I guess Lightwavers can't bring themselves to dis' Poser on principle now that SplineGod, one of Lightwave's best, is using it.  

Quote - I guess Lightwavers can't bring themselves to dis' Poser on principle now that SplineGod, one of Lightwave's best, is using it.  

You will note that SplineGod  is working on a real life production with real deadlines.
those who Disparage poser on principle often are not people who have to meet deadlines involving humanoid figures.
anyway it good to see  the maturity over at the newtek  pro community.

Cheers

Wolf I was gong to say the same thing! Long live production!

This look so important that SplineGod developed the plugin so Lightwave can open Poser content now.

The people I've seen that dis Poser/DAZ content big time have always been the wannabes (mostly wannabe modelers) and denizens of forums. Eventually they move on when they can't get a job at any of the big houses and the smarter ones realize they can make money building Poser content.
 
Pros (who usually are too busy to frequent forums and don't have the anti-Poser baggage) realize what a time and cost saver it can be and is. After all, they are very affordable OBJ models which can be used in any pro-level program.

I've worked in radio since 1972 and most broadcast professionals would never dream of making their own sound effects, though at one time that was a specialized job in radio. Now that only exists in movies and TV. You can use a library or buy what you don't have. CG is moving in that direction. There's not enough time and money in the production world to re-invent the wheel. The specialists still exist to create something new or something that doesn't exist, but if what's in a library will work, even with some tweaking, that's the way to go, especially if you want to have a life!

The amazing& Ironic thing is ,According to  DAZ, they Use Lightwave& Modo for their flagship models (V4 etc.)

If a Daz Employee had posted some wip's and "wires" over at CG society for Example,During the creation of V4, he would have gotten All kinds of praise for his skills with lightwave & Modo.

No you take that SAME LW/Modo mesh and rig it  for poser and it instantly becomes "Garbage" in the eyes of some.

Oh well .

If you look at DAZ3D's gallery compared to what's being rendered for CG Society's gallery,  you'll see why there are two standards.

Quote - If a Daz Employee had posted some wip's and "wires" over at CG society for Example,During the creation of V4, he would have gotten All kinds of praise for his skills with lightwave & Modo.

No, he would have gotten dinged for the bad anatomy (arm pit/latissimus dorsi, legs length, wonky face), topology that does not flow all that well in some places (arm pit again) and he would have got dinged on the rigging (arm pit again!) Here's a couple of examples:
http://forums.cgsociety.org/showthread.php?f=43&t=684054
http://forums.cgsociety.org/showthread.php?f=43&t=688666

Here's a hair animation demo I did with C4D's hair - not that it's very good, but it shows off some hair movement at least.

Wheres the animation?? And people at Daz signed a NDA and they will never show images from Daz products outside before launched.

Oh, oops.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kmhNXXDCe1U

The actual scene file can be had from my freebies.

Quote -

No, he would have gotten dinged for the bad anatomy (arm pit/latissimus dorsi, legs length, wonky face), topology that does not flow all that well in some places (arm pit again) and he would have got dinged on the rigging (arm pit again!) Here's a couple of examples:
http://forums.cgsociety.org/showthread.php?f=43&t=684054
http://forums.cgsociety.org/showthread.php?f=43&t=688666

But overall the guy was given POSITIVE encouragement on his modeling  effort
and yes those micro-crits/complaints will always be given when a human model is being shown .
Perhaps V4 was a bad example
but my point is anytime you post a model from poser the conversation goes WAY beyond nitpicks about topology and quickly turn to harsh admonishments against using poser in the first place. No matter where the mesh itself was modeled
 
I  clearly remember Sanctumart posting images of the "Grim Armor" and the pheno-ype "Drub" creature that he modeled in  Autodesk 3DMAX
and he made the FRONT PAGE of CG society.
With all kinds of praise for his 3DMAX skills in the forums.

But if one takes Sanctums poserized versions of those exact same models& textures
render them in Cinema4D with AR or VRay and post
"Software used: Poser & Cinema4D"
You will get a completely Different reaction.
 Ive seen it time and time again.

Well of course, if somebody else takes Sanctum's models and makes a render of them - they are SANCTUM'S MODELS, should you get an A+ from your Creative Writing teacher if you quote 5 pages of Shakespeare?  Of course an original work will get more praise (will deserve more praise) than a render of somebody else's modeling and texturing work.

I also noticed a CGSociety highly praised (and duly merited) thread of a human project photoshop workup....in which the author had used V3 as the base! Not credited, of course, but her armpits and shoulders gave away her secret identity.

prjz the hair animation looks tentalizingly fine. You don't render the ending -- with the head dead still -- long enough to ascertain if it comes to a complete, natural and jitter-free (with collision remaining on) stop. However, I can spot fitter even in moving hair and do not see any. I am sure that is a cool hair engine.

::::: Opera :::::

Shrug, download the scene file and run it as long as you want to.

Shrug, download the scene file and run it as long as you want to.

Quote - Well of course, if somebody else takes Sanctum's models and makes a render of them - they are SANCTUM'S MODELS, should you get an A+ from your Creative Writing teacher if you quote 5 pages of Shakespeare?  .

Nope but if you are a Filmmaker who Does a modern day remake of "The Merchant of Venice"  is it rational for people to disparage you entire film making/directing /cinematography effort based on their
own blind hatred of shakespeare??..

Not everyone is looking for praise over their modeling skills
Some of us are CG illustrators/artists/animators who use a variety of assets to get a Comission Done.

Opera, I'm thinking about LW too especially because of the soft body physics.  I had hoped this would be a part of the next Carrara, but I doubt it will.  I think for me it will be a matter of how much LW will cost.

In the NewTek forums at the bottom there is a section on Buy/Sell and 'pre-owned' licenses go on sale there sometimes, for less than the established price of $895 ($995 with printed manuals).

I don't think you'll find a thread like that at the Autodesk forums!

::::: Opera :::::

Quote - Nope but if you are a Filmmaker who Does a modern day remake of "The Merchant of Venice"  is it rational for people to disparage you entire film making/directing /cinematography effort based on their own blind hatred of shakespeare??..

If they enter said film in a scriptwriter-oriented film competition, yeah it would rate some disparagement.

Quote - Not everyone is looking for praise over their modeling skills
Some of us are CG illustrators/artists/animators who use a variety of assets to get a Comission Done.

Then those people should avoid cgSociety, which is very much oriented towards the modeler and texturer and not so much towards the guy who collects a bunch of other people's models and takes a picture of them.

Wait a minute. This conversation is starting to turn my thread sour. Seriously, I'd ask you guys to cease. I can't demand it of course, but is now threatening to dredge up all sorts of old flame wars. I hope you will stop.

I won't be offering much new fnformation myself until after Thanksgiving weekend, when I dive into the deep end of LightWave. I am getting a lot out of the productive posts here in the meantime.

::::: Opera :::::

Terribly sorry!

Quote - Wait a minute. This conversation is starting to turn my thread sour. Seriously, I'd ask you guys to cease. I can't demand it of course, but is now threatening to dredge up all sorts of old flame wars. I hope you will stop.
::::: Opera :::::

Agreed John  these pointless debate serve no one.

Im sure Sanctumart would agree that Some of us are Glad that those who cant do tend to $$buy$$$ from those of us who can.
(See my Sig banner link)

after all if everyone knew how to model and create morphed character for V4 there would
NO market for alot of our products now would there.

Cheers

Okay wolf but you didn't really need to get in the last word, did you?

NO sorry for the thread derail  man
I really like CG Society
the place for those who only model and texture

www.cgsociety.org

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anyway Im  off to the to laundrymat.****

**

$900 seems pretty steep right now with the economy the way it is.  Hopefully, there will be some improvement to C7 worthwhile.

Well I am in the beta test and just posted an animation of the hair after being fixed, and while now quite good, it is still not in a league with the hair engines in Cinema, Max, Lightwave. You can see that animation at DAZ in the "public beta prelease discussion" thread.

But no dynamic cloth now or in the foreseable future.

::::: Opera :::::

Just wanted to share a bit of pricing info.

There's an authorized LW Dealer selling LW 9 for $718.95 w/ free shipping. 

Yet, another site where you can buy a competive upgrade for LightWave 9 Full with PDF Manual  $429.99. Must have one of the following: Softimage XSI, Maya, 3ds max, Cinema 4D, Modo, After Effects, Photoshop, Shake, Digital Fusion.

I've heard, but haven't confirmed, if you email Newtek and ask about a competitive upgrade you can get it for $495. 

I installed and goofed around with the trial version. I need to spend more time with it. 
 

Hi everyone,

As a Lightwave user, I thought I'd give you my viewpoint of the program. Basically, I love using Lightwave to model my stuff. It lacks some tools that would make the modelling process easier but you can make do with the program and some nifty plugins. But the majority of stuff I do in Lightwave is modelling and things like animation is a rare thing for me.
But, because I like it so much, it doesn't mean I recommend it for everyone. Some people may find an affinity for Max, Maya, Softimage, Modo, etc... Lightwave 'clicked' with me because I felt like I could model more freeform with it.. Zbrush is an excellent accompaniment to Lightwave because you get more organic modelling with it. I honestly could not do as well in my organic work without Zbrush.
The unofficial brother of Lightwave (in my opinion) is Modo, which is incredibly customisable and can mimic interfaces and controls from other programs such as Max and Maya. I've never used it but I've seen it in action and it doesn't disappoint.

The funny thing is that I have seen models made in Lightwave that look like Poser models not because they were using models from Poser but because the modelling work was low grade or maybe because a Poser model was used as reference.

My suggestion is to download the trial version of Lightwave and check out lots of different tutorials to get the feel of how it works. It may take a while for you to like it but, if it doesn't feel right for you then try a different program.

When I started doing 3d in the past, I tried to use Max and I hated it cos I felt like I was modelling with a calculator. I know that things have changed in regards to how Max runs but I prefer the freedom and speed of Lightwave. Also, apparently, the renderer is better then most other 3d programs. I can't really compare because I've been using Lightwave for so long.

Anyway, that's my input on the subject.

Cheers,
Paul
(mix_mash)