Checked my messages over my breakfast coffee, and there's a note from Smith Micro that Miki 3.0 is out today - November 30. At a special price.

I'm a late convert to Miki. I only got Miki 2.0 a few months ago - but I was impressed. Yes, she's a little old fashioned compared to the G2 and P8 figures, and 4th generation Millennium figures. But she's far more advanced that the 3rd generation she was competing against.

And so I'm excited to see wat Miki 3.0 will bring to the party. I log on to Content Paradise and... where is she?

Then I remember. It's November 30 for me. I'm at GMT +4. Everyone at Smith Micro is still in sleepy la-la-land.

Now I have to wait until I'm home from work to get my hands on her. Curses.

Anybody else as excited about Miki 3.0?

Andy Staples
The Penultimate HârnPage -- www.penultimateharn.com

I didn't get the newsletter so thanks for the heads-up. I loved Miki 1 but haven't used Miki 2 as much due to none of the stuff from Miki 1 working with her.

That said though, I'll be taking a look over at CP later today.

i7 5960X, 32GB RAM, GTX 1080Ti, GTX 980 Ti, Windows 10 Professional. Running Daz Studio 4.11, Poser 11, Vue Inf 7, Photoshop CS4

didnt get to use 1 or 2 much, as they had VERY LITTLE support.

so dont think I will get 3

Camping impatiently in front of my laptop waiting for release .

Poser 8 or 2010 only. Looks like poser 7 user and below cant user her and either can Daz Studio users. I'm not investing in a new version of poser just to use this model so there s no reason for me to purchase it. That's a shame but that's how they want to do business.

Completely agree Klown.

I use Poser 7 and see no need to upgrade. A real shame I won't be able to get Miki 3, but there are plenty of other products out there that don't require P8 or 2010.

I wonder what it is in particular about the figure that requires P8?

i7 5960X, 32GB RAM, GTX 1080Ti, GTX 980 Ti, Windows 10 Professional. Running Daz Studio 4.11, Poser 11, Vue Inf 7, Photoshop CS4

Over the years various criticisms have been leveled at Poser's jointing methods. Some valid, some less so. Poser 8 made, in my view, significant improvements by providing a capsule fall off zone in addition to the sphere. I find this extra option very helpful indeed.

I would ask therefore, should new figures use these new features or totally ignore them under the banner of backwards compatibility? What is the point of making improvements if one is then criticized for using them?

DAZ Studio effectively copied the Poser joint format to enable it to load Poser figures. Its not beyond the realms of reason for them to copy this new option also. If they do not, then my interpretation would be, it is because they do not want to rather than it is not possible to.

Consider this, if DAZ Studio were to mirror the joint improvements pioneered by Poser 8 then maybe, just maybe, Vicky 5 would incorporate them also rather than being stuck with a rigging system that was created ten years ago.

Look to the future or be stuck in the past? Me, I'm moving forward :)

My undersanding is it's rigging and fall off zones. But I don't know it means she's completley unusable in D|S or Poser 7 and lower or if she might have limited usability.

The ugly part is I was waiting all summer for this model and this was a real slap in the face.

if thats all you have to worry about, I envy you.

Airport security is a burden we must all shoulder. Do your part, and please grope yourself in advance.

@MagnusGreel

Hardy the only thing I worry about, this was about something I looked forward to, but not the highlight of my existance. I have learned howver it is unwise to argue with muppets, escpecially Crazy Harry who has a rather cathartic way of dealing with things.

@PhilC

I will concede you are right, you've been in this game since beofre I have and your logic is sound. I simply wish I could use the model in the software I have. I don't see Daz implimenting this kind of thing unless it's taken on by a 3rd party, which was the case for M2's neck seam, but daz has bugs in their system that have gone on for years without fixes or responses to the tracking system, so I'm just a little frustrated.

Phil, could the model work with limited functionality in Studio. I really don't know enough about the fall off zones to formulate any possiblity of yes or no?

Quote - Over the years various criticisms have been leveled at Poser's jointing methods. Some valid, some less so. Poser 8 made, in my view, significant improvements by providing a capsule fall off zone in addition to the sphere. I find this extra option very helpful indeed.

I would ask therefore, should new figures use these new features or totally ignore them under the banner of backwards compatibility? What is the point of making improvements if one is then criticized for using them?

DAZ Studio effectively copied the Poser joint format to enable it to load Poser figures. Its not beyond the realms of reason for them to copy this new option also. If they do not, then my interpretation would be, it is because they do not want to rather than it is not possible to.

Consider this, if DAZ Studio were to mirror the joint improvements pioneered by Poser 8 then maybe, just maybe, Vicky 5 would incorporate them also rather than being stuck with a rigging system that was created ten years ago.

Look to the future or be stuck in the past? Me, I'm moving forward :)

Unlike some people, I can't afford to buy the shiniest, latest and most powerful thingamabob that comes along. Not saying that you are just that while it would be nice if V5 was compatible with P8 or lower when she comes out, if she's not, I'm going to do the same thing i plan to do with Miki 3... ignore her.

The difference is that I'm going to be saving a lot of money NOT trying to clothe a new model, and it's going to cost DAZ (or in this case SM) a lot of money in lost sales revenue. Like you say, that's the cost of progress.

this is classic poser community.

''hey i have a 10 years old softwarre. ''

i something was done better you need teh new software.

Question: does she bend better than V4? That alone might make her worth trying out.

BTW, if enough people ask their favorite merchs to support Miki 3 and actually buy things for her, she'll be supported.

WARK!

Thus Spoketh Winterclaw: a blog about a Winterclaw who speaks from time to time.

(using Poser Pro 2014 SR3, on 64 bit Win 7, poser units are inches.)

10 year old software isn't a complete picture. Poser 7 came out in 2006. Miki 3 is incompatible with it.

Quote - this is classic poser community.

''hey i have a 10 years old softwarre. ''

i something was done better you need teh new software.

I'm not criticizing the software. Not really even criticizing Miki 3. But news about the new rigging could have come out sooner and eased the pain. Hey, I have P8, but frankly, I prefer working in P7, so a new Miki wouldn't do me much good anyway.

Quote - this is classic poser community.

''hey i have a 10 years old softwarre. ''

i something was done better you need teh new software.

Poser 7 is hardly 10 year old software. Since I only use Poser for setting up figures before importing them into Vue there isn't much point in my upgrading. I think you're seeing a great moaning outcry where there is none.

No one so far has criticised Smith Micro, Miki 3 or any version of Poser - just voiced that it is a shame they won't be using the new figure. If Miki 3 needs Poser 8 or 2010 for the enhanced rigging, then good on Smith Micro for adding the additions to both the software and their latest figure and good luck to the people that can use the new figure.

i7 5960X, 32GB RAM, GTX 1080Ti, GTX 980 Ti, Windows 10 Professional. Running Daz Studio 4.11, Poser 11, Vue Inf 7, Photoshop CS4

erm Poser 7 is built ON 10 year old software, with minor changes. P8 has the first major rigging changes.

I sense a fight coming up with much gnashing of teeth and impassioned posting. I'll be far away from it now.... runs for the hills

Airport security is a burden we must all shoulder. Do your part, and please grope yourself in advance.

Attached Link: http://poser.smithmicro.com/miki.html

In all honesty, Miki 3 looks less oriental than Miki 1 & 2.

The illustrations, at the link, point out that the joints don't seem to be very much improved. The jumping image shows jutting knees and elbows with other images showing overexaggerated creases on the inner elbow. The fingers look unnatural in the patio image. The smile looks unnatural and awful.

More skilled artists should be able to produce better demo images, without retouching, than are shown on SM's official site.

Some of the facial expressions look good, but overall, the promotional images are unimpressive. Whatever advancements have been made with Miki 3 aren't on display.

My visual indexes of Poser content are at http://www.sharecg.com/pf/rgagnon

Poser 7 doesn't have multiple falloff zones and 8/PP10 do. So I imagine that's why you need the newer software.

But just give it a little time and I'm sure someone will produce a new rig for her so you can use her on 6 or 7.

WARK!

Thus Spoketh Winterclaw: a blog about a Winterclaw who speaks from time to time.

(using Poser Pro 2014 SR3, on 64 bit Win 7, poser units are inches.)

She's here:

http://www.contentparadise.com/productdetails.aspx?pid=12338

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

The Wisdom of bagginsbill:

"Oh - the manual says that? I have never read the manual - this must be why."
“I could buy better software, but then I'd have to be an artist and what's the point of that?"
"The [R'osity Forum Search] 'Default' label should actually say 'Don't Find What I'm Looking For'".
bagginsbill's Free Stuff... https://web.archive.org/web/20201010171535/https://sites.google.com/site/bagginsbill/Home

Cannot download the Miki 3 zip .The download keeps crashing everytime - on firefox and Internet Explorer as well .

The download just finished for me. But I have to go off to my Applied Ethics class. Thankful that my grandfather liked my 3d renders and decided to put down the money for Poser Pro 2010 for me, so I can now use Miki 3. Still not a fan of PP's library system. I'm still so comfortable with the old style..

I'll try loading Miki 3 in Poser 7 to see what happens, after class.

Currently using Poser Pro 2012 (Display Units = feet)

AMD Phenom II 3.2ghz (6 cores)

8gb RAM

Windows 10 Pro 64bit

287mb...

The textures make of bulk of data, they are supplying PNG's this time.

I get 297 Mb in textures (including clothing) and only 22 Mb for the Character.

First few test renders look OK to me, but that hair leaves a lot to be desired.

Bless CP for a separate lip material zone... I know I could have added one but I don't get along with the polygon selection tools in Poser... nor anything really...

So far I absolutely love this incarnation of Miki. Of course I would though... Ima sucker for any hot asian girl...

Bless smith micro / CP!

If you get her, you will want the WW2 plugin...

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

The Wisdom of bagginsbill:

"Oh - the manual says that? I have never read the manual - this must be why."
“I could buy better software, but then I'd have to be an artist and what's the point of that?"
"The [R'osity Forum Search] 'Default' label should actually say 'Don't Find What I'm Looking For'".
bagginsbill's Free Stuff... https://web.archive.org/web/20201010171535/https://sites.google.com/site/bagginsbill/Home

Ah, thanks WandW - I was just wondering if Phil was up to speed. I should have known he was. :D

I now have Miki 3 installed and am trying to do a quick render before dashing to the airport. Why did I choose IDL for a quick render? Because I'm daft, that's why...

Andy Staples
The Penultimate HârnPage -- www.penultimateharn.com

@AndyStaples ... and your a sucker for high quality renders ;)

The textures and materials shaders work great with IDL :)

@gagnonrich - When you get her take a look at the morphs for the head. I think you might be surprised at the quality of smiles and expressiveness you can get out of her.

Still no finished download. Must be the 24th attempt .

And here she is, fresh from the box.

Bog standard pose, no morphs, plus the new bike, which isn't something I'd usually buy but is a nice freebie.

Lit with IDL Studio.

Andy Staples
The Penultimate HârnPage -- www.penultimateharn.com

> Quote - If you get her, you will want [ the WW2 plugin...](http://istore.mikrotec.com/philc/index1.html?page=catalog&category=a&vid=2080245373&pid=106011033&oldvid=2143420604) > >

That's kinda what she said. Sure enough, I encounter a nice girl and piss her off immediately. :D

Yes, I see the shoulder crease. Probably user error on my part.

Very dissapointed myself :(

when i saw the first pictures of her a couple of months back, she looked very good

now she looks like just another V4 morph, her face has been softened so much she has lost all the character the early pictures had.

shame.

Just bought her, installed, spun a few dials, rendered. I like her!!!

B.

@ PhsycoNaut - I ran into a crease, yet smaller then yours when posing her and I used the Morph brush turned to Smooth. it cleared it right up. very easily. I've been using the same tactic for poke thru with clothing too since the morph brush came out. its pretty sweet.

Quote - DAZ Studio effectively copied the Poser joint format to enable it to load Poser figures. Its not beyond the realms of reason for them to copy this new option also. If they do not, then my interpretation would be, it is because they do not want to rather than it is not possible to.

Consider this, if DAZ Studio were to mirror the joint improvements pioneered by Poser 8 then maybe, just maybe, Vicky 5 would incorporate them also rather than being stuck with a rigging system that was created ten years ago.

It's not likely that DAZ will mirror the new P8 joint improvements as the generation 5 figures from DAZ will be using a single skin mesh and weight maps.

Quote - Look to the future or be stuck in the past? Me, I'm moving forward :)

I couldn't agree more. :)

Coldrake

Just a family shot of three generations Miki. The youngborn steals the show no doubt.

With no idea how the mesh actually bends because the pictures in Content Paradise are so small, repetitive, and demonstrate little, I am extremely hesitant to buy the mesh.

Miki 1 and 2 were also extremely problematic. They had insanely good facial poses and morphs but were utterly awful in how they bent everywhere else. They also had next to zero support from product makers and what little support they had dried up very rapidly.

Smith Micro has also done an awful job marketting Miki 3.0 as compared to even independent Poser product makers. Where is the innundation of private renders from people who have advanced copies? Where are the previews of upcoming clothes and other products for Miki 3.0?

Even the smaller Poser product makers do this and Smith Micro's lame Facebook campaign that also included terribly unuseful renders that gave little hint at how the mesh comes together didn't make up for it (I also don't need to open my Facebook account up to a bajillion people by friending a digital model).

So until I see some more renders that show me Miki 3.0 doesn't have the prolems that a lot of the meshes coming out of Smith Micro have had, I'll be holding back.

I fully agree with you Onimusha, though I might give her a try, normal price is a whopping $40. CP's figures still seem to me very primative somewhere between Posette and Vicky 3. That's probably the biggest reason there was hardly any support for the other Miki's.

I just upgraded to P8 today and the new figures are rather dull. At least Miki comes with a 30 day money back guarentee, so I can spend $15 now and if I don't like her I can just send her packing.

I had both Miki 1 and 2 though I never really used them and I no longer have them due to the new CP layout where they now charge you to download the files after a month, what types of mesh issues did they have, my memory fails me.

Attached Link: http://www.runtimedna.com/forum/showthread.php?57039-Been-playing-with-Miki-3

I created some nude studies when I was doing the clothed promotional renders for Smith. They can't post the nudes on their website but I was able to put a bunch of them up in a thread on RuntimeDNA. Above is the link to that thread.

One of the funny things that hit me last weekend - I was checking out a thread on the Daz forum about their new V5 figure ideas, and someone posted an image from a 3D character artist that showed a pose they'd love to see a Poser figure acheive. I took that as a little bit of a challenge.

I wasn't able to recreate the pose 100% but got very close. It's the first image in the thread on RDNA in the link.

Quote - > Quote - If you get her, you will want the WW2 plugin...

That's kinda what she said. Sure enough, I encounter a nice girl and piss her off immediately. :D

Yes, I see the shoulder crease. Probably user error on my part.

One of things I found with posing the Miki 3 shoulder was to be sure to use a mix of the collar and shoulder to get the bend right and minimize creasing. Once I got the hand in place, I'd lock on IK for that hand, then do a little dial tweaking on the collar and shoulder to soften the shoulder area even more. What's nice about locking on IK is that you can experiment with all the arm parameters to polish the look and position.

The biggest problem that Miki 1 and 2 had were the joints. The elbows and knees still seem to bend in a bulbous, unnatural fashion. This was my biggest problem with Miki 1+2. You could use the face, but if you put them in a short sleeved shirt or a dress, they looked terrible when they did anything except stand still.

Miki 3.0 seems to have the same problem. It's pretty evident in the render that Synthmonkey did that I'm linking here. Miki 3.0's knee is elongated, totally distorted, and looks completely unnatural. Seems like the same problems Miki 1+2 had...

Quote - The biggest problem that Miki 1 and 2 had were the joints. The elbows and knees still seem to bend in a bulbous, unnatural fashion. This was my biggest problem with Miki 1+2. You could use the face, but if you put them in a short sleeved shirt or a dress, they looked terrible when they did anything except stand still.

Miki 3.0 seems to have the same problem. It's pretty evident in the render that Synthmonkey did that I'm linking here. Miki 3.0's knee is elongated, totally distorted, and looks completely unnatural. Seems like the same problems Miki 1+2 had...

That sure is an extreme knee bend. I wanted to show how the crease folds. I've a hunch that most rigged charcaters have weaknesses in the knee with that extreme an angle.

A little touch of the morph brush would help to tuck in the calf as well and soften that top bulge. But I think in most images the knees never get that bent.

I browsed through your gallery for reference (cool images btw - you might want to try some IDL for richer shadows) and found most of the sci-fi art you've created used mostly the Daz figures with fairly straight knees and partially bent elbows.

I think the Miki 3 figure with some converted clothing via wardrobe wizard would work well for you.

Quote - In all honesty, Miki 3 looks less oriental than Miki 1 & 2.

The illustrations, at the link, point out that the joints don't seem to be very much improved. The jumping image shows jutting knees and elbows with other images showing overexaggerated creases on the inner elbow. The fingers look unnatural in the patio image. The smile looks unnatural and awful.

More skilled artists should be able to produce better demo images, without retouching, than are shown on SM's official site.

Some of the facial expressions look good, but overall, the promotional images are unimpressive. Whatever advancements have been made with Miki 3 aren't on display.

Ouch. I thought I'd done a decent job.

I agree the patio image looks a little forced. I was having a rendering issue on that image with my camera interpenetrating a foreground stone column. It hung forever trying to render the inside of the column. It took me a while to figure out what was happening in the scene, and I ran short of time. But looking at the photobooth images, you can see that she is very expressive.

I went to your gallery to check out some sample images for good hand poses to reference - it's hard to pose all those joints...

Thanks for the feedback - I miss art school for the portfolio reviews. They were brutal sometimes, but useful.

So looking at the introduction sale price I decided it was worth getting the figure for use in the future if it wouldn't work with Poser 7.

Just tried the figure in P7. I didn't expect it to even load, so I was pleasantly surprised. Because of the different joint rigging the mesh tears easily after a small movement (you can move the arms down by about 20 degrees before this happens). Head movement seems to be fine, so no problem with portrait shots.

The biggest problem that I had was with the size of the texture maps - 4k x 4k PNG files are a bit much for my graphics card to handle it seems, so there were some display glitches.

I resized the default maps to 2k x 2k, re-saved as jpeg and then replaced the maps in the material room. The figure seemed to work reasonably well after that - enough to do a quick render anyway (shown above)

EDIT: The problem with the texture maps could very likely be that I'm running on a 32-bit OS.

i7 5960X, 32GB RAM, GTX 1080Ti, GTX 980 Ti, Windows 10 Professional. Running Daz Studio 4.11, Poser 11, Vue Inf 7, Photoshop CS4

Quote - I created some nude studies when I was doing the clothed promotional renders for Smith. They can't post the nudes on their website but I was able to put a bunch of them up in a thread on RuntimeDNA. Above is the link to that thread.

One of the funny things that hit me last weekend - I was checking out a thread on the Daz forum about their new V5 figure ideas, and someone posted an image from a 3D character artist that showed a pose they'd love to see a Poser figure acheive. I took that as a little bit of a challenge.

I wasn't able to recreate the pose 100% but got very close. It's the first image in the thread on RDNA in the link.

Two other details - none of the images posted in the RDNA thread have any photoshop to Miki 3 or her joints. Photoshop was used only to crop, add credits or fade in background.

She is also rendered in the default state, with none of the full body morphs applied. For my personal tastes, I like Miki 3's voluptuous dial set at .2 to add a little more weight on her arms and torso, and I dial in the body builder morph to about .15 to add a little more definition.

Yep, but the face seems to suffer.
For a low spec PC or MAC, when you downsize textures, resharpen them afterwards.

This brings back some of the lost detail.

Realy important for a bump map.

Poser 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 7, P8 and PPro2010, P9 and PP2012, P10 and PP2014 Game Dev
"Do not drive faster then your angel can fly"!

Quote - Just tried the figure in P7. I didn't expect it to even load, so I was pleasantly surprised. Because of the different joint rigging the mesh tears easily after a small movement (you can move the arms down by about 20 degrees before this happens). Head movement seems to be fine, so no problem with portrait shots.

Now would be a good time to practice with the setup room :D

Hmm, thought..., if one was to re-rig Miki to match/work with p7 would we be able to give the bone pz3 away or what have you?

Quote - Hmm, thought..., if one was to re-rig Miki to match/work with p7 would we be able to give the bone pz3 away or what have you?

Why bother, what you're talking about is called Miki 2.0.

I am not convinced about Miki 3.0's joints. They really don't seem to work properly. They're an improvement over Miki 2, but not nearly as good as V4. Miki 3.0 seems to bend in certain places better than V4, like the hips, but having less natural extremity joints is far more of a liability because they are far less frequently hidden by clothing. I'll be returning my Miki 3.0...

Quote - > Quote - Hmm, thought..., if one was to re-rig Miki to match/work with p7 would we be able to give the bone pz3 away or what have you?

Why bother, what you're talking about is called Miki 2.0.

I am not convinced about Miki 3.0's joints. They really don't seem to work properly. They're an improvement over Miki 2, but not nearly as good as V4. Miki 3.0 seems to bend in certain places better than V4, like the hips, but having less natural extremity joints is far more of a liability because they are far less frequently hidden by clothing. I'll be returning my Miki 3.0...

I take that as a challenge. :-)

Can you point me towards an image in your gallery that shows your most aggressive knee bends, that doesn't require a big prop like a motorcycle, and I'll try and replicate it with Miki 3? I'll just do a simple nude in IDL, no other scene items, just to see if we can get her to pose for you.

I really dont understand what is the excitement about miki3.

I wasn't all that impressed by the facials in the promo images, but the images in the RDNA thread convinced me much more.

It also appears the included textures don't give the figure justice, or am I not seeing them in play and only the untextured model?

hard to beat the price. I just have to convince myself why I need another figure, even at $15.

Humankind has not woven the web of life. We are but one thread within it.
Whatever we do to the web, we do to ourselves. All things are bound together.
All things connect......Chief Seattle, 1854

What I have in my gallery doesn't really represent most of what I do with Poser. Also what I have in my gallery doesn't change the fact that Miki 3.0 has almost all of the same bending problems Miki 1 and 2 had. It's a slight improvement, but a slight improvement isn't worth buying and it is inferior in how it bends to V4.

I predict that in six months you won't be seeing many new products for Miki 3.0, if any at all. Same story you've seen with Miki 1 and 2 given that the figure isn't a significant improvement and doesn't really address what I think were Miki 1+2's biggest flaws.

For Bigger images (800 by 800) at Content Paradise, just click on the Image on the Product Page and it should open up bigger in a separate Window.

When a product has multiple images (smaller thumbs to the right of the main promo image) just click on each of those to change the Main Image to that image and click again to change that in the Preview Window.

Quote - I really dont understand what is the excitement about miki3.

It is like a new arrival... everyone oo's and ah's, even if some say it looks like Winston Churchill.

ratscloset
aka John

Quote - What I have in my gallery doesn't really represent most of what I do with Poser. Also what I have in my gallery doesn't change the fact that Miki 3.0 has almost all of the same bending problems Miki 1 and 2 had. It's a slight improvement, but a slight improvement isn't worth buying and it is inferior in how it bends to V4.

I predict that in six months you won't be seeing many new products for Miki 3.0, if any at all. Same story you've seen with Miki 1 and 2 given that the figure isn't a significant improvement and doesn't really address what I think were Miki 1+2's biggest flaws.

Can you send me an image that you've created that would help put her to the test? I'm sincere in wanting to take that challenge on. And not to make you wrong, just to see for myself.

I've been away from Poser for a long time, and got back into 3D renderings through a convoluted path. I tried using the Daz figures and couldn't get them to work right. I always seemed to be missing some important add-on pack, or got the install wrong, or only had the low-end textures. Honestly, it was confusing.

But it was a lot easier ramping up using the Miki figure. Everything I wanted was there. I wanted to figure it out quickly and was able to. Plus I really like that she didn't have the signature "victoria look"

Viva la difference.

We may not agree on which figure does what thing right - but I really do have a hunch that with the right mix of full body morphs and good posing that I could get that Miki 3 rig to do what you need it to or most of it. :)

I think she looks halfway decent. I'm already eyeing one of the texture sets for her that I saw on RDNA, but I need to watch my spending. This past month has not been kind to me.

Anyhoo, here's what I mustered as a first render with Miki 3.

Currently using Poser Pro 2012 (Display Units = feet)

AMD Phenom II 3.2ghz (6 cores)

8gb RAM

Windows 10 Pro 64bit

it's only $14.95, but the knees are a bit bulbous IMVHO. maybe somebody can adjust the capsule zones until they release the next version and P9.

I was kind of on the fence about getting Miki3. I really like Miki2 and expected it to be difficult for SM to top her, not technically, but in the fun factor dept. I've only worked with Miki3 for about an hour, but I think she is pretty cool!

I don't really keep up with the technical side of Poser, but am very glad to know of PhilC's insights on Miki3's joints.

Quote - I really like Miki2 and expected it to be difficult for SM to top her, not technically, but in the fun factor dept.

And that, I think, is why we like Miki so much. She's just so much fun to use.

A little play majes me think that Miki 3 is also fun, although much of my playing this morning has been focussing on differences with Miki2, and on exploring the bulbous joints. I'll post more on these later.

I'd add that P8 Alyson and Ryan are perhaps even more fun than Miki 2. Nice to see some of the new expressions (absolutely the most fun feature of the P8 figures IMO) have equivalents with Miki 3.

Andy Staples
The Penultimate HârnPage -- www.penultimateharn.com

Nope, nope, nope - I also had Miki1 & 2 - was so very disappointed. All and any of Poser 6, 7 & 8 figures are only good for head and shoulder poses.

From what I can see of Miki 3.0 - same-o-same-o. Ankles, feet, knees still bend with that strange rounded protrudence that is not natural looking. The shoulder creasing - and all - NOPE - all the hype in the world is not worth taking up my precious runtime space with her and all her crap.

These characters never have added up and competed with Daz3d's Mil-Family gen 3 - let alone 4! With the versatility of V4 - it begs to ask, why even bother? What sense does it make spending money on something so inferior? I don't get it? There are many Asians, and SP4 for V4.

Oh well - I've learned the hard way, I won't be spending my money on her to sit her with the first two versions and all the crap that came with them - now buying any extra's with her.

Have fun all - I'll keep my money for the quality stuff that I can use the entire body of, and not just the head and shoulders.

"I'd add that P8 Alyson and Ryan are perhaps even more fun than Miki 2. Nice to see some of the new expressions (absolutely the most fun feature of the P8 figures IMO) have equivalents with Miki 3."

Ok, I just got PP2010 recently and have not had the chance to work with Alyson and Ryan. Guess I will have to give them some time if I can get the Vicki's to stop running amuck on my system! :p

This is just my personal opinion and it is devasting so please be warned .For a Miki 2 fan ,Miki 3 is my biggest disapointment of the year. Miki 2 had a good realistic default bodyshape,that was a good base for creating custom bodymorphs, Miki 3 is a freak. Look at her short tiny hips, her short skinny legs and her torso looks like a sausage. None of the pregiven morphs can make her a beauty .I don't like the face morphs either.The open mouth morph gives her a big freaky Frankenstein chin. I cannot see any improvements with P8 rigging,which might be a Poser issue.She has lots of JCM that fixes joint issues,but I am afraid that those fixes won't work anymore,when you create new bodyshapes.Well at least she is not that messed up like P8 Allyson so there might be some hope.One good thing: Look at her base mesh ,it is proper modeled , reasonable dense mesh .

One good thing: Look at her base mesh ,it is proper modeled , reasonable dense mesh .

Exactly. All new meshes are a blank canvas. So long as the topo is good, just about anything is possible within the confines of the software... The zero morph collection has controls that V4 needs badly. Lots of innovation.. Lots of resolution! I like that*.. 3x4000 maps tall.

Quote - All new meshes are a blank canvas. So long as the topo is good, just about anything is possible within the confines of the software... The zero morph collection has controls that V4 needs badly. Lots of innovation.. Lots of resolution! I like that*.. 3x*4000 maps tall.

I agree. I did not have alot of time to explore the morphs last night, but I am pretty excited about the possibilities. And the "whole body section" (or whatever its called) that moves a group of body parts with one dial was very interesting. ^ ^

We've got an honest to goodness pose-off challenge going on in RDNA (the thread linked to earlier in this thread). Miki 3 versus V4. I'm not going to ruin it for anyone interested, but it should be fun. Words are nice, but we're artists that make images, let's really "see" how they pose side by side. :-)

Quote - Thanks for the feedback - I miss art school for the portfolio reviews. They were brutal sometimes, but useful.

Oh... geez. I'm sorry. This is why I don't leave critiques when I look at people's albums. I was figuring those images were by SM's staff. It's always hard, when looking at Poser images, whether a problem is with a model or the artist posing the model. The hard lesson I learned when I started seriously using Poser is that the figures aren't perfect. The jutting joints aren't your fault.

My main gripe with the figure is that Miki 3's face lacks the distinctive oriental look that the earlier figures had.

My visual indexes of Poser content are at http://www.sharecg.com/pf/rgagnon

Again, it doesn't really matter that Miki 3 bends better at the waist. If you're doing any kind of render where your figure is wearing clothes, that has minimal effect on what you're doing.

Elbows and knees however have a huge effect because they're uncovered far more often. In all of the renders on the other forum, V4's elbows and knees look 1000 times better than Miki 3.0. Miki 3.0 gets some pretty bad distortion at even relatively light elbow and knee bends on both the inside and outside of the joints. V4 doesn't and therefore pretty much makes Miki 3.0 not worth buying.

I have to say i quite like miki 3, shes rather cute... her joints are a bit meh but with more morphs i think she has some potential :D

This is a quick render i knocked up in a few mins using default stuffs with a small bit of tweaking & using GI lighting.

Quote - Again, it doesn't really matter that Miki 3 bends better at the waist. If you're doing any kind of render where your figure is wearing clothes, that has minimal effect on what you're doing.

Elbows and knees however have a huge effect because they're uncovered far more often. In all of the renders on the other forum, V4's elbows and knees look 1000 times better than Miki 3.0. Miki 3.0 gets some pretty bad distortion at even relatively light elbow and knee bends on both the inside and outside of the joints. V4 doesn't and therefore pretty much makes Miki 3.0 not worth buying.

I really think you should jump into the challenge and show me. I saw a few odd elbow artifacts in those V4 renders. some creasing inside polygons, and an odd bottom of the bicep tuck for example. V4 does have a nice point to the elbow. When I render counter poses of Miki 3, I'll have to try and see how that elbow compares, because honestly - I don't know V4.

But a 1000 times is better? Could that be just the teeniest little bit of an exaggeration? Words are so easily twisted. As are Poser figures. It won't take long for you to make your case with an actual image. :-)

PS:

Sorry if I sound like I'm goading you a little - it's just that brash words are very sticky in a forum, and have always rubbed me the wrong way.

One of the really smart content developers at RDNA (esha maybe) pointed out that it's different strokes for different folks. I think she's right. I truly dig the stuff you're creating with V4 and the other Daz figures. I've got a different figure that I'm really digging, and getting some really nice images out of her. And I just started playing around. Looks like some other folks are digging her too. Do we have lower standards? Are we just plain blind or wrong? Or is there maybe just a little bit of middle ground in this Poserverse where there could co-exist a few other decent figures?

sigh...I hit the wrong button and deleted my message. I just wanted to say thanks for the kind words on the topology. While I think I could probably do better now, I did work really hard on her mesh. I haven't seen the final build of her yet, so I don't know what morphs made it in and what changes were made to her rig but I like alot of the images I've seen posted. So, thanks everyone for checking her out and giving your opinions, they are most valuable!

I'd like to see some good joint performance images of Miki 3. And can anyone open her up in the Joint Editor, and see how they've made use of the new P8+ joint capabilities? There hasn't been a figure which makes great use of these yet, unless this is it. Is she just using capsule falloff zones, instead of spheres, like a couple of the figures included with P8? Or does the figure use multiple zones?

The really tricky joint handling on most figures seems to be where the legs meet the hip. How well does Miki 3 handle with deep leg bends?

I can't afford a copy just yet, or I'd check into all of this myself.

===========================sigline======================================================

Cage can be an opinionated jerk who posts without thinking. He apologizes for this. He's honestly not trying to be a turkeyhead.

Cage had some freebies, compatible with Poser 11 and below. His Python scripts were saved at archive.org, along with the rest of the Morphography site, where they were hosted.

Cage I think the hip to leg bend could be better, but I haven't had a lot of time to play, and that's a place I'm affriad could get you in trouble posting renders (maybe not but I just don't risk it, the forums are to valuable a sourse of info for me). I think the inside elbow bends better than V4, but there is a bit of bulging on the joints. She comes with alot of morphs and magnet thingys, so it maybe just a case of not knowing how to use her correctly yet.

I could open up the joint editor but wouldn't understand what I see anyway. I have rigged with Carrara and weight maps, poser is too hard for me to figure out.

First the "why isn't Miki 3.0 out yet" crowd. Now the "Miki 3.0 is terrible" crowd. Maybe the same crowd.

Give it time and someone will fix her highly placed armpit creasing. I'm curious if the reviews would be the same if Miki 3.0 was sold at her regular price?

www.youtube.com/user/ShawnDriscollCG

Quote - ... I just wanted to say thanks for the kind words on the topology. While I think I could probably do better now, I did work really hard on her mesh.

So I have YOU to thank for my favorite Poser models? Or is Miki 3 the first you created?

Yes! I love the mesh. I love the face. Could go easily into any human variation; this is much more like a good base for all kinds of morphs. The different hip shape is also really nice.

I don't care about Poser's bending/rig issues. I just love the model. Thank you for making it!

I was going to buy it when the SM newsletter emailed to me said it was compatible with Poser 6. But on the "buy now" SM page, it clearly states at the bottom that all Poser versions older than version 8 will not work with Miki 3.0 because it uses different/newer rigging.

www.youtube.com/user/ShawnDriscollCG

Quote - > Quote - ... I just wanted to say thanks for the kind words on the topology. While I think I could probably do better now, I did work really hard on her mesh.

So I have YOU to thank for my favorite Poser models? Or is Miki 3 the first you created?

Yes! I love the mesh. I love the face. Could go easily into any human variation; this is much more like a good base for all kinds of morphs. The different hip shape is also really nice.

I don't care about Poser's bending/rig issues. I just love the model. Thank you for making it!

Miki is the... hang on... James Johnson, The Orc King (more of a troll really), the Poser 8 Mannequins, the P8 Dog and the P8 Horse (which I want to do over). So, I'd say Miki is #7 for me, not counting my SandRunner and Master Ki figures I had sold on my own before I was hired for tech support by e frontier. So glad to be working in content now, I only wish I could make models more often. The rigs for all of the models I've made so far has been done by someone else but I am learning to rig on my own, so maybe the next figure. I'm really happy you like the mesh, seriously, I don't often get to hear how my meshes look, just how well they bend, which isn't my department yet.

I think she'll keep many men awake late on their pcs for the next few months.. Nice work Teyon,, I can see already some nice smooth continuous lines from a tight mesh. She does crease early at some joints but some falloff tweaks should fix that. No time just yet.

Her stock loadup does not flatter her. I bought Syyd's new skin for her and this is the 1st render.

I allmost feel sorry ,that I don't like her (yet?) , but I will give her a chance by creating morphs and we will see .

Quote - I think she'll keep many men awake late

AwwwwRiiiight!

Richardson... wow.

I'm not gonna say it, I'm not gonna say it.... giggity....rats I said it.

**@PsychoNaut,,**

>>out at 7, hung by 11<<

**...scratches head...??
**

It's her neck and forearm... The forearm has that same arc in the wrong direction as Miki1. Neck needs some magnet assist. If you do all the twist from neck instead of a head/neck combo, it's better. Collar and buttocks help with the poses.

Torso bend and side to side dials are awesome. Zero poses too.

IK on/off...way cool (finally)

IDL settings need attention...

Sorry Cage... Capsules indeed. Though their positions mystify. I need time to really look into it. Maybe someone else can jump in.

Looking forward to seeing any additional posing morphs or improvements to the deformer rig that get spun out on Miki 3 - that would be pretty amazing. Seems like it would be decent product; at least I'd buy one. :-)

the kness sure bulge, even the first image from richardson where she is standing.i like her and i don't. right now I'm broke, so it makes the decision much easier.

Humankind has not woven the web of life. We are but one thread within it.
Whatever we do to the web, we do to ourselves. All things are bound together.
All things connect......Chief Seattle, 1854

The bar was raised over @ RDNA with a couple of V4 masters showing some great examples of how she poses. But it looks like the advantage may come from some add-on hip morphs. I was impressed. And further inspired to polish up this pose below.

I reposed, added in a little bit of Miki 3's voluptuous and body builder morphs and then cheated some. I used a few minutes of Poser's morph brush to soften the hip crease and came up with this one.

Learning from other artists' work is a great way to grow. I am pleased to have seen some strong talent @ RDNA and happy to have thrown an image or two into the mix. Miki 3 might not be for everyone, but I'm really pleased with how she looks.

right now I'm broke, so it makes the decision much easier.

Hang loose,, I think she's on sale for quite a while. Maybe some new stuff might be underway by the time you choose..* *

*So I cheated on this one. *

I'll be cheatin' soon, too...;))) There is not a mesh out there that does it all. *

Hey - one other cool thing. There's all this Miki 3 info, I guess from metadata that comes with Miki 3 that's displayed in the library - useful stuff. I wish more content I used had this information. It would be really helpful, for example Miki 3's deformer rig's metadata info tells you exactly why/how you should use it.

That's it. I'm done. Dinner time.

A 20 minute cheat in Zbrush. Morph brush should be able to do the same.

anybody yet tried PML on her? would love to know if it works on her new joints

HI!

Me again! (who?)

Okay, so I have Miki 3. Been working on her since Beta version(nice work Teyon).

I just want to say that I ONLY HAVE POSER 6! God-willing, I'll win one of CP's contest so I can support the new versions.

Anyway, I'm only doing textures and dynamic clothes and strand-based hair for Miki 3(MK3). This will be Kenya Japan II, hopefully released next month.

I'd like to add that Miki's material zones are driving me nuts. The zones REALLY need to be numbered to keep them organized and usable. For example, there are separate left and right eye zones not to mention separate top and bottom eye lash zones. Mapping this chick is a real hassle made even worse because the zones aren't organized into a simple numerical system such as exists in V4 wherein the head consists of 1_Face, 1_Nostril, 1_Lip, 1_EyeSocket. Instead, on MK3, I've got to deal with(hang on while I count)...2(maybe three) zones for the Head. Wait...that's fine, actually. But the eyes!! OMG, Becky!! NINE MATERIAL ZONES?! Seriously?! And that doesn't even include the lashes that were mentioned earlier!

Why?! Why the horror, Teyon? Who did this to us?! Did they want to punish us? Did we do something wrong?! Ow, the suffering! So many zones! The Body-to-Thigh zones...zig zags?! Oh, the humanity!

Also, the head...how come someone couldn't stitch those UV seams on the head together? Gag me with a spoon, that's hard to paint over in Photoshop.

On the plus side, though, whoever set up the UVs did so with Poser's sphere-like shader system in mind. Kudos on that! Because the shaders link at MK3's seams like a charm. And the UVs for the eyes(regardless of the nine zones) are set perfectly - they rest just inside the circumfrence of that sphereical shader. Lovely!

WTF is the purpose of the .xmp files? Any explanation for this?

Ulli

"Never argue with an idiot. They drag you down to their level and beat you with experience!"

Quote - WTF is the purpose of the .xmp files? Any explanation for this?

Some info was posted back in July...

http://blog.smithmicro.com/2010/07/12/poser-3d/metadata-makes-life-in-poser-easier/

There must be a thread about this somewhere around here as well...

Martin

Yesterday's the past, tomorrow's the future, but today is a gift. That's why it's called the present.

> Quote - WTF is the purpose of the .xmp files? Any explanation for this?

In the Poser library's extended details panel is where you see all the metadata in that XMP file. The folks at Smith have a python script and a tool built by netherworks that will automatically create that file - just plug in the info. I got to play around with it - really simple to use. I think they were going to give away, but not sure.

Hi synthymonkey.

Do you have any pics of the mesh? I would really like to see it. I love teyons mesh work. :) I dont have Miki 3 yet, no money, but am getting it next week. Meanwhile, I would love to see the mesh.

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A HOMELAND FOR POSER FINALLY

Quote - Hi synthymonkey.

Do you have any pics of the mesh? I would really like to see it. I love teyons mesh work. :) I dont have Miki 3 yet, no money, but am getting it next week. Meanwhile, I would love to see the mesh.

I need to work some up. Smith asked me as well just today - they must've read your post :-) It's a new mesh so seeing it would be good. I'm rendering this weekend but should be able to fit in some time for anti-aliased screen caps.

typical smith micro bad joints at elbow and knee you'd figure since they keep making bad joints at inside of elbow and knee at least the front side of said parts wouldn't continue to look big and knobby when they bend.

Not interested.

why do figure makers only sell figures based on the face?

"because it sells" someone will no doubt say -

well they'd sell more with a killer body and a killer face.

______________________

"When you have to shoot ...

SHOOT.

Don't talk "

- Tuco

Santicor's Gallery:

http://www.renderosity.com/homepage.php?page=3&userid=580115

Quote - A 20 minute cheat in Zbrush. Morph brush should be able to do the same.

That's nice work. Her knees look pretty natural here.

I wonder if someone could make some joint controlled morphs, like shown in that picture you made, to fix the bending problems?

Based on these pictures and the ones I saw at CP , I think that Miki 3 looks pretty cute and that's a good enough for me.

Besides, even Vicky 4 and Apollo have some bending problems.

D'oh! Why do things that happen to stupid people keep happening to me?

Quote - A 20 minute cheat in Zbrush. Morph brush should be able to do the same.

Ah delicious. So very beautiful Richardson.

Here you go, shame her feet are still revolting btw.

Looks like a nice mesh. Does she not have any JCM's in her legs? The mesh looks good, and should bend well with a JCM or two. Looks like maybe 70-74 K?

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A HOMELAND FOR POSER FINALLY

I made a free original head morph for Miki 3.

Please visit my page and download it: http://arrow3d.com/

Enjoy Miki 3 !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

STORE: https://www.renderosity.com/marketplace/vendors/3Dream

FREEBIES: https://www.renderosity.com/users/3Dream/freestuff

I neglected to say thank you. Thank you Einzelganger for the mesh pics. And thank you 3Dream for the Miki 3 head morph.

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A HOMELAND FOR POSER FINALLY

Would someone who has already bought Miki 3 do us who are on the fence (and Smith Micro, by way of consequence) a favor - post the following image, please: from left to right, Miki 3 default, and then each of her full body morphs (with the name of each FBM below). It seems as though they have no idea how to do marketing or promos over there (except for when a new version of Poser is on the way).

I bought Miki today, installed on my Mac.

Am I seeing things, or she a bit cross-eyed?

OK. Loaded her up, set the sit dial to 0.5 in the "Advanced" Body Controls and got huge dents it the thighs.

Am I missing something or does everyone get this? Can this be avoided?

Any help gratefully received.

Poser Pro 11, DAZ Studio 4.9

> Quote - Would someone who has already bought Miki 3 do us who are on the fence (and Smith Micro, by way of consequence) a favor - post the following image, please: from left to right, Miki 3 default, and then each of her full body morphs (with the name of each FBM below). It seems as though they have no idea how to do marketing or promos over there (except for when a new version of Poser is on the way).

Here ya go. NOTE! I am rendering the beta final release candidate. There may be differences in the actual released version, but I have not downloaded it yet. If anybody sees a big difference in the final versus what I'm showing here, let me know and I'll DL and build this again.

Left to right, each set to 1.0:

No morph, AnimeBody, BodyBuilder, Emaciated, Heavy, Pregnant, Thin, Voluptuous

All have the FBM NipplesAndGenitals set to 1. It does not come in that way by default.

Renderosity forum reply notifications are wonky. If I read a follow-up in a thread, but I don't myself reply, then notifications no longer happen AT ALL on that thread. So if I seem to be ignoring a question, that's why. (Updated September 23, 2019)

Thanks, I may just get her after all :)

i would buy this if i would know if there is some hair for Miki 3?

Quote - i would buy this if i would know if there is some hair for Miki 3?

She comes with two new hairstyles in the pack.

Also there is this

http://www.runtimedna.com/HCS_Miki3.html

and this

http://market.renderosity.com/mod/bcs/index.php?ViewProduct=83485

Hope this helps

Poser Pro 11, DAZ Studio 4.9

And V4, V3 etc. prop hair is easily transposed.

Quote - > Quote - i would buy this if i would know if there is some hair for Miki 3?

She comes with two new hairstyles in the pack.

Also there is this

http://www.runtimedna.com/HCS_Miki3.html

and this

http://market.renderosity.com/mod/bcs/index.php?ViewProduct=83485

Hope this helps

I really like the lineup of body types for Miki 3. This figure has some very nice morphs! Wow! The joint handling looks pretty standard for Poser figures, however. :sad: This isn't the great leap forward yet, but it looks like a pretty good figure. I think I may have to go in for one, once the money settles after the holiday. :thumbupboth:

===========================sigline======================================================

Cage can be an opinionated jerk who posts without thinking. He apologizes for this. He's honestly not trying to be a turkeyhead.

Cage had some freebies, compatible with Poser 11 and below. His Python scripts were saved at archive.org, along with the rest of the Morphography site, where they were hosted.

What is up with that hip bend, that looks terrible. The knee and elbow bends aren't very good but wow, that hip bend is awful. I see some bad mesh intersection at the neck too.

My Freebies

Quote - What is up with that hip bend, that looks terrible. The knee and elbow bends aren't very good but wow, that hip bend is awful. I see some bad mesh intersection at the neck too.

I was wondering the same thing. I dont know who they have rigging for them but he/she sucks at it, and needs to move out of the way and let someone who knows what they are doing get in there.

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A HOMELAND FOR POSER FINALLY

Actually I see problems at the ankle, toes and collars too. Are those pics from Poser 7 or something, or does the figure bend like that in P8?

My Freebies

Haruchai is using P8 I notice. But she shouldn't break that bad even in P6. Love the expressions textures and mats though.

Edit: My earlier post seems a bit mean. I dont intend to be mean just honest. I will buy the figure anyway just because I support Poser and I like Teyons work in most cases. But I have to say that the rigging in the Poser figures is soo very poor. I have often wondered if the rigger is not purposesly sabotaging the figures, I just don't understand how anyone on a professional level could possibly be that bad at their job. Come on if it was anywhere else they would have recieved their pink slip already.

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A HOMELAND FOR POSER FINALLY

Quote - Haruchai is using P8 I notice.

I have also now got Poser Pro 2010 (just not updated my sig) and tried her in both to make sure it wasn't program specific.

Anyone else seen this? If so how did it get through testing?

Not intending to do a lot of nude renders but still......

Poser Pro 11, DAZ Studio 4.9

Nude or not, if the rig has problems then conformers will have the same problems (since they must use the same rig, for the most part). Those bad bends are not the kind of thing you should fix with JCM, those are coming from bad joint configuration.

My Freebies

Not claiming to be a master rigger over here, but which of these looks more natural, the default G2 knee:

My Freebies

or this:

(tbh both of these look more natural than that Miki 3 knee)

My Freebies

The changes that need to be made to the rigging (P4-PoserPro 2010) are really so very simple and basic. (JP's)

You know through these past years since I have been working with Poser I keep the hope. Stiff upper lip and all that. Cheering for the home team..... I tell people things like "I think we will see something better in the figures in the future." I make excuses for the poor bending. I constantly back Poser over similar progs, cause I know its not the progs fault. Things will get better....

There comes a time though when I just have to face the music, things are not going to get better. Because for whatever reason SM will not get someone in there to do the job. I love Poser, and I am sad. Weight mapping would be great, but it will solve nothing if the figures still have bad JP's.

Please SM, please take pity on your customers. I am heart broken.

hangs head and shuffles off to bed to dream of what Poser could be.

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A HOMELAND FOR POSER FINALLY

Quote - There comes a time though when I just have to face the music, things are not going to get better. Because for whatever reason SM will not get someone in there to do the job. I love Poser, and I am sad. Weight mapping would be great, but it will solve nothing if the figures still have bad JP's.

I assume that a certain (lower than I'd like) standard of quality is being held for Poser figure joints. I guess most Poser and Daz users don't care about good joint handling very much. Each new figure is neither too much better than nor too much worse than any existing figure. They all live up to the current Poser standard, settle for meeting expectations rather than exceeding them. :sad:

I'm hoping all of the recent discussion about weight mapping will at least make people notice the quality of bending on their figures. If people start to notice, maybe they'll start to want something better and the acceptable standard will change.

In the meantime, you seem more level-headed about bad joints than I've often been. :lol: Before Antonia came along, I used to try to improve joint handling myself. I'm not good at it, and the current joint system is more art than science, hard to learn. More than once Cage lost his temper and things were broken. :lol:

===========================sigline======================================================

Cage can be an opinionated jerk who posts without thinking. He apologizes for this. He's honestly not trying to be a turkeyhead.

Cage had some freebies, compatible with Poser 11 and below. His Python scripts were saved at archive.org, along with the rest of the Morphography site, where they were hosted.

It is an art I suppose. A mechanical sort of art, much like figuring out the gears to keep the planets rotating in order on a solar system model. Antonia.. she is a great one. :)

.

A HOMELAND FOR POSER FINALLY

*Nice Japanese lady combing her hair ?*

Combined Miki 3's texture with a V4 shader (by Maskedit) and a V3 dynamic kimono.

*Not so nice Japanese lady about to sushi-fy someone.*

Quote - Nice Japanese lady combing her hair ?

Combined Miki 3's texture with a V4 shader (by Maskedit) and a V3 dynamic kimono.

Why did you use that shader instead of the one that comes with Miki3?

Renderosity forum reply notifications are wonky. If I read a follow-up in a thread, but I don't myself reply, then notifications no longer happen AT ALL on that thread. So if I seem to be ignoring a question, that's why. (Updated September 23, 2019)

Quote - It is an art I suppose. A mechanical sort of art, much like figuring out the gears to keep the planets rotating in order on a solar system model. Antonia.. she is a great one. :)

Agree. I moved Antonia back in my start-up scene.

quote :

Why did you use that shader instead of the one that comes with Miki3?

While other vendors offer high quality textures too what they are mostly lacking are shaders such as Maskedit's which are the best I have encountered so far. Maybe a question of personal taste.

Unfortunately his products are no longer available if I'm not mistaken.

PS : would somebody please make ordinary panties for Miki 3 ?

> Quote - quote : > > *Why did you use that shader instead of the one that comes with Miki3?* > > While other vendors offer high quality textures too what they are mostly lacking are shaders such as Maskedit's which are the best I have encountered so far. Maybe a question of personal taste. > > Unfortunately his products are no longer available if I'm not mistaken. > > PS : would somebody please make ordinary panties for Miki 3 ?

That's a beatiful shader from Maskedit. I don't think I've heard of that vendor - do they have anything famous I can go look at, a website...something?

This is my own skin shader on Miki 3. There will be this version, a light and a dark skin version. Nice!

From my photographic memory (which makes only blurry pictures) I remember seeing a message announcing the vendor quit producing and selling Poser stuff because of his Real World chores taking too much time. There is/was no personal website either I think. A great loss for the Poser community.

However, did find a link to a (no longer sold) product page :

http://www.renderosity.com/mod/bcs/index.php?ViewProduct=20971

Render : Miki 2 using one of his shaders and (converted V4) textures. The dragon is not part of that texture, only playing around with various settings of the blender node.

Are you in Poser 8 or Pro 2010?

Note: I'm asking because

I get better results than that. I think your lighting is off.
I wrote the Miki3 shader for SM.
VSS works even better than what you have, or the Miki 3 shader. SM didn't want to publish a complicated shader so they forced me to keep it simple.
If you are in Pro 2010 and you enable render GC, you'll see an unbelievable difference.

NOTE: Programmers count from 0. grin

Renderosity forum reply notifications are wonky. If I read a follow-up in a thread, but I don't myself reply, then notifications no longer happen AT ALL on that thread. So if I seem to be ignoring a question, that's why. (Updated September 23, 2019)

P8, only a quick render using a single white light with raytrace shadows and ambient occlusion.

1) The result still looks too greyish for me. Maybe the result of "keeping it simple" ?

I Should try VSS once. Did you sign the evil kind of papers still allowing SM to keep you from releasing a complicated shader ?
Would someone offer me an upgrade to Pro 2010 please ?

Well I'm pleasantly surprised at my new toy L And she does come with a lot of stuff when you consider the price - less than $14 if you use that coupon code at the top of the forum here ;)

I like her and I think she bends ok (what I've seen so far at least)

There's some problems with the shirt, the FBMs doesn't work (not the Miki3 morphs at least) but .. you can dial them in manually so it's no biggie.

Actually IMO her biggest "problem" is her ears, they lack details! But the rest of her is cute and she does look Japanese to me ^^

The ears bug me, too. Same as Sydney and what's her name from Poser 8. It isn't just a lack of detail - it's odd.

Renderosity forum reply notifications are wonky. If I read a follow-up in a thread, but I don't myself reply, then notifications no longer happen AT ALL on that thread. So if I seem to be ignoring a question, that's why. (Updated September 23, 2019)

Using VSS with "beach" light preset.

Cool! I don't know if you found the discussion of this, but when I made those light sets I made the IBL's way too hot. Cut the intensity of them in half.

And you're using the PR3 shader, right? Don't use the older ones. They are bad. Bad I tell you!

Renderosity forum reply notifications are wonky. If I read a follow-up in a thread, but I don't myself reply, then notifications no longer happen AT ALL on that thread. So if I seem to be ignoring a question, that's why. (Updated September 23, 2019)

I made a tool that helps a lot for getting light levels right. It's the BBLightMeter. It's a prop you put in the scene and render it - the rendering of the prop reveals if you have too much light (it turns red) or not enough (it turns black). When things are just right, it makes big white circles that slightly overlap.

It has two parts - the inner measures diffuse light and the outer measures specular light.

It's here:

http://sites.google.com/site/bagginsbill/file-cabinet/BBLightMeter.zip?attredirects=0&d=1

Read why you want it here:

http://www.renderosity.com/mod/forumpro/showthread.php?message_id=3642925&ebot_calc_page#message_3642925

and follow links from there.

Renderosity forum reply notifications are wonky. If I read a follow-up in a thread, but I don't myself reply, then notifications no longer happen AT ALL on that thread. So if I seem to be ignoring a question, that's why. (Updated September 23, 2019)

This is the "field" light preset with the BBLM. Looks about right, except that the skin looks very dry.

No it's not right. The yellow means close to too much. When you see it on half the light meter, it is to much. A touch of yellow is OK.

Any orange or red is bad.

And in order to see some 3D, you really want some contrast - light from below should not be near solid white like that. You want the upper part of the disk to have more white than the lower part.

Also, notice the specular ring is black. That means you're using only IBL and getting no specular effects. I wondered about that - it being VSS there should be some nice shine on the skin. But somehow the specular lighting is gone. That's why the skin looks dry.

IBL only affects diffuse lighting in Poser. We use other lights to balance. Sometimes we make an infinite or a spot with less Diffuse_Color in it, perhaps even 0 (black). Such a light (black diffuse) is called a specular-only light.

We have to use IBL for fast global illumination, but used alone it produces that dry look. You want to balance it correctly with specular-only lights. That's why the BBLightMeter is so great. If things are in balance, the ring and the disk will look about the same. If one is white and the other is dark, it is not balanced.

When I submitted those original VSS light sets, I didn't yet have a full grasp of this - that's why they are not so good. I should get my ass in gear and delete those and provide good ones.

Renderosity forum reply notifications are wonky. If I read a follow-up in a thread, but I don't myself reply, then notifications no longer happen AT ALL on that thread. So if I seem to be ignoring a question, that's why. (Updated September 23, 2019)

I spoke to soon after waking up. When I said "any orange or red is bad", that was too much a blanket statement.

In some cases, you want a little over exposure - to get that outdoor blazing sun look. Also, if you enable HSV Exponential tone mapping, it is impossible to overexpose, and so more red is acceptable.

It's been a while since I did some Poser 8 style rendering (i.e. without render GC) but I just did a little tweaking and see that good results are possible with "simple" shaders.

This is the standard Miki3 Basic skin, rendered in Poser Pro 2010 but only using P8 features.

I made adjustments to the lighting and the tone mapping that are pretty simple.

Today is a busy day for me at home, but perhaps tomorrow I will have time to post some details.

Renderosity forum reply notifications are wonky. If I read a follow-up in a thread, but I don't myself reply, then notifications no longer happen AT ALL on that thread. So if I seem to be ignoring a question, that's why. (Updated September 23, 2019)

Taking advantage of how HSV ETM works, here I intentionally bumped up the light levels. Not bad.

Renderosity forum reply notifications are wonky. If I read a follow-up in a thread, but I don't myself reply, then notifications no longer happen AT ALL on that thread. So if I seem to be ignoring a question, that's why. (Updated September 23, 2019)

Another thing: If you can afford the render time, use IDL, not IBL. (Actually for me IDL is often faster than IBL+AO. But I have a fast computer.)

Here I enabled IDL and the color of my sky and ground is actually being used instead of some arbitrary colors in an IBL image.

Renderosity forum reply notifications are wonky. If I read a follow-up in a thread, but I don't myself reply, then notifications no longer happen AT ALL on that thread. So if I seem to be ignoring a question, that's why. (Updated September 23, 2019)

To be honest, though, while all gamma compensation techniques have their uses (more light, ETM, shader GC, arbitrary shader tweaking, postwork), my opinion of the superiority of render GC still stands.

This is the same shader and IDL is on, but with render GC enabled instead of HSV ETM.

Renderosity forum reply notifications are wonky. If I read a follow-up in a thread, but I don't myself reply, then notifications no longer happen AT ALL on that thread. So if I seem to be ignoring a question, that's why. (Updated September 23, 2019)

Shader GC (as provided in VSS) gets you darn close though.

Here:

Render GC is off
Using VSS shader instead of Miki3 Basic.
VSS shader tweaks: Shine=.3, Diffuse Reflectivity=.8, SSS=.3.
Using IDL

Renderosity forum reply notifications are wonky. If I read a follow-up in a thread, but I don't myself reply, then notifications no longer happen AT ALL on that thread. So if I seem to be ignoring a question, that's why. (Updated September 23, 2019)

Your totally black disc doesn't agree with me but this is the most satisfactory result so far : some shine on her skin, metals do not render white or black, correct shadows (map size 1024), correct reflections, no fading of other materials.

VSS shader, no modifications.
single infinite white light, raytrace shadows (shadows = 0.5), ambient occlusion (0.4).

For only a slight visible improvement IDL takes way too long to render in P8.

Quote - From my photographic memory (which makes only blurry pictures) I remember seeing a message announcing the vendor quit producing and selling Poser stuff because of his Real World chores taking too much time. There is/was no personal website either I think. A great loss for the Poser community.

However, did find a link to a (no longer sold) product page :

http://www.renderosity.com/mod/bcs/index.php?ViewProduct=20971

Render : Miki 2 using one of his shaders and (converted V4) textures. The dragon is not part of that texture, only playing around with various settings of the blender node.

Okay, NOW I remember MaskEdit! Great work by them! I thought I recognized the name somehow! So yes, I agree this was one of the great ones. It's a real shame their stuff is gone. If he'd advanced into using SSS I think he'd dominate the marketplace.

Quote - Your totally black disc doesn't agree

You have it under the roof? In shadow?

Agree the picture looks good - never seen the meter misbehave in the past.

Renderosity forum reply notifications are wonky. If I read a follow-up in a thread, but I don't myself reply, then notifications no longer happen AT ALL on that thread. So if I seem to be ignoring a question, that's why. (Updated September 23, 2019)

quote :

You have it under the roof? In shadow?

No, it's in exactly the same position as before (at her right hand). Slighty in front of the building. Rendering pitchblack.

What's funny, to show you the disc's position I moved camera and light and now the disc does behave, even showing a "correct" lighting.

Once again, I'm working in Poser 6. So...I'm limited to the Cloth | Material Rooms for what I can produce.

I'm making a character about the japanese and crows. Here is a low quality render of the dynamic Crow Cloak(yeah...I know its a lame name, shad up! lol)

OH! Also: about the skin texturing thing in POser, has anyone found a good use for epidermus, subdermal, and SSS maps?

I made use of them for this character, but...it just seems like a waste of rendering power because Poser insists on putting these horrible bands of color where a smooth gradient should be whenever I use SSS and raytracing(never above a 3 value). Either my computer sucks(yes, its a office-type laptop thats over a decade old) or Poser doesnt do SSS well.

Poser doesn't do Sub Surface Scatering.

Oh Poser does SSS all right. In spades!

Check out some of my gallery for some SSS pics and this product I made that uses SSS to shine light through skin(lava skin, but still! LOL)

Kenya: China

Kenya: China Expansion

Admittedly, I don't get much problems from Poser and SSS when I use a control map, but just adding SSS via the Material Rooms auto-add node...issues.

Ah well can't have everything!

As I understand it, Poser doesn't do REAL SSS - what it does is an approximation of real SSS. It can look quite nice, but it's not the real thing.

The Fastscatter node does not really provide SSS, Firefly cannot do that yet. Or how would you make believable wax?

A ship in port is safe; but that is not what ships are built for.
Sail out to sea and do new things.
-"Amazing Grace" Hopper

Avatar image of me done by Chidori.

Hm...does anyone know where the empty dials in Miki 3 are? I'm making a face morph for her and can't make an INJ/REM because I can't locate any empty dials like V4 has.

Here's a pic of what Im working on for Miki 3. I only have Poser 6 so...dynamic clothes only from me. Oh and this texture for her.

The CP figures do not have empty dials. I think there is a python script to add some, but I haven't found it up to now, will look again after work today.

A ship in port is safe; but that is not what ships are built for.
Sail out to sea and do new things.
-"Amazing Grace" Hopper

Avatar image of me done by Chidori.

NOOOOooooooOOOOOOooooo*splat!

My computer died. Took all my work with it. Backups...didn't take.

SoooooOOOOoooo...re-doing Miki 3 character pack from scratch. Going to make a different hair. I LOVED that hair(seen earlier in thread). It made her look like Wiley Kit(or Kat. Whoever the girl was!)

Does anyone know if Miki 3' neck can stretch without distorting the mesh - like, is there a morph?

You don't really need empty dials if you add your dials via pmd files. Much much easier IMVHO, no scripts necessary.

Nerd3d has an excellent tutorial on the subject, written for Poser6, but still valid.

http://www.nerd3d.com/modules.php?name=Content&pa=showpage&pid=13

still hooked to real life and enjoying the siesta!
Visit my blog! :D
Visit my portfolio! :D

> Quote - You don't really need empty dials if you add your dials via pmd files. Much much easier IMVHO, no scripts necessary. > > Nerd3d has an excellent tutorial on the subject, written for Poser6, but still valid. > > [ http://www.nerd3d.com/modules.php?name=Content&pa=showpage&pid=13](http://www.nerd3d.com/modules.php?name=Content&pa=showpage&pid=13) > > > >

O..O

Uhhhhmmmm....code? [brain: resetting]

Whoa! Did I just visit the matrix?! Me and coding don't get along! LOL Thank you for the link but my brain just can't handle coding things:D WYSIWYGs only for me!

Meantime, I've gone ahead and started to remake my Miki3 stuff but its not as shader-complicated as it had been:( Really sad too! I'd figured out the holygrail of shader'ings: laying a color'ed tattoo over a skin texture. Now I cant recall how I set it up and have settled for a lesser version of what I had before this incarnation. So sad:( Everything happens for a reason so I just used this as a way to do a better/differnt job.

Anyway....LOOK AT THIS HAIR! It's wild!! Had to make a new skullcap too! oye

Miki3 comes with some awesome morphs! If only I had Poser 8 I could actually USE them! But I can't...alas Poser 6 is my tomb and I fear(cue the little violin) I will have to purchase a new laptop long before I upgrade!

quote :

I'd figured out the holygrail of shader'ings: laying a color'ed tattoo over a skin texture. Now I cant recall how I set it up

Something like this ?

http://www.superheroinecentral.com/mrx/xpage/decaltutorial/decaltutorial.htm

Look down the page for the tattoo part.

Quote - quote :

I'd figured out the holygrail of shader'ings: laying a color'ed tattoo over a skin texture. Now I cant recall how I set it up

Something like this ?

http://www.superheroinecentral.com/mrx/xpage/decaltutorial/decaltutorial.htm

Look down the page for the tattoo part.

Yeah! This'll work! I'd been using MathNodes, myself but I think I'l give this other method a try! Good looking out DarthJ!

And here's the crazy thing. JUST before I read your reply I figured out how to layer the tattoo over Miki3's skin texture! C'est la vie, right? ! LOL But I like this other method of using a tiny decal instead of a full-size overlay decal. It's a lot more responsible to work with tiny images, if possible, to keep down the size of product files for customers.

So my computer died - completely. Lost all my work and the backups failed.

Started over again: I like how this new version of Miki is coming out. Opportunites abound, right?

I will say this much for Miki3: she has some great included-morphs. She's an incredible value for the money. Still, I can't begin to use her in my obsolete Poser 6:D heheh

Here's how she's looking now(cropped to keep her broken body hidden). The hair is called "Crow's Nest" in honor oh the fallen "Crow" Miki project that got taken down with my laptop.

In this version I'm combining the tricks that DarthJ showed me with my previous shader network.

The white pain on the face and the tattoo as well as makeup are all just little masks or whatever, for big effects with tiny files.

It`s somehow a little bit frustrating. Nearly no textures for Miki 3, nearly no morph packages and that after 6 weeks.

Ulli

"Never argue with an idiot. They drag you down to their level and beat you with experience!"

Quote - It`s somehow a little bit frustrating. Nearly no textures for Miki 3, nearly no morph packages and that after 6 weeks.

I'm working on it! Uhm but I can offer face morphs since I don't have Poser 8+ to test the morphs with - no idea what those weight magnets would do to a full body morph though I want to make them.

None? Really?

Forum: Poser - OFFICIAL

Subject: Miki 3.0