Hey guys, I was curious if there were any other programs like poser that are compatible with all the content available for poser?  I 've been using poser for a while and quite frankly, I hate it. I think the software is a huge pile of shit.  

Is there another program out there a bit more professional without all the problems?

Is DAZ studio any good?

there is a free version of DAZ studio, try it and see if you like it. I find it abit awkward to use personally but then I've been using Poser since version 2, so anything else would seem awkward.

If you could please identify your perception of what the problems are we may be able to give a more helpful answer.

What are you trying to use Poser for? How is it failing in allowing you to achieve your objectives?

Daz Studio, Carrara and Vue will all use poser content. They all have issues though.

What problems is Poser giving you and what version and service pack have you got. ?

Quote - Hey guys, I was curious if there were any other programs like poser that are compatible with all the content available for poser?  I 've been using poser for a while and quite frankly, I hate it. I think the software is a huge pile of shit.  

Is there another program out there a bit more professional without all the problems?

Is DAZ studio any good?

@ Zanzo

Hmmm ...

Frankly, I am curious ...
If you really feel that way*, e.g.,  (" ... huge pile of ...")* why are you even using it ? :blink:

An observation ... you have been "here" for over 2 years and, now, are just posting this question ??? Why ???

cheers,
dr geep
;=]

Remember ... "With Poser, all things are possible, and poseable!"

cheers,

dr geep ... :o]

edited 10/5/2019

Well, as mentioned above, there is a free version of DazStudio. Also, the paid version is far cheaper than Poser and has more functionality than the free version. Carrara is expensive, maybe prohibitively, and if you don't need to model, I wouldn't recommend it if all you want is to pose figures and set up scenes.

What version of Poser are you using? I use Poser 7 and have very few problems.

Laurie

Based on your comments, Carrara may be what you're looking for.

Klebnor

Lotus 123 ~ S-Render ~ OS/2 WARP ~ IBM 8088 / 4.77 Mhz ~ Hercules Ultima graphics, Hitachi 10 MB HDD, 64K RAM, 12 in diagonal CRT Monitor (16 colors / 60 Hz refresh rate), 240 Watt PS, Dual 1.44 MB Floppies, 2 button mouse input device.  Beige horizontal case.  I don't display my unit.

Quote - I think the software is a huge pile of shit.  

Riiiight. I'm with you. And I applaud your choice of the Poser forum to make that declaration. grin

If Poser wasn't a huge pile of shit, I'd have nothing to do for tutorials. Everyone would automatically know what to do and wouldn't be interested in what I have to say.

Also, I'd have less consulting income. Yay - pile of shit - keep it coming! More for me!

---

Renderosity forum reply notifications are wonky. If I read a follow-up in a thread, but I don't myself reply, then notifications no longer happen AT ALL on that thread. So if I seem to be ignoring a question, that's why. (Updated September 23, 2019)

LOL @ BB

I guess that is why Maxon don't give good documentation for Bodypaint. LOL

I'm actually about to get that figured out and have decreased my swearing at it almost completely. LOL

It ran briljant om my previous PC, until the PC crashed. ATI RAGE PROII 512MB card

it ran briljant on my back up PC, ATI 512MB x7OOSE,  until that one crashed (2 days after the first one went) NO LOL at all.

Bought me a netbook, Dell 1012 Windows7 Starter pack, , 1.6GHz, 1GB RAM , Intel Graphics Media Accelerator 3150 with 256MB Video, installed perfectly, and ran like a dream. Slower, OK, but it was workcable (HOOKED IT INTO MY BIG SCREEN)

Then the Dell got replaced with an ASUS 1001 HA, Windows XP, 1.6GHz, 1GB RAM, Mobile Intel 945 Express with 224MB Video Chipset,  and again it ran great.

Now the new rig is home.
A quad 64Bit  thing, Windows Home Professional, with an ATI 1024 card and 6 GB RAM

Now it flies.

That where 4 different  installations in a weeks time.   Poser8 SR 2.1 never let me down.

Was slow on the netbooks, yeah.
I must add however, that only P8- and legacy content got installed. + some tests files.

Did not yet have the time, or the guts, to install "MY" things. 

 

Poser 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 7, P8 and PPro2010, P9 and PP2012, P10 and PP2014 Game Dev
"Do not drive faster then your angel can fly"!

Just go straight to porn, no messy dial spinning there.
snarf

I had an intel graphics built into my quad core duo board and had nothing but trouble out of 3D software. It was suggested to buy a Nvidia Quadro FX 580 and did so. I have not had any problems since.

Poser is far from professional.

1) It tries to communicate via winsock and it's not even going out to the internet. This is called a "hack job".  Imagine a giant bandaid over poser splash screen when you first fire it up.

2) It uses valuable CPU resources rendering the slow & clunky interface.

3) It takes a million years for objects to become visible in the library pallette.

4) Poser wasn't designed for a HUGE library, it's a mom & pop app for people who have like 5 figures and a hat.

5. There isn't a button that allows you to turn off all IK. You have to go one by one and turn them all off which takes at least 10-20 seconds.  It gets annoying after a while.

6) Models break in the arms all the frickin time and I have to do symmetry to repair the broken geometry.  I

7) Poser crashes often with heavy use. I have to save every 5 minutes to be safe.

8) The basic preview render is slow & clunky and it's difficult to move objects around.

9) Even if you turn on fast mode there is always a GIANT box in your way so you have to waste all your time finding out which object is the box to make it invisible.

Man I could go on & on ........

Poser is a perfect example of building a temple on shifting sand.  This app should of been completely re-written A LONG TIME AGO!

Instead they are piling on brick after brick on a foundation built on MUD and feces.

Welcome to poser 8:

What are your system specs? You didn't mention those. My system runs Poser 7 a bit slowly when rendering and has problems with object-intensive scenes, but then, I only have a gig of RAM. Pretty pov for 3D work.
Have you installed all updates?

Monterey/Mint21.x/Win10 - Blender3.x - PP11.3(cm) - Musescore3.6.2

Wir sind gewohnt, daß die Menschen verhöhnen was sie nicht verstehen
[it is clear that humans have contempt for that which they do not understand] 

Metaphor of Chooks

I suggest you buy 3DS Max it is professional and you can brag about it. LOL.

. 

A HOMELAND FOR POSER FINALLY

-Poser allows for multiple runtimes, so you can split stuff up and get a faster load.
-You can put an IK_OFF script on one of the script menu bittons
-Move objets with the parameter dials , its much easier than trying to drag in the preview window.
-I run Poser 7 in fast mode with texture display and its fine for several figures and scenery. If it starts to slow I go to smooth shaded.
-Use the pulldowns to select figure or bodypart/prop/light etc.

Poser crashing is bad , and has been a problem for a long while. Save often .
If crashing is getting too persistant try deleting the libraryprefs.xml and the UI interface.xml files and let Poser recreate them. You will need to add external runtimes again.   

These are just points I have learned over several years with Poser.

And yes it is a hobby application. All the content is incredibly cheap compared to what I can buy for aLightwave or 3dsmax.  YAY poser.

I got Carrara 6 Pro for free on a magazine a while back.  Daz also  has a book on character creation that comes with it as well as Hexagon and a bunch of V4 & M4 Content for around  $25.

I should install it one of these days, but I've been too busy with Poser... :biggrin:

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

The Wisdom of bagginsbill:

"Oh - the manual says that? I have never read the manual - this must be why."
“I could buy better software, but then I'd have to be an artist and what's the point of that?"
"The [R'osity Forum Search] 'Default' label should actually say 'Don't Find What I'm Looking For'".
bagginsbill's Free Stuff... https://web.archive.org/web/20201010171535/https://sites.google.com/site/bagginsbill/Home

What magazine and issue was that WandW?

 That was 3DArtist issue 1.  Version 6.2.  I have installed it but very rarely use it

that ebook on character creation sounded interesting. I'd like to read DAZ's methods on the subject.

Attached Link: http://www.daz3d.com/i/3d-models/training-materials/figures-characters-and?item=9166&cat=943&_m=d

> Quote - that ebook on character creation sounded interesting. I'd like to read DAZ's methods on the subject.

actually the book isn't on character creation and isn't by DAZ, it is a guide to using DAZ studio (and is an actual book not an ebook).  But it does indeed include free versions of Carrara and Hexagon.

Wow... Someone is really hating on Poser. 

2) It uses valuable CPU resources rendering the slow & clunky interface. -  Read the system requirements to run Poser 8.  If you have more than the minimum requirements then clean the spyware and background programs that are eating your system resources.  I run Poser 8 on a computer with 2.5GB RAm that I purchased almost 10 years ago. I can render, surf the net, and chat on yahoo IM without any crashes or freezes

3) It takes a million years for objects to become visible in the library pallette. - I had this problem when the crappy adobe flash came out.  But I haven't had the problem after adobe corrected the issue. It wasn't a Poser issue.

4) Poser wasn't designed for a HUGE library, it's a mom & pop app for people who have like 5 figures and a hat.  As for the HUGE Library -  Everything has to be done within reason. If you have a HUGE library then you may be overworking your system which means you need to upgrade your system to handle he extra load. The more powerful you computer is the better Pose will run.  Once again not a Poser Problem.

5. There isn't a button that allows you to turn off all IK. You have to go one by one and turn them all off which takes at least 10-20 seconds.  It gets annoying after a while. - This is a very minor and borders on laziness since there are only 4 IK options. 2 hands 2 legs.  It would be like complaining that my toilet doesn't flush by itself or that the doors on my house are automatic doors.  Out of everything that could be wrong, this one is very low on the scale and has no effect on the way your render looks or the speed at which Poser Renders 3D content.

6) Models break in the arms all the frickin time and I have to do symmetry to repair the broken geometry.  I have never had any of these problems with Poser 5,6,7,pro, nor 8.  Sounds like an installation issue.  Maybe file corruption, but once again that's a computer issue and not a Poser issue.

7) Poser crashes often with heavy use. I have to save every 5 minutes to be safe.  What do you consider heavy use?  Maybe your computer can't handle heavy use?  The last time I checked, "Save Often" is the unwritten rule of the computer no matter what program you are working with. 

8) The basic preview render is slow & clunky and it's difficult to move objects around.  The lowest render setting for me finishes in less than a minute. 

9) Even if you turn on fast mode there is always a GIANT box in your way so you have to waste all your time finding out which object is the box to make it invisible.  I don't know of this GIANT Box you speak off unless you have the options at the bottom where you can see a wire version or a block version.  if that's the case then just change the settings so you can see what you are doing.

Instead of complaining try asking for help.

Although I suspect you’ve heard it all before, the alternatives to Poser are Daz Studio, Carrara, Cinema 4D (with the Poser plugin) and Vue.

 

Daz Studio is not as confusing as people let on here. It is far easier to set up large scenes with its interface, the library is fast and doesn’t require any weird loop to IE and you get a 64 bit version for free if you buy the pro version. The drawbacks are that there is no IK, no dynamic cloth except some pre-made costumes sold separately, no hair module either.

 

Carrara doesn’t load a Poser scene reliably, but it can handle Poser content. I don’t like the interface, but that’s just me. (Maybe I’m weird for wishing that you could set a morph by dragging on a dial instead of typing in a value.) It has IK, hair, superior animation tools, but no cloth. The renderer should be capable of doing better than most of the renders I see posted. I’m not sure what the problem is with Carrara renders.

 

Cinema 4D is reputed to be solid. It’s pretty expensive. You’d have to buy the Poser plugin separately. (I think it’s called Interposer.) Last I heard, you couldn’t use IK with Poser content in Cinema 4D, but maybe it has been added to Interposer by now. Obviously, Cinema 4D has a professional renderer, and there is a cloth and a hair module. (Those might cost extra and I’m not sure how well they would integrate with the Poser content.)

 

Vue just lets you import Poser scenes. You won’t be able to manipulate the figures much within Vue. (Despite the hype, the ability to manipulate Poser figures in Vue is poorly implemented and ridiculously dysfunctional.) If you computer is choking on Poser 8 Runtimes, it probably wouldn’t handle Vue well at all. I find the Poser 8 libraries to be pretty quick most of the time, despite a ton of content, but my computer is fairly capable. 

Download my free stuff here: http://www.renderosity.com/homepage.php?page=2&userid=323368

I would pretty much echo what Paloth said with a couple of minor exceptions.

It appears to me that you do have sliders for controlling morphs in Carrara (6 Pro at least). Translations like rotate are numeric. You can get sliders for XYZ translation of the figure under constraints which also reveals a whole slew of translation options I've just this minute discovered :-) I agree that not having graphical controls for rotation is a pain. Another issue is that Carrara doesn't, as far as I can see, doesn't support Poser's cameras - no problem unless you have a bunch of MAT pz2s saved as cm2s. I agree that the renderer seems to be somehow under-perfoming but I ascribe that to my use of the 'make art' button or my subjective tastes, I don't know.

I don't have the hardware to even try posing inside Vue, where AFAIK, you're essentially running Poser in the background - a daunting task for even a high end computer. Vue itself wants a powerful system but just importing and rendering Poser content works, albeit at a glacial pace, on even a truly ancient rig (Vue 6 at least). I've seen a fair number of complaints about it's stability, but personally, I haven't seen anything that can't be explained by my underpowered hardware Moral, Pose in Poser, render in Vue.

In fact, I don't think I'd use any of the 'alternatives' by itself without a copy of Poser. If you have access to an older version that runs better on your system, use that in conjunction with one of the others. If you haven't used Poser for very long, you may find that Daz Studio is suitable as a complete replacement but I think that many people find that there are things that Poser does better or faster or more easily and use each application for its strengths.

"Democracy is a pathetic belief in the collective wisdom of individual ignorance." - H. L. Mencken

Quote - @ Zanzo ... An observation ... you have been "here" for over 2 years and, now, are just posting this question ???  Why ??? ...

At the risk of repeating myself again ...

2 years seems like an awfully long time to formulate an opion such as the one that has been expressed.

Hey guys, ......Is is at all possible that we have had our proverbial chain yanked? :blink:

cheers,
dr geep
;=]

Remember ... "With Poser, all things are possible, and poseable!"

cheers,

dr geep ... :o]

edited 10/5/2019

Quote - > Quote - that ebook on character creation sounded interesting. I'd like to read DAZ's methods on the subject.

actually the book isn't on character creation and isn't by DAZ, it is a guide to using DAZ studio (and is an actual book not an ebook).  But it does indeed include free versions of Carrara and Hexagon.

Thanks Dupre

Quote - > Quote - @ Zanzo ... An observation ... you have been "here" for over 2 years and, now, are just posting this question ???  Why ??? ...

At the risk of repeating myself again ...

2 years seems like an awfully long time to formulate an opion such as the one that has been expressed.

Hey guys, ......Is is at all possible that we have had our proverbial chain yanked? :blink:

cheers,
dr geep
;=]

Or someone just blowing off some steam.

Yup ...........  'tis possible. :lol: ... BUT ............. 2 YEARS ???

Remember ... "With Poser, all things are possible, and poseable!"

cheers,

dr geep ... :o]

edited 10/5/2019

When I first started with Poser6 and at times since I have been very frustrated to the point of getting angry with Poser and wanting to wipe it off my hard drives....Part of the problem is or was the software, and part of the problem was the guy holding the mouse in his hand and not totally understanding what he was doing at the time. Back when I started, part of my frustration was, how come in a few clicks, using purchased characters, props, poses and lights wasn't my renders looking like some of the amazing stuff people are creating? And thanks to PhilC I now even have a much needed Make Art button! :laugh:

I recently developed a new appreciation for the dedication of the people working on Poser to try to make it better. How many of you worked on Super Bowl Sunday? Super Bowl Sunday is like a national holiday here in the States. Everything stops while it is being played including crime. Yeah somebody has to work at the local 7-11 on Super Bowl Sunday to sell the beer and chips....but a software developer? If you think they don't care, and are not working long and hard on Poser, you are dead wrong. I almost want to tell the people working on Poser they need to get a life.  :ohmy:

Poser is not designed or priced to be a 3d Max or C4D. There are a zillion variations of hardware, software that user's have installed that make replicating various problems (so they can be fixed) by the developers difficult to say the least. If you expect the performance of 3DMax or C4D, are you willing to pay that kind of price for Poser?

Gary

"Those who lose themselves in a passion lose less than those who lose their passion"

Has anyone said anything about Z Brush yet. Its a great prgram,
costs a ton, but its super. Truth is poser is just for fun. I've had
my problems with every poser I've bought,4-8, but it's still just a
toy to me. I'll never be one of them pro's cause fantasy is a lot
more fun to me. Real life ain't exact, never will be!

Beware-The Smoking Man Still Lives!

Zbrush is very reasonable compared to C4D or 3DS Max or Maya. I use it.

Zbrush is great, but it doesn't do the same thing as Poser. That's like comparing apples and orangutans.

"It appears to me that you do have sliders for controlling morphs in Carrara (6 Pro at least)."

Yes there is. Unfortunately you can only drag them until they slide to the end of the slider. In my experience, the range only covers about 1% of the actual morph. 

Download my free stuff here: http://www.renderosity.com/homepage.php?page=2&userid=323368

Hm, all your listed nasty little offenses are ... correct ... thankfully not all at the same time but time by time the one or other ...
So like BB also mentioned a pile of .... and he should know it cause being involved in that "hack job" ... :blushing:

But on the other hand all these rants are also completely true for MS Windows and/or MS Office besides that these aren't able to do 3D-stuff ... :lol:

So that's nothing new and is the charme of Poser ... one have to love or to hate that piece of stuff ...

But to your image analogy for Poser 8 ...

Do you know how long this building is standing safely in this position and how good the prognosis is that it will do this for the next centuries ... ok, ok, time by time they have to mix a little bit concrete to fasten the stand ... but that SM team is also needing to do something for there money ... so let's wait for the next portion of concrete ... :laugh:

 I have suggested in other threads that Poser should have a basic program for $1,000.00
With expansion modules priced from $500.00 to $750.00

With all of this extra cash flow going into R & D....   Poser would soon become the software package that would eclipse anything else out there..

Or alternately,     change the minimum system requirements so people are not expecting Lamborghini performance at Toyota pricing.....!

Quote - I got Carrara 6 Pro for free on a magazine a while back.  Daz also  has a book on character creation that comes with it as well as Hexagon and a bunch of V4 & M4 Content for around  $25.

I should install it one of these days, but I've been too busy with Poser... :biggrin:

That's what I thought... until I actually started using Carrara 6 Pro. Now, I don't think I'll do any rendering with Poser, at least not animations. Carrara 6 pro BLOWS PoserPro away with render speed. A scene in Poser that takes an hour or so to render renders in minutes in Carrara 6 and looks so much better to me. Daz even has a tutorial for moving dynamic cloth from poser to Studio (which also works in Carrara) which is about the only thing I was going to render in Poser. I still plan to do all my character animation in Poser and import it into C6 to render. And there is so much more you can do in C6 than Poser. Ever try to make a forest of dynamic trees on a field of dynamic grass in Poser? No problem in C6. I'm wishing I had made the switch a long time ago.

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*"Yes there is. Unfortunately you can only drag them until they slide to the end of the slider. In my experience, the range only covers about 1% of the actual morph" *

Yes, I see. I did find a tip in the Carrara forum - holding down Alt while in one of the numeric translation fields does bring up a tiny dial but it doesn't work for morphs unfortunately.. Still, I discover some new function every time I open C6P - definitely a very versatile application especially for free :-)

From my very limited use, the landscapes and overall render quality aren't as good as Vue, the modeler probably isn't as powerful as C4D, the posing isn't as easy as Poser etc. but for what you get, a platform that can do almost everything quite well in an integrated package, I'm quite impressed. OTOH, it does show the wisdom of sticking to one or two key functions and doing them really well.

"Democracy is a pathetic belief in the collective wisdom of individual ignorance." - H. L. Mencken

Quote - Carrara doesn’t load a Poser scene reliably, but it can handle Poser content. I don’t like the interface, but that’s just me. (Maybe I’m weird for wishing that you could set a morph by dragging on a dial instead of typing in a value.) It has IK, hair, superior animation tools, but no cloth. The renderer should be capable of doing better than most of the renders I see posted. I’m not sure what the problem is with Carrara renders.

I suggest you try a recent version of Carrara.  Please advise a Poser scene that C7Pro doesn't import reliably, as I've never seen one.  You can either type in a morph value (as you suggest), or use the up down slider at the right end of the morph box.  No cloth simulation yet - that's true.  What about the real lights, including HDRI, indirect, full (real) ambient occlusion, ability to light (or not light) any object or objects, anything glows, shape lights.  Fire primitives - incredibly real fires and flames that can be animated.  Ocean primitives with waves, wind direction for animation.  Oh, yeah, and it has a rather complete terrain modeling capability as well as object modeling and painting built in.  And a real hierarchic shader tree with terrain shaders as well as infinitely modifiable object shaders.  Oh, yeah, and VSS.  One more point - the render engine is to Poser's as a Lamborghini is to an old mule.  The interface for posing requires learning, but is much more functional and accurate once the technique is acquired.  Carrara interfaces directly with poser runtimes to display and import any Poser content.  Shaders must often be corrected following import, but that's true between any two 3d programs.

Klebnor

Lotus 123 ~ S-Render ~ OS/2 WARP ~ IBM 8088 / 4.77 Mhz ~ Hercules Ultima graphics, Hitachi 10 MB HDD, 64K RAM, 12 in diagonal CRT Monitor (16 colors / 60 Hz refresh rate), 240 Watt PS, Dual 1.44 MB Floppies, 2 button mouse input device.  Beige horizontal case.  I don't display my unit.

Poser and I have never really hit it off, but it is what it is, and there really isn't anything out there that can replace it. Professional?! If you're a professional, you model your own characters, or have staff that does it for you. Poser is designed for people who can not, or do not have the resources to model a character or rig it.

Poser, like every other platform out there, can get a bit dodgier with every release, simply because new code is written, and integrated with the original. How bad it gets depends on the talent of the coders, and how strenuous the testing is. A perfect example is Cinema 4D. In R6, you couldn't crash it with a big stick. In R10, it does take a big stick, but it will go down. Personally, I think P7 was very well done, and had no more issues that P5. And P7 had some  very well thought out improvements to the render engine.

As far as render engines go, everyone has their favorite, because interfaces vary so widely. You have to find one that clicks with you. VRay is like an old comfy pair of shoes for me. Other people find it illogical. I've seen Bryce 5 renders that will blow your socks off, because the artist knew his render engine and how to stretch it.

So, I'll have to disagree. Poser is for people who want to create characters, find facial features very important, but couldn't model one from scratch unless given a full year and some intense rigging training. Poser does a good job in what it's intended to do.

hmm... I've had P7 running (sometime minimized) for 3 days now, and it hasn't even thought about crashing. Yeah, I get distracted easily.

I've often had P7 going for weeks on end rendering out animations with few crashes.

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Yep, same here. I'll have Poser 7 running for more than a week sometimes ;o).

Laurie

Probably because I'm an old hot-rodder, I tend to push Poser to the limit, making complex scenes using a lot of SFX, and rendering at large pixel dimensions.  Whereas P6 and P7 would crash if pushed over the edge, I have noticed that now Poser slows down, but never crashes.  I don't know what has been improved about the memory management, but something has been improved.  Galadriel has 12Gb of RAM and I have repeatedly pushed Poser to the point where total sytem usage tops 12,000Mb, but instead of crashing, now Poser seems to approach the memory limit asymptotically, i.e., it nudges up close to the without ever overstepping the limit. 

Overnight renders of wallpapers are common;  rendering a series of PNGs for a forty second video clip might be 4-5 days running three or four computers simultaneously.  I've never had an issue with Poser (6, 7, Pro, 8) being open for a long time.

Right now Galadriel is doing a test render of a (new freebie! ^^) elven boat with an experimental wake.  She has everything I could think of engaged - IDL, quadratic falloff detail lights, gamma correction, ray-traced shadows, AO on select parts with invaginations, reflection, translucence, refraction, and lots of displacement.  Might be done about sundown.

Poser 12, in feet.  

OSes:  Win7Prox64, Win7Ultx64

Silo Pro 2.5.6 64bit, Vue Infinite 2014.7, Genetica 4.0 Studio, UV Mapper Pro, UV Layout Pro, PhotoImpact X3, GIF Animator 5

I love to push a program like poser to it's limits, make it fail and break.

then I know thats the point I stop. anything within that limit, I know I can do.

for example, I once loaded every bazze aircraft in to one scene and rendered. slow yes.. but it handled them ok....

Turn off all your IK.

import poser

scene = poser.Scene()

def run():
    if not scene.CurrentFigure():
        return
    fig = scene.CurrentFigure()
    if fig.NumIkChains():
        iklist = []
        for i in range(fig.NumIkChains()): # Turn off IK and store the settings           
            fig.SetIkStatus(i,0)
    scene.DrawAll()
run()

Poser could use some improving, in places where that somehow never seems to happen.  Largely, though, it's more good than bad, once you get to know it.  Getting to know it is the tricky part, but also much easier than my experiences in trying to learn Modo or Blender.

===========================sigline======================================================

Cage can be an opinionated jerk who posts without thinking.  He apologizes for this.  He's honestly not trying to be a turkeyhead.

Cage had some freebies, compatible with Poser 11 and below.  His Python scripts were saved at archive.org, along with the rest of the Morphography site, where they were hosted.

*steals Cages Ik script cause its nicer than mine :)

Quote - *steals Cages Ik script cause its nicer than mine :)

Actually, mine has an oopsie.  The iklist = [] line does nothing and shouldn't be there.  It was a holdover from a function which memorized the IK to restore it.    But: steal away.  :D

===========================sigline======================================================

Cage can be an opinionated jerk who posts without thinking.  He apologizes for this.  He's honestly not trying to be a turkeyhead.

Cage had some freebies, compatible with Poser 11 and below.  His Python scripts were saved at archive.org, along with the rest of the Morphography site, where they were hosted.

* I suggest you try a recent version of Carrara.*

I have the recent "Pro" version.

*Please advise a Poser scene that C7Pro doesn't import reliably, as I've never seen one. *

It's pretty common in my experience to have figures that were posed import in C7Pro in the default T position. Sometimes props are removed or don't show up at all. Maybe I don't have the latest service release, but this problem made the jump from C6 to C7 and was acknowledged by many. 

You can either type in a morph value (as you suggest), or use the up down slider at the right end of the morph box.

 Yes, but a slider is not a dial. You can only slide to the end. This means that some morphs, as well as easy pose parameters, cannot be manipulated by sliders since you need greater values than what the slider allows to see the change. It is probably possible to reset a slider's range, but the fact that you may have to makes typing the values an easier option.  

 Of course, Carrara is inferior to even Daz Studio when it comes to interpreting some ERC chains. Chains that curve perfectly in Poser and Daz studio will be segmented in Carrara. This is not a problem that Daz is willing to fix or even acknowledge. 

One more point - the render engine is to Poser's as a Lamborghini is to an old mule.

   Poser 8 rendering has greatly improved now that there is a form of GI. I wouldn't doubt that Carrara has a better renderer, although it isn't apparent in most of the Carrara renders I've seen. 

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That being said, I'm beginning to come around to the original poser's point of view now that Poser 8 has died on me. Getting rid of the configuration files didn't help and a reinstall didn't fix it. 

I think making Poser rely on Microsoft IE for functionality was the only way to make it more unstable than it already was. 

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I reinstalled IE and flash and now everything is working again. Fun fun fun... 

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IMHO, both Carrara and DAZ Studio (DS) are very good alternatives to Poser. Each program has it's strengths and weaknesses. It really just depends on what you want to do (I have all three).

I didn't use DS much other than to just play with it until 3 came out. I got DS 3 Advanced because it had the 64bit option. I'm quite glad I did. It's very responsive, much faster rendering than  before, and has some nice features like the Morph Follower and UberEnvironment lighting. I'm not a lighting expert in DS, but I think this image came out pretty good using UberEnvironment (also used morph follower):
http://www.renderosity.com/mod/gallery/index.php?image_id=1994089

I've had Carrara since version 2, and really do like it. Version 8 will be fully 64bit. I'm playing with the 64bit Beta now, and it's great! It allows you to do things that are very difficult, or impossible in 32bit. There are occasional problems with Poser content in Carrara (and DS), but for the most part everything works very well. Carrara gives you a lot more room to grow than either Poser or DS, and has a faster render engine. My render preference is Carrara first, then DS3A, then Poser. Poser is quite capable of doing top notch renders, but I've never been able to get good lighting as easily as I can with Carrara.

Materials usually need to be tweaked in Carrara or DS, unless the item has Carrara or DS specific shaders. It's a fairly simple process though, and you can get some very nice results. The materials for the car in the image at the link below were done with stock Carrara shaders with some minor changes, to replace the Poser shaders that looked very unrealistic in Carrara.
http://www.renderosity.com/mod/gallery/index.php?image_id=2009629

Carrara does landscapes, quite well, but possibly not as well as Vue (don't have Vue to compare). this link below will give you an idea regarding what Carrara can do with "small scale" landscapes.
http://www.renderosity.com/mod/gallery/index.php?image_id=1832144

Like others have said, give both DS and Carrara a test drive. Often with 3D software what "feels" right is the best tool to use, because you will enjoy using it!

Good Luck!
DR

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Those are very cool DustRider. I especially like the car paint. I've only seen the stock landscape scenes that came with Carrara 6 Pro. The one you showed is really quite nice. I suspect Vue may have a slight edge depending but it was designed from the ground up to do landscapes and atmospheres.

I like using HDRI lighting in Vue and I'm experimenting with it in C6P following a tutorial I found. I have DS3 standard but I haven't installed it. So far, to my eye, the Vue renders are the nicest but playing with using PoseRay to export scenes to Kerkythea and using HDRI there looks promising as well. As you say, all of them can produce excellent results, it's a matter of what comes easiest.

"Democracy is a pathetic belief in the collective wisdom of individual ignorance." - H. L. Mencken

lmckenzie-Thanks!

Even though I don't have Vue, I think you're right about it having an edge with landscapes. It looks like C8 should catch up to Vue a little more. Being 64bit will give it more working space, which seems to have been a huge improvement with Vue. It also has "gods rays" in version 8, and some other improvements to volumetric lighting. Vue does create some awsome renders! They have a softer look and feel.

I love HDRI !!!  It's one of the reasons I like using Carrara so much. it makes lighting so much easier. The link below is to the first image I did with HDRI in Carrara (way back at version 4), it got me hooked on HDRI (this was also my first post to my gallery on Rendo).
http://www.renderosity.com/mod/gallery/index.php?image_id=887298

Coming "soon" (hopefully not DAZ soon) to C8 will be dynamic softbodies/cloth and better physiscs. With that, Carrara will be a very complete 3D application. With 64Bit and Dynamic cloth I'll be very happy with C8.

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Nice one - I like the composition & perspective.

HDRI seems to render faster than Vue atmospheres as well. The only problem is finding one that matches your render idea. From the samples I've seen, Dosch has some really excellent ones but definitely not free.

C8P sounds promising indeed. I'm using Vue 6, so I don't even know what improvements they've made in their version 8. There's an unlimited (watermarked) demo, but still too much I need to learn about Vue 6 (and C6P as well obviously).

"Democracy is a pathetic belief in the collective wisdom of individual ignorance." - H. L. Mencken

if you have Vue, you can always make your own HDRs :)

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*"f you have Vue, you can always make your own HDRs :)" *

I was going to  mention that. I found a tutorial on rendering a panorama and saving as .hdr. Someone commented though:

"First off many people misunderstand what a HDR image really is. HDRI's really require multiple exposures at different light levels to build the High Dynamic Range into the resulting image. You could do this in Vue by making numerous different renders with different lighting to get the wide range of intensities require to build a real hdri image. This causes detail in even the brightest highlights and in the darkest shadows where details would be either is lost in totally white areas or in totally black areas. You cannot make a true HDRI in one render.."

My very meager understanding of HDRI supports that. Whether you save in .hdr format or not, a true HDRI image is the result of multiple exposures - or so I thought. If Vue can simulate multiple exposure renders then to me it would make more sense to save them as LDR format and use HDRShop to combine them into a true HDR image. Any info to the contrary would be much appreciated. I did try the panorama->hdr technique but the result did not produce "real" HDR like lighting when used in a render.

So, do you know how to do multiple exposures? I'm guessing the procedure would be fairly portable to Carrara or other renderers.

"Democracy is a pathetic belief in the collective wisdom of individual ignorance." - H. L. Mencken

I'd have to have a dig through the Vue manual and have a look I think.  Looking at it logically, the reason you'd have to use multiple exposures with a camera is because the CCD/Film have a finite dynamic range and the only way to expand that is with the multiple exposures. 
CG apps don't suffer from that particular problem - I'd imagine that a .hdr image from Vue would contain a much wider dynamic range than an equivalent photo, especially if you are telling Vue that you want to render out a HDR image so it wouldn't compress the highlights/shadows.

Of course - I could be totally wrong here.  Only experimentation is going to tell for sure (and might possibly lead to a rash of new marketplace products if I ever figure it out! )

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You can make an hdr from one exposure by making copies and adjusting the luminence curve in Photoshop of each copy and then tricking Photoshop when exporting the hdr by using different shutter speeds in the settings you manually adjust. Mark Bremmer has a video tutorial showing how - google it.

Kevin

Thanks to you both - definitely an area for exploration.

I did find this on http://www.hdrlabs.com:

"Set up your Vue6 scenes as desired, go to your render settings and turn on the tick box for 360-degree render and the tick box for spherical render (180-degrees vertical). Make sure you “keep camera level” is turned on and after rendering (but before saving) be SURE TO TURN OFF the tick box for “Natural Film Response”. Otherwise, your highlights and shadows (in the extreme darks and light areas) will get clipped when you save. Images are all rendered out at 32-bits… so once you do a render, just do a “Save as…” choose the HDR format instead of JPG or TIFF and that is all you need to do!"

I don't think the hilighted point was made in the tutorial I used so that may be the critical element. Even if this is the key for Vue, I'd seen references to using PhotoShop to simulate multiple exposures. It seems like that might enable you do HDRI with Poser or other apps.

"Democracy is a pathetic belief in the collective wisdom of individual ignorance." - H. L. Mencken

 Geep - couldn't agree more, lol, the perfect example of the time-honored art of yanking an entire groups' chain...with the following proviso...

Poser software has been in bad need of clean-up for ages. I like the program, I've learned to live with its foibles, but I still swear at it on a regular basis. Like virtually all 3D softwares out there, there are way too many things that have been left uncorrected and unimproved while jamming it/them full of still new "features." 

As for C4D, I bought R9 4-1/2 years ago, the top of the line version, for approx. $3000. Now it would cost me $3000 to upgrade to R11. I don't have that kind of pocket change, lol. And for "professional" software C4D's documentation is as lacking as any I've seen from Hash, trueSpace, Bryce, or Poser. I was reading just yesterday in the Carrara forum, and they seem to have their own collection of software issues.

As for more professional software doing this? The ability to handle Poser content (or D/S for that matter) is only part of the issue ... apparently no else's software does all the things that Poser does. Contrary, there are things I can do in Bryce and Vue that Poser can't touch; I've never seen a better solid modeler than C4D's and it's got a billion little piece-of-crud errors in it.  The sculpture-based modelers are supposed to be wonderful, but I am always reading about the end results being converted to .OBJ and being shipped to a better renderer or someplace/something else for this-that-or-the-other final touch up.

I don't think there's a perfect 3D software in existence ... Guess I will just have to win the lottery and try them all.

Attached Link: Here's a trip down memory lane for ya ... ;=]

Remember this? ... [***Click the link above the image***](http://www.drgeep.com/history/history.htm) ... ... and enjoy.

Quote - ... I don't think there's a perfect 3D software in existence ... Guess I will just have to win the lottery and try them all.

I agree. :lol:

cheers,
dr geep
;=]

P.S. BUT ... I have had more fun with Poser (since day 1) than any other software ever and it has been worth every penny I paid for it.  I don't know what I did with Poser(1) but I still have P2, P3, P4, P5, P6, P7, and P8 with P6, 7, and 8 currently installed.

Remember ... "With Poser, all things are possible, and poseable!"

cheers,

dr geep ... :o]

edited 10/5/2019

Doctor Geep you are hilarious.

I think Poser 8 is actually quite fantastic.  Its indirect lighting actually does what it does quite fast compared to, say, cinema 4d; 3DS Max; Cinema 4d; Maya; Carrara, and especially Vue.  I have tried them all.  MUCH slower.  Modo on the other hand...  and from what I hear, what is it, Hypershade?  Those are some screaming beasts, but for what it costs and what it brings to the table, Poser is pretty fantastic.

Does anyone but me remember a discussion on here with some fellow proposing an alternative to Poser... said he was going to write it himself. Was it 2 or 3 years ago?

Wonder whatever happened to that.

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Wir sind gewohnt, daß die Menschen verhöhnen was sie nicht verstehen
[it is clear that humans have contempt for that which they do not understand] 

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Apparently he's been so busy working on that project that he couldn't find time to post anything here since June 2008. I'm expecting to see the first alpha version any day now.

(Kidding!)

-- I'm not mad at you, just Westphalian.

And I was so looking forward to that, too! (not kidding) Oh well, I guess every silver lining has a cloud...

Monterey/Mint21.x/Win10 - Blender3.x - PP11.3(cm) - Musescore3.6.2

Wir sind gewohnt, daß die Menschen verhöhnen was sie nicht verstehen
[it is clear that humans have contempt for that which they do not understand] 

Metaphor of Chooks

I thought he sounded way too optimistic to be credible.

-- I'm not mad at you, just Westphalian.

And I'm incredibly gullible and naive. Good job I don't live in Antarctica or I'd have more refrigerators than I'd know what to do with. And togs: gotta have those togs for when the ice finishes melting...

Monterey/Mint21.x/Win10 - Blender3.x - PP11.3(cm) - Musescore3.6.2

Wir sind gewohnt, daß die Menschen verhöhnen was sie nicht verstehen
[it is clear that humans have contempt for that which they do not understand] 

Metaphor of Chooks

Hmm, I happen to be in the business of selling drop bear insurance. Interested?

-- I'm not mad at you, just Westphalian.

 i don't use poser every day but i'd sure be lost without it

go that way really fast.
if something gets in your way
turn

One of Poser 8's biggest promises is the changing of the GUI.  A lot of the rant in the OP can be credited to outdated GUI and hopefully Poser Pro 2010 introduces even more changes.  Poser doesn't work as "traditional" 3D apps mostly because of this faulty GUI.  I almost never drag things in the viewports as I might in other apps.  It just doesn't work.  But I've been using Poser since P4 so I'm quite used to dial spinning.

I've tried importing Poser character into other high end apps and while the rendering may be faster you'll be surprised at how difficult it is for these apps to handle all those polys when reposing your figures AND to get a good skin texture you'll have to use some pretty complicated materials that really slows down your render time.

Poser has limitations. Get used to them or go mad!

I've tried several alternatives to Poser (C4D, 3DMax, Daz Studio and Vue) and I've always gone back to the real thing.   So spend your money on alternatives but keep your Poser license close when it's time to upgrade to it's newest version ;)

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Quote - Hmm, I happen to be in the business of selling drop bear insurance. Interested?

"Drop bear"... can't recall what that is but I'm pretty sure its an Oz thing. Might pass this time, thanks for stopping by... :biggrin:

Monterey/Mint21.x/Win10 - Blender3.x - PP11.3(cm) - Musescore3.6.2

Wir sind gewohnt, daß die Menschen verhöhnen was sie nicht verstehen
[it is clear that humans have contempt for that which they do not understand] 

Metaphor of Chooks

For me, the old Poser is fine for the types of simple illustrations I do. On occasion they please me and the few people I share them with so what more could I want. On the rare occasions when I want to play with something more ambitious, I fire up Vue, Kerkythea or even my ancient copy of Max 3/Brazil. Poser does a fine job of providing the base figures and then I can learn a bit at a time about things that are not necessarily better or more professional than Poser (the proverbial  needless competition) just different. IMO, it's always good to broaden ones horizons.

"Democracy is a pathetic belief in the collective wisdom of individual ignorance." - H. L. Mencken

I have Poaer 2 thru Poser Pro (7). I've always enjoyed using Poser, I find it quite easy to use. Figure and content support is much better in Poser than any other application. It has dynamic cloth and dynamic hair. Very impressive for the price. I've just never been able to get the same quality/speed rendering in Poser as with Carrara (originally started rendering Poser content in C4D with Poser 4/Pro Pak). Just a quick look at the gallery here shows that Poser can produce some outstanding renders, I've just never been able to get great results myself. But from what people have said here, maybe it's time to give Poser 8 a try.

A quick look at all 15 images in my gallery (http://www.renderosity.com/mod/gallery/browse.php?username=DustRider) shows my lack of ability to render in Poser vs. Carrara and DS3A. I'm sure if I worked at it long enough, I would get better results in Poser, but my "3D free ttime" is very limited due to my current job(s), so I just take the easy way out and use what I know. I was very impressed with how easy it is to set up lighting in DS3A using either the included UberEnvironment, or LightDome 2 Pro. The IBL in Poser 6 and Pro is not as simple to use.

IMHO, there are several quality alternatives to Poser - But there is not a true repalcement for Poser. I use Carrara because it fits into both working with Poser content, and doing other things in 3D that go beyond what Poser can do. I got DS3A because it is a true 64bit application, which for me is a big plus. It does a few things better than Poser, yet is missing some of the nice features of Poser (dynamic clothing that the user can create and dynamic hair for example), and unlike Carrara, DS3A has many of the limitations of Poser.

I think it all goes back to what your comfortable with, and how your brian is wired. I've seen many posts where other people find the Carrara and the DS3A interface difficult to use, and lighting diffucult to set up, yet I find ithem fairly easy to use and achieve the results I want (in a relative sense or course).

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"I think it all goes back to what your comfortable with, and how your brian is wired." 

 I don't think that can be emphasized enough. 3d is not word processing. People may quibble about the benefits of MS Office vs Open Office or Mac vs PC for that matter but after a bit of use most can be reasonably productive and comfortable in any of them. 3D does IMO come down a lot to how your brain is wired. The strong likes and dislikes are simply too intense to be explained by the relatively small differences in GUI or metaphor. People might complain a bit about finding the 'X' key on a normal productivity application but the same situation on a 3d app has them throwing up their hands and declaring it unusable. That's why it's impossible to answer the constant requests for the "Best" application. If what everyone else considers the lowliest piece of crap works for you that that is the best application of all.

"Democracy is a pathetic belief in the collective wisdom of individual ignorance." - H. L. Mencken

"A drop bear (or dropbear) is a fictitious[1] Australian marsupial. Drop bears are commonly said to be unusually large, vicious, carnivorous koalas that inhabit treetops and attack their prey by dropping onto their heads from above.[2]

They are an example of local lore intended to frighten and confuse outsiders and amuse locals, similar to the jackalope, hoop snake, wild haggis or a snipe hunt.

It is often suggested that doing ridiculous things like having forks in the hair or Vegemite or toothpaste spread behind the ears will deter the creatures.[3]

Another suggestion is to walk through the bush carrying a screwdriver raised above one's head in the hope of impaling the attacking drop bear." Wikipedia
 

"Democracy is a pathetic belief in the collective wisdom of individual ignorance." - H. L. Mencken

I think most people just sarting out in 3D really under estimate how complex is is, and the associated learning curve. So take the basic complexity of even the simpler 3D applications, then add to that the great diffences in UI and work flow from one app to another, with the logic behind those two factors, it's pretty easy to understand why some software just doesn't "click" with the way you think.

Then, if that isn't bad enough, add in the requirements and complexities associated with software/hardware issues related to working in 3D, and things can get ugly quite quickly.

I'm not real sure what the true issues were that the OP had with Poser, but all of the above no doubt added to the frustration of using Poser.

For those who may be interested in Carrara, I've been playing with the 64bit version of the C8 beta, and am quite pleased with it. I have experienced a few crashes (actually, the entire system freezes requiring a hard reboot), but I'm fairly sure this is a video card/OpenGL issue. Unfortunately I haven't been able to upgrade the video drivers on my system (laptop). But, aside from the freezing issue, performance is much better than C7. I completed the render at the link below, set to max quality, at 1800X1400 in just over 1.5 hours. I can't use the same setup in C7 to compare, because I did everything in C8, but from experience with C7, I was expecting the render to take 4-5 hours. I also seems like it's doing a better job of importing materials, though you still have to make quite a few adjustments. It looks like it will be a big improvement, and well worth the upgrade.

http://www.renderosity.com/mod/gallery/index.php?image_id=2023770

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Really nice indeed-well organized and executed. I agree that the orb came out really sweet.  Have you tried any of the Caeeaea skin shaders/SSS options and if so what do you think of them?

and at the opposite end, what happens when you take a rubber duckie and start playing with Vue's instancing having no idea wtf you're doing. Lucky it was at the lowest preview setting or I'd probably still be picking up pieces of smoking circuit board.

"Democracy is a pathetic belief in the collective wisdom of individual ignorance." - H. L. Mencken

Really nice indeed-well organized and executed. I agree that the orb came out really sweet.  Have you tried any of the Carrara skin shaders/SSS options and if so what do you think of them?

and at the opposite end, what happens when you take a rubber duckie and start playing with Vue's instancing having no idea wtf you're doing. Lucky it was at the lowest preview setting or I'd probably still be picking up pieces of smoking circuit board.

"Democracy is a pathetic belief in the collective wisdom of individual ignorance." - H. L. Mencken

In general i find Daz much better than Poser... but just like Poser, Daz has limitations as well... and having seen the rants about probs with Daz 3 i've stayed with Daz 2.5... what i find with Daz is that it's much more forgiving than Poser... things that Poser won't load properly or that appear screwed up will load fine in daz and often render much better... plus Daz doesn't care so much about normals being flipped and other annoyances like that which poser has big issues with...  but that's just my opinion... having tried both programs i settled on daz as my program of choice...i found it easier to use, better organised and more user friendly (specially for beginners) but others will prefer or recommend other programs... such is the way of things... lol 

I've used the V4 Elite shaders for Carrara, and the results can be quite nice, but you usually have to make minor adjustments for the lighting in your scene. SSS in C is good, but can't be controled with a map, so it's not as useful as it could be. From what I've seen, SkinVue seems to be easier to get great results with in Vue. The skin shaders designed for DAZ Studio seem to work fairly well in Carrara, often with very little modification. Poser specific shaders (P5 of greater) almost always need to be adjusted. The link below is to an image I did using a Carrara V4 Elite shader, as I recall, I did use SSS in this image.
http://www.renderosity.com/mod/gallery/index.php?image_id=1792677
Vues replicator has some nice options that Carraras doesn't have as well.

I have to admit that I like the interface in DS better than Poser too, but both are easy to use, and they both have their advantages and disadvantages.

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From the renders I've seen: Carrara is capable of nicer landscape renders. But what passes for "advanced" renders of people... sorry.

And the interface is completely beyond me. Nothing makes sense to me in Carrara.

The main advantage of DAZ Studio that I can't deny is simply that it plays nicer with DAZ figures - morphing V4 can lead to anomalous lines and other artifacts in Poser that just don't show up in DS. But beyond that, I just don't try to compare. My initial experience with DS was that I wasn't able to get things rendered, so I gave up early and switched to Poser, so my internal wiring is all Poserized now.

______________

Hardware: AMD Ryzen 9 3900X/MSI MAG570 Tomahawk X570/Zotac Geforce GTX 1650 Super 4GB/32GB OLOy RAM

Software: Windows 10 Professional/Poser Pro 11/Photoshop/Postworkshop 3

Quote - I think the software is a huge pile of shit. 

Hey dude, don t be shy
Say what s on your mind...

I've found Daz plays nicer with most things.... about 90% of my content was actually written for Poser rather than for Daz itself... lol... Daz is also more forgiving than Poser about bad filenames or added symbols in files than poser ... which i've been learning the hard way while working on my free stuff... things that worked fine in daz won't load at all in poser... (mind you i finnally found what it was i was messing up to cause the probs and can create fully function poser items without ever using poser for any of it) and i've found that stuff that poser wouldn't load if you paid it to will load in daz just fine... but again.. i like Daz and have spent 3 years learning it so far and am starting to truely understand it's potential so like some of you i'm kinda Daz-rigged mentally where others have been "poserized"... lmao

Quote - "I think it all goes back to what your comfortable with, and how your brian is wired." 
.

I dunno.. how is your Brian wired....?

I'm not sure how my brian is wired, but I'm pretty confident that the wiring is faulty :-)

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Quote - I'm not sure how my brian is wired, but I'm pretty confident that the wiring is faulty :-)

Typo of the week!  :lol:

Poor Brian.  

Coppula eam se non posit acceptera jocularum.

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lol ....See ..... I knew it was faulty!!!

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 a...a...troll!  lol

But seriously,  i have tried Poser 2,4,PP,5,6,7. Lightwave, Carrera, Vue, Bryce, RayDream, Infini-D, DazStudio, and Shade.  And imho for what Poser tries to do, it does better and quicker than any other. Sure it's sometimes buggy, and you can find another app that does "x" better than Poser does. But taking the sum of what it does, nothing else compares. 'Sides where did you get the idea Poser thinks it's a pro app ?

otherwise, what Phantom said on the first page.

I couldn't agree more.
If you think Carrara is counter intuitive, give 3DS Max a fling.
I believe one of Poser's greatest strengths is its user friendly control interface. For whatever my opinion is worth, it is the standard other program designers should follow.

Quote - From the renders I've seen: Carrara is capable of nicer landscape renders. But what passes for "advanced" renders of people... sorry.

And the interface is completely beyond me. Nothing makes sense to me in Carrara.

The main advantage of DAZ Studio that I can't deny is simply that it plays nicer with DAZ figures - morphing V4 can lead to anomalous lines and other artifacts in Poser that just don't show up in DS. But beyond that, I just don't try to compare. My initial experience with DS was that I wasn't able to get things rendered, so I gave up early and switched to Poser, so my internal wiring is all Poserized now.

Poser is definitely one of the best buys in 3D, both for usability and for features. with the exception of Blender which is free, but has a huge learning curve! Where else can you get Dynamic Cloth and Dynamic Hair for such an affordable price, plus tons of affordable content. Have you ever checked on the price for content developed for 3d Studio Max? Ouch!!!! 

DS3 is getting closer to Poser, but not quite there yet. I'm hoping there are some nice improvements to 64bit support in Poser Pro 2010. Finally got it downloaded, and hopefully will get a chance to test it over the weekend. Maybe I'll stick with it long enough to get a decent render out of it instead of falling back on Carrara.

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