While I'm here...

I'm in love with dynamic clothes for my characters. They solve so many issues so easily.

The problem: There seem to be so few dynamic items for M4. Does anyone know of any? I'm especially looking for: shorts, jeans, pull over shirt, button up shirt, suit (I know... I don't want much).

Anyone know of sources? I have no objection to paying, so not asking just for freebees.

And yes, I know how to export a conforming item to an obj and back... It seldom works (right). I'm looking for things ready to go out of the box.

I agree with you - dynamics is awesome ;o). I've been slowly making dynamic clothing, but nothing for Mike yet, tho I'll put him on my list and squeeze him in if I have time (although, I normally have precious little of that ;o)). As for other stuff, there just isn't much dynamic clothing available period, much less for Mike :o(.

Laurie

 there's a very nice martial arts gi for him somewhere here in the MP and I can make it work on freak 4 by morphing M4 into F4 during the sim.
Love esther

Attached Link: http://www.renderosity.com/mod/bcs/index.php?ViewProduct=78084

I know dynamic clothing is a catch 22 for the modelers... They are (I'm told) much easier to make, but so many people are scared off by the cloth room, so they get forced into spending more time to make conforming clothes. Wonder what I'd have to pay up front to get some modeler to make what I want then s/he could go ahead and sell them for gravy?????? 

You could ask some of the vendors that sell dynamic clothes, but I've heard they don't sell well either ;o). And they are easier to make in that you don't have to rig them, create morphs, etc. - just model, texture and done.

I've wondered why a lot of folks are afraid of the cloth room (myself included before). I saw one tutorial, that was all it took. I was hooked ;o). It's actually quite easy. When you consider that you can use any morph, any pose and it looks great it makes it a great choice.

Laurie

 Yeah, Laurie... it's actually easier than spending the endless hours tweaking with conforming clothes that break with tight bends of limbs... with having to adjust the drape of clothes against body parts... just POOF! Run the simulation and it's all done for you.

The one thing that it took me a little time to twig on was that you do your morphs and posing at frame 15 (or 30 if you're going the long route) not frame 1. Took me a year to figure out why my large-breasted girls kept spilling through the cloth on the sim... Hey... start with vanilla Vickie and let the sim do all the work. DUH!

Again, it's what people first learn that they are comfortable with, and conforming clothes are easier for the newbies. Just wish there was a way that the clothing could be easily converted to dynamic, but I haven't found it. All the grouping advice that is dispensed tells me that it needs to be done, but doesn't gibve a clue as to how to judge what group what areas belong in.

Hmmmm. Now THERE's a tutorial for someone to write!!!

Another interesting thought...

Do Dynamic clothes HAVE to be made for a specific figure? I.E. do the breast areas have to be made fuller for females and the hip areas tighter for the males, or is this one size fits all? Perhaps someone might be able to make some $$$ off a unisex set of dynamic clothes.... or at least a generic male set and generic female set.

I probably have missed something here, since I don't model, but the principle sounds good to someone looking at this through the Poser user screen.

(I'm sorry... I'm sure it's obvious I can't sleep tonight.) 

I made a dress for Angela that I converted for Antonia. It took quite a bit of scaling and some well placed magnets to hike certain areas into place before I could run a sim and get it to fit her moderately well. I imagine if the clothing item is modeled around a female, it wouldn't flatten enough around the "boobage" to look all that good on a fella ;o). That having been said, it is possible to make a clothing item made for a female figure to fit another different female figure and I guess it would be the same thing for male to male figures. I'd imagine if you tried to fit a male clothing item to a female it would stretch terribly around the bust and look awfully tight, but some might like that sorta thing...lol.

Laurie

Quote - I'd imagine if you tried to fit a male clothing item to a female it would stretch terribly around the bust and look awfully tight, but some might like that sorta thing...lol.

Laurie

ROFL ;)

This is what I have so far....neckline and hem are not modeled yet. I think any wrinkling on the rolled sleeves would be better achieved by a displacement map rather than modeling since the sim would most likely pull any folds out anyway ;o).

Laurie

 I wouldn't worry a great deal with the rolled sleeves... just an idea I had. What you've got looks gr-r-r-r-r-r-eat! Can't wait to texture it!

BTW... if it's an either/or rolled sleeves or regular, I'll take regular.

Truth is, once most of it is done, making straight sleeves is the easy part ;o). I can just make straight sleeves out of the rolled parts and have both ;o). At any rate, I spent this much time doing the rolled sleeves, I'm not gonna chuck em now...lol.

I think I have the rolled sleeves looking the way I want them. I just need to fiddle some more with the neckline and do something at the hemline and it's off to the fun part - uv mapping. Well, not so fun ;o).

Laurie

 I think it looks tough as nails! VERY NICE!

I'm going to show my ignorance: Is there more to creating the uv map than running UV Mapper? (Remeber... I've never done the part you are doing!)

Quote -  I think it looks tough as nails! VERY NICE!

I'm going to show my ignorance: Is there more to creating the uv map than running UV Mapper? (Remeber... I've never done the part you are doing!)

If you want the template to lay flat, there is ;o). UV Mapper (or at least the version of Pro that I have) will only map in Planar, Cylindrical, Cylindrical Cap, Spherical and Per Facet. None of these is ideal for getting a flat map. You're better off doing English Bob's tute on using UVM and Roadkill together since Roadkill does a superior job as compared to UVM. Roadkill's only downfall is that is destroys the groups (which you can get back by exporting uvs in UVM and then importing them back). But it makes really nice uv maps, especially for clothing. It helps immensely if you are able to stitch and cut, which Roadkill does and UVM doesn't, at least the version I have.

Laurie

Laurie

Quote - Just wish there was a way that the clothing could be easily converted to dynamic, but I haven't found it. All the grouping advice that is dispensed tells me that it needs to be done, but doesn't gibve a clue as to how to judge what group what areas belong in.

Hmmmm. Now THERE's a tutorial for someone to write!!!

I think it's easier to convert the clothing if you already model ;o). If you don't, then there isn't much you can do without getting really confused. As far as deciding which group goes where, dynamic clothing does take some thought....a good rule of thumb is, if there's really nothing horizontal to hold something up, you have to add a constrained group - like a waistline on a skirt for instance. If it's a dress and the waistband isn't fitted, then you don't need to constrain the waistband or even the neckline if the neckline opening is smaller than the shoulders are wide. That tee I made for Mike has no constrained groups in it because there's nothing that would make it slide off... I did have to select a small sliver at the inside of that rolled cuff and add as a soft decorated group so that it wouldn't collapse during the sim. Putting the whole cuff in the soft-decorated group just looked "off". Pants would need a constrained group at the waistband to keep them from sliding down as well as something with spaghetti straps for instance. If the shoulder is anything but horizontal, it'll just keep sliding down until it slides off ;o).

Soft-decorated groups hold a general shape, constrained groups keep things where they are and hold their shape...I haven't run into a circumstance where I've needed to use a rigid group yet, but I'm sure I will ;o).

Hope that made sense ;o).

Laurie

The texture you've used looks better than any I've tried. Where did it come from? 

Quote - The texture you've used looks better than any I've tried. Where did it come from? 

Photoshop. White fill, add noise, motion blur, brightness/constrast....lol ;o). Makes a nice birch.

Laurie

 Just got it! Really looks nice!

I'll see what variations I can come up with and get back to you.

I was thinking of making a blue birch version, mostly just cause the hub has one and I like the color...lol.

Laurie

Quote -
I think it's easier to convert the clothing if you already model ;o). If you don't, then there isn't much you can do without getting really confused. As far as deciding which group goes where, dynamic clothing does take some thought....a good rule of thumb is, if there's really nothing horizontal to hold something up, you have to add a constrained group - like a waistline on a skirt for instance. If it's a dress and the waistband isn't fitted, then you don't need to constrain the waistband or even the neckline if the neckline opening is smaller than the shoulders are wide. That tee I made for Mike has no constrained groups in it because there's nothing that would make it slide off... I did have to select a small sliver at the inside of that rolled cuff and add as a soft decorated group so that it wouldn't collapse during the sim. Putting the whole cuff in the soft-decorated group just looked "off". Pants would need a constrained group at the waistband to keep them from sliding down as well as something with spaghetti straps for instance. If the shoulder is anything but horizontal, it'll just keep sliding down until it slides off ;o).

Soft-decorated groups hold a general shape, constrained groups keep things where they are and hold their shape...I haven't run into a circumstance where I've needed to use a rigid group yet, but I'm sure I will ;o).

Hope that made sense ;o).

Laurie

Thanks Laurie for this! I've just started learning to model and I've actually rigged a couple of items but I would like to understand how dynamic clothes work better and that helped. :)

 NICE looking shirt!

As for Dynamic clothes being easier to make than conforming ditto, I'd say yes.. to a point.. as long as we're talking simple stuff, it's a lot easier, but at least I have a lot of problems getting things like pockets and buttons ect to "stick" when I make dynamics. I know it requires welding but even when I think I've welded everything just fine.. it often comes apart when I run the sim.. so.. I guess I'm not good at welding L

What kind of clothes are you looking for? I'm not promising anything but I'm slowly trying to get back into Poser and modeling after a long break... still not REALLY sure if it's over which is why I'm not making any promises, but.. there's light at the end of my personal tunnel at the moment so I hope...

I make double sure things are welded...when I import the object into Poser I check "Weld identical vertices" ;o). I use Wings to model and sometimes when you 'think' something is welded, turns out it's not...lol.

And welcome back BTW! I was wondering where you went! ;o)

Laurie

 this looks great!  r u going to sell it?
love esther

 Esther,

As soon as I get some textures done for it, you just might be surprised what winds up in the freebee corner.

Be extra nice to Laurie! She did wonders with this idea!

Sorry, couldn't resist. I still want one of those tee shirts - a REAL one...hehe.

Yes, yes...I goof off waaaaayyy too much ;o).

Laurie

 wow, it really looks great!

 Hi LaurieA,

I just wanted you to know that I'm not MIA. The modeling you've done is SO hyper real, I've not found the texture that measures up yet. I'm in the process of stretching one of my T's out tight and taking digital pictures of the main texture, and all the stitchings... see if I can't derive something usable along with some decent bump maps from all of this.

Just didn't want you to think I had dropped the ball!

P.S. My test texture right now has the legend: "I can't help it if the girls think I'm HOT!"

Laurie

I don't see much in the way of dynamic clothing for anyone?  People who have some dynamic stuff for various figures can post some links to these items.

Didn't want you to think I forgot about you. I'm still chipping away at Mike's jeans ;o).

Laurie

Quote - Mikey loves the brainy girls ;o)....lolol!

Sorry, couldn't resist. I still want one of those tee shirts - a REAL one...hehe.

Yes, yes...I goof off waaaaayyy too much ;o).

Laurie

can you show the wireframe from the shirt around the neck?

thanks

Laurie

i always have problems giving clothes tickness. or maybe my settings in poser are wrong?

I normally select the row of faces surrounding the hole and do a shell extrude. It makes a separate group. Leave it like that and import into Poser. Don't weld the neckline and add the polys from the neckline to a soft-decorated group.

Laurie

so poser calculates the shirt. but the neckline is just sticking to the shirt and is not in the calculation?

thats fantastic.

well, the neckline is included in the calculation, but since it's sitting on top of the main body of the shirt, the main part of the shirt collides with it instead of passing through it and the neckline holds it's shape because it's in a soft-decorated group :o). Cloth self-collision must be turned on in your sim.

Laurie

i thought that soft decorated groups are not calculate and that they just folow the main body.

Looks great, Laurie!

I've about got some textures ready to go for the shirts. Took a while to get one photographed that really looked like what it's supposed to be.

Is it ok for me to post this when I'm done? Also, where... Obviously here, but do we do it under my account or yours? I've got "by LaurieA with textures by basicwiz" in the readme, but if you prefer to post it as one of yours I'm perfectly OK with that. (I just wanted the piece for myself!!!!!)

The jeans are looking great! Let me know why you need testing/textures et al. BTW... I've got Allen's Jeans Texture set from over at Poserwld. It's a free merchant resourse and looks very good. I was planning to use it. It has main texture, pockets, snaps, brads, zippers... in short, about everything you need.

Hugz!

TW 

Do it however you like basicwiz....makes no difference to me ;o).

Laurie

Quote - i thought that soft decorated groups are not calculate and that they just folow the main body.

Well, if that's true then, it still works ;o).

Laurie

 That's "WHEN" you need testing... NOT "WHY!"

 Hint-hint nudge -nudge.. A certain website has its 8 year anniversary on Monday.. There's gonna be a freebie there to celebrate it.. and it is something that I think the OP will like ;)

like this:

More hint.. the website's name is sorta kinda like the same as mine ;)

Here is a shirt
http://www.teknology3d.com/store/index.php?act=viewProd&productId=372

I'll be there, TG!!!! And thanks for the heads up! 

 LaurieA - those jeans look awesome.  what I reckon though is the jeans should be hybrid, with conforming top part and dynamic lower limbs.
Love esther

 But Estherau..(most of) the idea of dynamic pants were that you could get a real-looking package thing in them. With conforming top, the whole thing might as well be conforming... it's not like jeans are THAT "flappy" at the legs.. unless we're talking huge flared Flower Power pants L and even then, the fabric is fairly stiff :)

Oh and basicwiz.. Apparently I tryped this past midnight without being aware of it L Anyway it's on the 18th, and I'll make sure to get them up at Midnight, CET ;) )

 well I think real jeans are pretty much conforming looking around waist, hips and butt, but around the legs they are a little bit flappy and wrinkled looking with back of knee and groin etc.  It would make it easier f it was a hybrid. I don't actually care about the package.  Just a little ken type bulge would be fine.
The package gets a bit squished anyway inside clothes doesn't it?  
either way, those jeans look awesome.  most dynamic clothes look thin like tissue paper and have no modelled seams etc.
Love esther

 :) Actually I haven't modeled seams.. or at least only a select few of them (mostly to keep frack of where they are on the UV template) - they're enhanced with a displacement map :) 

Mostly, modelled details tend to smother out when the simulation is run anyway. Sure you can contrain and "decorate" and whatnot all the goups, but it also affects how it moves so I find carefully made displacement maps work better on dynamic clothes. I've done pockets and buttons ect that way, and it looks fine :) (well not on a super closeup, but how often DO you make a close up of a button anyway? L)

i tryed it but i dont think i did it right because it didnt work.
like this?