http://www.hextasy.com/html/fuckoffhotlinkers/2D/nevergrowup-post.jpg

why does this seem so hard?

Thanks in advance for any advice or help.
Kelly

Koshini is a sort of halfway toonish character, and her hands are not
really meant to be realistic.

I just now tried scaling the hands, and you're right.  They do scale up and
down, but they also distort badly.  It appears that the joint setup is
wrong.  I also tried a crossed-arms position, and found the same problem. 
The shoulders go weird, and there doesn't seem to be any combination
of Front-back and Bend that will reach the crossed-arms position without
this distortion.

I'm afraid the only thing I can recommend is to use another figure!

You could try the figure I use for my avatar... she's all the way toonish,
but her joints behave properly and she's free. 

Edit: There is a Koshini 2 figure; I don't know which one you're using,
but it's possible that the version 2 has solved these basic problems.
Somebody else will know the answer to this!

My python page
My ShareCG freebies

ok so then it isn't just my ignorance. lol  I am using the upgraded koshini 2 and there's 2 joint refits.  I tried applying the refits and posing and I tried without the refits.  does the same thing either way. 

What figure is your avatar?  Is it a free one or would I need to save up some duckets?  I really get a kick out of using poser and this is really hanging me up right when I feel creative :)

ETA: thanks for helping me out.  It helps to know that there is a legitimate problem with the figure.

Kelly

My avatar is based on a free Japanese model called Kona.  She's
extremely simple and thus easy to set up quick scenes and cartoons.

None of those pesky unnecessary bits like fingers and eyelids!

She's available here:

http://park1.wakwak.com/~nucky/

The site is in Japanese, but I think the download is obvious.

I've built a "face kit" which adds a movable mouth and eyes,
available here:

http://ockhamsbungalow.com/PPP/KonaFaceKit.zip

My python page
My ShareCG freebies

Koshini is very nice figure, especially now, when she has 5 fingers ;)

It is not easy but you can scale hands and arms (not too much). Unfortunatelly you must spend some time with joint editor. I have no time to search atm. but you should find tips on PhilC tutorial page. Remember if you scale hand, you must scale fingers either.

If you do not find solution, I'll try to make tutorial tonight.
Good luck

Ockham, Thank you for that.  I'm getting ready to head off to work but I"ll check that out sometime today.    I really appreciate your help.

drapak12,  she didn't always have 5 fingers? LOL
I'll search for that joint editor too.  I really do like Koshini and I hate not being able to use her. Thank you. :)

I could not find in joint editor anything responsible for this strange behaviour. Anyway If you scale all fingers and thumb, hand looks ok. Only problems are small bulges on index and pinky - see pic (scale 90)

You can do one more trick. Load Koshini.obj, with 2 magnets make hands smaller, save obj as a KoshiniX.obj and hack cr2 file changing obj name. It is best solution, but I hate fix joints in all fingers what is necessery after such operation. It is quite easy but I'm too impatient. Fortunately you must fix joints in 1 hand only and after use symetry "do you want to copy joint zone's setup also?" - "YES" :)

yea see I do get those bulges.  but I also get weird things like that in the elbows, wrists and shoulder joints.    does it make a difference if you scale the hands when they are straight versus when they are posed?  the reason I ask is because when they are posed it doesn't matter how I scale them they become distorted.

I'll try your last trick but that seems very over my head.  I have no clue how to use magnets. I've seen them but I don't know how to use them.  I do know how to use symetry though!  :)

If you have no experience with joints and magnets do not expect good results in first try. Rigging figure is much more difficult then sculpting obj IMO

Anyway if you want try explain you step by step - Koshini is better then V4 to improve your skills ;)
Only 1 picture this time - sorry I'm very busy tonight.

1. Find Koshini.cr2 in character libraries (maybe Koshini2.cr2) and open in notepad
2. Find path to obj file (probably runtimes/geometries/LadyLittlFox/Koshini.obj or Kosini.obz)
3. Import Koshini.obj to poser (if you found Kosini.obz file should be unpacked with 7zip or winrar to obj)
4. When you have selected Koshini (she is prop now ;) ) in menu object select "create magnet". Mag1 apear in window.
5. Move mag base to right hand, magnet goes follw base, later move mag zone. Hand should be in the middle of zone (see picture above).
6. On magnet parameters change scale - hands will be smaller, fingers can be bigger then palm (in such situation move mag zone left right till hand will be ok) or hand can be unnatural bend (in this situation translate magnet along y axis).
7. If you are satisfied with results create next magnet. Select "mag base1" and press ctrl C, select mag base2 and press ctrl V, in mag base 2 change "translate x" value from negative to positive (means delete "-"). Do the same with mag zones and mags (if you translated mag alongh x axis)
8. In menu object select "spawn morph target". New morph apears on prop parameter window. Set morph = 1 and delete magnets.
9. Export KoshiniBLABLA.obj to folder where org obj was placed.
10. In cr2 file change name of obj (see pt 2) and save file as KoshiniBLABLA.cr2
11. When you load koshiniBLA to poser she will looks nice, but her hands do not work correct. You must change theirs parameters in joint editor window. Change center values to fit bones to fingers. Look to this threat:
    http://www.renderosity.com/mod/forumpro/showthread.php?thread_id=2748857
    I've written there about center of joints, but you cannot copy this parameters, you must find them on your own what probable takes some times.

Correcting joints is most difficult for me so I wish you good luck :)

oh wow!  you really went out of your way to write that up.  You have no idea how much I appreciate that.  I'm printing it as I type.  It'll take me some time to work through it but I"ll let you know how it goes.  I"m looking forward to learning this. :)