Well. When I say very popular. I mean relatively, for amputee stuff lol.

There might still be a market for amputees morphs if done correctly and efficiently.  I would consider downloading those files, never know when you'll need such a feature in a render.

Can you tell me how I can find the replies for me?

Christopher

Peggy_Sue_nash posted at 10:55 AM Sat, 20 August 2022 - #4443015

Can you tell me how I can find the replies for me?

Christopher

For common items like gloves, dresses, etc., do a web search but you need to be specific as to which model you are using, for example, Victoria 4.

hborre posted at 11:06 AM Sat, 20 August 2022 - #4443018

There might still be a market for amputees morphs if done correctly and efficiently.  I would consider downloading those files, never know when you'll need such a feature in a render.

I'd be inclined to LF atm, just because she's the flavor of the month in the Poserverse. I don't think LF nor LH are particularly good figures for erotica, just to circle back to that angle for a second, but they are about as good as any for this type of thing, amputation that is lol.  I'd really be inclined to create it for Nova, but nobody uses that figure. And she is fatally flawed for animation lacking IK and any way that I know of to set up working IK for that figure. I like PE, I just recently bought the X bundle at rotica, but again another margin figure...

?

Anyway. Food for thought for a future project that would be fun and easy to do (by easy I usually mean interesting, holding my attention). Back to LF character creation currently in work. Ironically enough, expressions also.

I know what you mean.  You really don't want to get caught up trying to create morphs for a bunch of models that are marginal at best.

I know what you mean.  You really don't want to get caught up trying to create morphs for a bunch of models that are marginal at best.

primorge posted at 12:17 PM Sat, 20 August 2022 - #4443034

hborre posted at 12:04 PM Sat, 20 August 2022 - #4443031

I know what you mean.  You really don't want to get caught up trying to create morphs for a bunch of models that are marginal at best.

Well I've done quite a bit of that. And still have some very elaborate things in the fire along those lines. Being that I don't really do publically released on an organized site freebies anymore I don't feel particularly rushed to get things done asap. I am considering doing some marketplace submissions, but I've said that before. One thing is I try not to show too much until something is finished. Another thing is, and this is the machiavellian douchbag in me talking, if anyone happens to see something I'm working on and were to by chance be inspired to create something like it as a MP product, just be very certain of your quality and talent. I will promptly release my version a week later as a freebie on every Poser freebie site possible lol... capitalism.

I'm kidding of course Y-Phil... or am I? :D Depends on my mental state at which particular time of the day. Such hubris. Did I mention I love animals? I'm not really a villain I just play one on the Poser forum lol.

RIP thread!

Peggy Sue Started it!

I think secretly I've always wanted to say that.

Peggy Sue Started it!

I think secretly I've always wanted to say that.

Leave your sister alone and come in wash your hands! Dinner is almost ready.

odf posted at 7:30 PM Sat, 20 August 2022 - #4443057

primorge posted at 6:49 PM Sat, 20 August 2022 - #4443054

Peggy Sue Started it!

I think secretly I've always wanted to say that.

Leave your sister alone and come in wash your hands! Dinner is almost ready.

(Am I doing it right?)

Envelope pushed

To get this back on track, here's a question: I'd like to add some wrinkles to the expression morphs for the brows, and possibly to the squint. But what's more user-friendly, subdivision morphs or bump maps? Aside from the question of creating appropriate sub-d morphs; let's just assume I can.

Bump maps. Or actually a combination. Furrowed brows are very difficult to pull off with morphs unless the topology is specifically designed with the edgeflow directed for it. I've tried it with subdivision morphs with not so good results. The creasing is difficult to pull off convincingly, at least at reasonable subdivision levels. I wasn't using a figure with topology designed for that though, LF. You'd have better luck with V4 for that. I'd have to look at Antonia. I'd say do what you can with the gross anatomy with morphs and top it off with bump or normal for the tight creasing.

Here's  what I'm talking about, notice how V4's topology is designed for brow creasing? Antonia, LF, V4

I'm assuming that we're talking about expressive wrinkles and not resting. Of course maps specifically for an expression would be kinda weird.

Good luck with that. Antonia's topology isn't much different than LF's in that area. Quad grid. Tough to do unless subdivided quite a bit, which introduces it's own set of peculiarities for expressions. Generally you'd want to create expressions at the lowest subdivision level possible as it's easier to get the muscular sort of pull of adjoining topology when you move a section. If that makes sense. There's more of a sculpted in place rather than free movement sort of thing the higher you go.

Maybe liquid ice will come along and answer your questions in regards to creating expression morphs, assuming he's ever created any. Other than that you might be stuck with my responses lol.

You answered the question I specifically told you not to worry about. Which is also useful, don't get me wrong, but I'd prefer to think about it the other way round. Identify the ideal outcome from the user end, then if that can't be achieved in practice, fall back to whatever is left.

Anyway, let's talk about bump maps specifically. I can wire up a bump map so that its strength follows the strength of a specific morph, which is what I'd want to do for things like raised eyebrows. The problem is, what happens when the user loads a new head material? Generally, the old one gets overwritten, so my nice bump map goes bye-bye. How do I prevent that or make it easy to load the bump maps and their wiring on top of an existing material?

Good luck with that. Antonia's topology isn't much different than LF's in that area. Quad grid. Tough to do unless subdivided quite a bit, which introduces it's own set of peculiarities for expressions. Generally you'd want to create expressions at the lowest subdivision level possible as it's easier to get the muscular sort of pull of adjoining topology when you move a section. If that makes sense. There's more of a sculpted in place rather than free movement sort of thing the higher you go.

Looks like you have it all figured out. What you say in your second post sounds like a solution.  I just know it's hard to create a fuck face furrowed brow on LF with any sort of bell or whistle lol. But I didn't try that hard. I'm thinking specifically of the face Remy Lacroix makes :D And yes I have a few Remy Brow Fuck Face dials gathering dust.

Interested in seeing how the process works out, maybe I'll learn something :)

Word of warning however. Always test your HD morphs through an injection immediately ;)

Second word of warning. Sometime you'll get little explosions when mixing a standard morph with a HD morph. And I've found that sometimes NOT baking down to subdivision yields more stable results. Don't ask me why on any of this... I just know from observing.

Oh, the things you make me google!

I wouldn't say I have a solution. I have an approach, and I daresay the most likely to work if anything will. Might still not be good enough, but we'll see.

Probably not of much interest but I've been working on this sci fi character a bit using LF. Anyway I'm also in the expressions stages, it's a little different though. I'm creating surrogate dials for some of the existing expressions with minor tweaks via difference morphs and driven by a new master. I'm also creating additional new expressions that combine manipulation of her face chips and then all of that being driven by an adjustment difference morph as the master, essentially a post transform master morph driving multiple joints in her face. The face has some pretty extreme scaling stuff going on with the eyes. About twice the size of the built in dials. Obviously match centers stuff. After all that's done I'll move on to HD morph detailing of the head, mostly just shaping HD stuff. Ridges, veins, etc,  and then pose controllers for her tongue, which uses animated joint centers. The additional pose controller dials just need to be set up for that, the actual animated centers are already done. And a host of ear morph varieties.

Then it's on to the body. The character will have a custom body with custom JCMs and HD morphs. A full suite of breast morphs that's a redux of my old eldritch breast morph set. And pose controllers. Most of all that stuff was done about a year ago so it's just tidying it up. Same with the textures, which need to be modified a bit for this character. But they were also done about a year ago, just need to be tweaked to fit this particular character. Its MR and custom painted stuff that I labored on quite extensively. I figured I better polish up some of my unfinished LF loose ends and get them out there. I'll show some pics when it's completely done. It's going to be a marketplace submission. Probably a bit different than most things you see for LF. 

Here's some of the expression dials and an example morph driven face chip expression dependency...

Still a ways to go on adding expressions but getting close to completion... mostly brow stuff left.

Neat looking stuff, primorge! Way ahead of anything I've tried with keyed dependencies so far.

In the meantime, I had a quick try at doing subd 2 vertex pushing for furrowed brows with the Poser morph tool. That's a resounding nope, LOL. Starting with the fact that the mirror function makes Poser crash, which I think is caused by Antonia's extra brow geometry. But it's also just not responsive enough for any detail work. So Blender and pydeltamesh it is, possibly with some tweaks to the latter to allow me to load just a new subdivision level for an existing morph without baking the new deltas down.

I think you should dump the morph brush and move over entirely to blender. I know, I know. Also don't neglect using the edit modes transform gizmos with proportional editing active. Basically a super controllable and precise magnet feature. Just do a bit of reading on the proportional editing, it's extremely useful for morphing... things you just can't do with sculpting tools. Scaling and transforms with gizmo and numeric precision. little icon shown at top stroked in orange here.

Anyway. Time to save my work in Poser and get some sleep. Talk to you next time odf.

So the pydeltamesh subdivision morph loader does not work for me at all. It makes a morph, but in this case it looks as if it just bakes down to subd-0 and ignores the higher levels. The deltas are all wrong. I've contacted the author, but they don't seem inclined to do anything about it, the antisocial slacker.

So maybe I'll try bump maps for the furrowed brows, or maybe I'll just put it on the "later" pile.

odf posted at 3:36 AM Mon, 22 August 2022 - #4443121

So the pydeltamesh subdivision morph loader does not work for me at all. It makes a morph, but in this case it looks as if it just bakes down to subd-0 and ignores the higher levels. The deltas are all wrong. I've contacted the author, but they don't seem inclined to do anything about it, the antisocial slacker.

So maybe I'll try bump maps for the furrowed brows, or maybe I'll just put it on the "later" pile.

...still stuck with GoZ (shrug), honestly subd morphs are wonky at best. I've been lucky to get 1 out of 3 to work as expected. Sure it works, just don't get too attached to a particular morph while making it and usually expect to have to remake it. AND save to an injection immediately and test, because sometimes it doesn't pass to inject to boot. Blackhearted must of either had a magic wand or an incredible amount of patience when he made his Femme Fatale morphs. That's a LOT of hair pulling.

One day I will circle around and see if I can fix the problem. Could be just some incorrect calculations. But today is not that day.

For the record: when I wrote "assume that I can," I did not mean that I was assuming I could. What I meant was whether under the assumption that the morph could be made, it would be a better solution from the user perspective than a bump map. Still kind of relevant, because if the answer were to be "a subdivision morph would be soooo much more practical if it could be made," that might give me some strong motivation to try and make my loader work properly. Otherwise, there's a chance I'll just leave the loader alone until I come across another potential use for subdivision morphs.

Just, you know, some background on my thought processes.

I made about 3 different brow furrow HD morphs in Zbrush months ago. This is probably best of the lot, 1 level subdivision in creation, increased to 2 here. Took some digging to find this hidden in one of my dozens of LF morph scene files... it's not perfect but it's good enough. Furrowed brows are tough without the right topology conducive to it. I imagine if you crank up the subdivision better results can be had but by rote I keep my HD morphs at one or 2 levels. La Femme loads at 1 level preview/2 render so I try to stay in that ball park... most of the things I do would only require 2 levels at most.

Looking neat, primorge.

...thinking about it I don't think I used the pinch or dam standard here. Just the move and standard draw brush. I could probably improve the result with the dam standard.

Did I mention I don't like navigation in Zbrush lol.

If you're going to attempt it with Poser's morph brush I would create a hide brows for Antonia. Might help with the crash/ lag thing. Give me a few and I'll make an inject for her...

Looks like Antonia already has a hide brows morph in utilities... I'll finish this one anyway. Give me a minute...

Nevermind, yours does literally the exact same thing. Ah well, I tried.

Nevermind, yours does literally the exact same thing. Ah well, I tried.

Here's 3 simple furrowed brow morphs made in Zbrush for Antonia. 1 level of subdivision. They're not very large and all basically the same, subtle differences. If you want to use them, cool. I could do them over larger or change them if you wanted but not tonight. Actually not my finest work but I'm tired and navigating in Zbrush is like being wasted drunk compared to Mudbox or Blender.

One other thing. Sometimes you need to save your Poser scene and reload it for the subD morphs to successfully write to an injection. Something to be aware of...

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1W0iId7aZs9cAD_4c8Vu755loOxb8OzdC/view?usp=drivesdk

The morphs appear in the body, in the morph parm group. There's no limits. The pmd that the pz2 calls on should stay with the pose. You can put the pz2 anywhere as I edited the file path absolute. It's just 3 files in the zip, not in a Runtime structure. The pz2, pmd, and thumb.

They're not baked down. So only appear with subd at 1 or higher. Just to head off "hey dis don't work" from potential randoms.

Looking good, judging by the picture. Will have a closer look after work tonight.

Nice work, primorge! I learned a new thing about Poser, too, namely that changing the sub-d level for individual body parts breaks subdivision morphs, at least in my version of Poser 12 (one behind the latest, I think). When I first loaded your morphs, they didn't work, so I tried them on a fresh Antonia from the original CR2. All good. Had Poser irreparably broken my expression WIP figure? Nope, when I set the sub-d level for the eyes to 0 on pristine Antonia, your morphs were invisible again.

So then I also tried to load my test morph from yesterday via pydeltamesh on the WIP figure, and it finally showed up. Phew! Thanks primorge, not only for the neat morphs, but also for sending me down a path I would have otherwise missed.

So the (putative) issue with the brow geometry plus the fact that the workaround for the blocky eyes breaks subdivision morphs makes me think I'll make the easy geometry changes a fair bit earlier than originally planned. By which I mean removing the brow overlays and toe caps, and fixing the topology of the eyes and breasts. Separate teeth are more work, so I'll still leave that for later, sorry primorge!

Given how well the fitting room works, there isn't really any reason to wait, either. I just had a quick try with an imported OBJ and everything seems to have transferred perfectly, including grouping, rigging, weight maps, JCMs and regular morphs.

Antonia's critical point regarding automatic grouping was the strake between the breasts, where garments that do not have a recess between the breasts and spans from bust point to bust point. The garment then is at some distance from the chest facets while the normals of the facets of the breasts point across it. I recall some cases where the fitting room generated grouping did not have a line of chest facets separating the facets of the left and right collars.

One way around this is a spandax morphed donor figure.

Nice work, primorge! I learned a new thing about Poser, too, namely that changing the sub-d level for individual body parts breaks subdivision morphs, at least in my version of Poser 12 (one behind the latest, I think). When I first loaded your morphs, they didn't work, so I tried them on a fresh Antonia from the original CR2. All good. Had Poser irreparably broken my expression WIP figure? Nope, when I set the sub-d level for the eyes to 0 on pristine Antonia, your morphs were invisible again.

So then I also tried to load my test morph from yesterday via pydeltamesh on the WIP figure, and it finally showed up. Phew! Thanks primorge, not only for the neat morphs, but also for sending me down a path I would have otherwise missed.

Glad you figured it out. That's not the issue I was having, mine was the morphs appearing less refined than I originally made them in the sculpting software. Sort of like it was dumping a subdivision level or something, like it was at the proper level but the results were as if at a lower level. I didn't do any further testing because SudD morphs weren't a priority at the time. I'll do some tests and post what I come up with.