Hey All Yes im a new poser user learning as i go..so thank you in advance for the help.

i found poser in a comp i bought at a teck auction.such a sweet program.

My first question.it came with a lode of DLC (BUT) 60% of said content has no preview icon in the library wair in my runtime/content do i put previews

#2 why does 30% of content i install using poser content tap find its way to the pose content when its not a pose?...(ie) mats ,skins,eyes,

thats all i have for now im sure as i dig into poser i will have more NOOB Questions.

thanks for haveing me in your forms im looking forward to posting some of my work and get some feed back...chat u soon

KAI

My suggestion is to extract whatever you are using, into a folder on the desktop. Study the folders that each file goes into. This way you learn the way the file structure of poser works. Then just copy into your runtime and you will know where each item can be located. Get different items to test like clothing, poses, materials and props. They all save in different folders. Once you understand why, you'll have no problems with future content.

My Renderosity Store

What version of Poser?

Check your previews that are not showing, if they are rsr files convert them to png. Search google if you do not know how.

Poser pose directory contains MAT Poses, Morph injections and other pose files. MAT Poses have been replaced with Material Collections since Poser 6, but many users are too lazy or prefer to still clutter the pose directory with MAT Poses. You can change them with little effort to Material Collections and move them. Here is a product that does it for you http://www.contentparadise.com/productDetails.aspx?id=19651

Also DAZ Studio until Version 4 refused to see the Materials folder in Poser runtimes.

Again GIYF (Google is your friend)

Cheers
Randy

pro 2012...........

Just because you purchased ths system at auction does not make you the legal owner of the application and most especially any third party content on the system.

SMS will not allow you to update or offer you support as the license and serial were purchased by someone else.

If there is content such as the V4, M4 or any of the DAZ models or content, DAZ will not recognize you as the legal owner.  Same holds true for vendors here at RMP and RDNA.

The only way you will have legal ownership is to purchase the app from SMS and purchase the content that was not part of the Poser install.

It's a good idea to read the EULA for Poser and the EULA's for any content that comes from DAZ, RMP, and/or RDNA.

Best thing to do would be to format the hard drive and install a fresh copy of Windows on it.

At least that way, you'll be assured everything that is purchased and installed from that point on, is licensed to you.

                                                                                                                    

Poser 10

Octane Render

Wings 3D

Back in the days of Poser 4, users discovered the hack of mat poses and mor poses. 

Before mat poses, you had to manually apply textures to each and every surface.  To apply morphs, was more complicated.

Eventually, the hack became a standard.  Once Poser 6 introduced the mc6 or material collection that will apply a collection of material settings all at once in the material room, Poser vendors began to use them.  However, since DS cannot read the mc6, vendors who want to sell to DS users create mat poses.

3 things.

1. what icprncss2 said.

2. Poser Pro 2012 is too new to be sitting around on a computer at auction.

3. No one who buys the program would say "sweet" or "NOOB".

 

            “So, roll me further B_t__h!”

Quote - 3 things.

1. what icprncss2 said.

2. Poser Pro 2012 is too new to be sitting around on a computer at auction.

3. No one who buys the program would say "sweet" or "NOOB".

  :lol:  

Coppula eam se non posit acceptera jocularum.

My Store

My Gallery

For 1 I bought the comp from a estate auction its a I5 thats pretty new

 i have ALL the packing/coads and disks for all soft wair that came with it.

So the way i see it. it was bought from a softwair dealer who happoned to meat a untimely demise so in a sence i bought the softwair.

AND i hope thats not the way you great the new users of this forum. So very RUDE!!!!!

Even if what you say is true...there is no way to legally transfer downloadable content like DAZ's Poser stuff.  They don't allow you to resell it. 

New users aren't rudely greeted here, but pirates always are.

 

I'm sorry for the tone of the forum members, Kaihean: I'm sure you bought the computer and all the software in good faith. This happens a lot: I see computers sold with Microsoft Office and what-have-you included where neither (possibly) the seller nor the buyer realise that the terms of the EULA stipulate no licence is transferrable.

What you do from here on out is really up to you, Kaihean. I really don't think anyone has the right to judge you since I'm convinced you acted in good faith. What you decide to do with this information is important, however.

It's an unfortunate fact of life that very few people understand the basics of software licencing. Ignorance is not exoneration (certainly not in the eyes of the law) but it also shouldn't expose that individual to abuse when all excited about his new acquisition, he's ready to dig in and start learning.

Makes everyone here who has levied judgment on him appear a bit ... :glare:

Monterey/Mint21.x/Win10 - Blender3.x - PP11.3(cm) - Musescore3.6.2

Wir sind gewohnt, daß die Menschen verhöhnen was sie nicht verstehen
[it is clear that humans have contempt for that which they do not understand] 

Metaphor of Chooks

Just as a side-note: wonder how many over at CG Society actually Puchased their copy of 3DSMax or Maya or... :blink:

Again, doesn't make it right. If this person had been a true pirate, he would have kept quiet about his mode of acquiring the software, don't you think?

Go ahead: flame me if you want, but you'll have to agree that computer purchase with softare included happens a lot.

Monterey/Mint21.x/Win10 - Blender3.x - PP11.3(cm) - Musescore3.6.2

Wir sind gewohnt, daß die Menschen verhöhnen was sie nicht verstehen
[it is clear that humans have contempt for that which they do not understand] 

Metaphor of Chooks

Quote -   If this person had been a true pirate, he would have kept quiet about his mode of acquiring the software, don't you think?

Not necessarily. Someone ignorant of copyright law might think the "I bought a computer that came with software" excuse is legit.

And I think the tone is because people don't believe the story.  A used computer with PoserPro 2012 included?  It just came out a couple of months ago. 

I tend to give people the benefit of the doubt... :blink: ...gets me in a lot of trouble...

Monterey/Mint21.x/Win10 - Blender3.x - PP11.3(cm) - Musescore3.6.2

Wir sind gewohnt, daß die Menschen verhöhnen was sie nicht verstehen
[it is clear that humans have contempt for that which they do not understand] 

Metaphor of Chooks

What RobynsVeil said. :)

My comments were not meant to be mean.

BTW You can get Poser Debut free if you can download a 2.2GB file.

http://store.smithmicro.com/productDetails.aspx?id=20136

Cheers
Randy

Quote - Best thing to do would be to format the hard drive and install a fresh copy of Windows on it. At least that way, you'll be assured everything that is purchased and installed from that point on, is licensed to you.

BTW, I agree with BR completely on this... but only because I do know about licencing and all that. To the unwary: DON'T buy a PC where the buyer says: "Comes with..." You're buying hardware. that's it. The rest is not the seller's to sell.

Even if the buyer is dead, that licence can't be transfered to the living. It's licenced to him (or her). Be sure to spend a bit of time reading EULAs... and then, tell your friends!

Monterey/Mint21.x/Win10 - Blender3.x - PP11.3(cm) - Musescore3.6.2

Wir sind gewohnt, daß die Menschen verhöhnen was sie nicht verstehen
[it is clear that humans have contempt for that which they do not understand] 

Metaphor of Chooks

Quote - For 1 I bought the comp from a estate auction its a I5 thats pretty new  i have ALL the packing/coads and disks for all soft wair that came with it.

So the way i see it. it was bought from a softwair dealer who happoned to meat a untimely demise so in a sence i bought the softwair.

No, actually you didn't buy the software. One doesn't (generally speaking, unless you're a software company buying out another) buy software: one buys a licence to use the software. And that licence is never transferrable via sale/purchase of hardware it is installed on. This includes Windows, IIUC. Ignorance - as I said - doesn't exonerate you... read what people here have said as valuable information to live by and pass on to your friends.

You might think people here were rude. Others would have dobbed you in for piracy. I prefer rudeness.

Monterey/Mint21.x/Win10 - Blender3.x - PP11.3(cm) - Musescore3.6.2

Wir sind gewohnt, daß die Menschen verhöhnen was sie nicht verstehen
[it is clear that humans have contempt for that which they do not understand] 

Metaphor of Chooks

I appreciate your ability to give Kaihean the benefit of the doubt Robynsveil.... I didn't use to be so jaded.

 

I've been around a long time. I use Carrara 8 Pro, DS4 and Poser Pro 2012 (which I was finally able to afford). I do not think I'm just a bitter old fart... though others might be in a better position to decide that for themselves.

I use Carrara  because that's what I can afford. I don't use Photoshop (I use Gimp), Max, Maya, C4D (though I do play with it on a friend's computer with his legal copy). Modo, Lightwave, or anything High Dollar. Why? Because I'm a Hobbyist and it would be a bit much for me to "Own" Thousands of dollars worth of software.... anyone of which would take me 112 years to learn.

I've spent a LOT of time around Pirates (I worked with a bunch) and they are typically pretty easilly spotted. Kaihean is very young, uses the vernacular, spelling, and grammatical style of Pirates and Script Kiddies, asks odd questions for someone with a legally installed copy of a software program....... and has the typical installation of an illegally obtained software program.

I'm not one of those people that thinks every 14 year old with a copy of Maya represents a loss of a grand or whatever for the  huge Publisher.... as most of the Pirates of any software are never going to use it for much of anything anyway. I DO hate Pirated copies of stuff Like Crossdresser, or Models when it represents a lot of work offered at minimal cost by a small group (or one) person(s).

Now.... I could be wrong. But I'll stand by what I said until someone can convince me otherwise.

 

            “So, roll me further B_t__h!”

I do agree with you, Mac. Which is why I added what I did. Like I said: ignorance does not exonerate. I used GIMP until I could afford CS3 (when CS5 was out, got shrink-wrapped legal copy that Adobe accepted as such when i sent in for the licence registration). All the software I have is legal as well, including a separate copy of Win 7 for each PC. And I use Blender because I can't afford modo.

For me, it's an ethical thing. I really think that high-priced software - too high for the common man to even consider - tends to encourage piracy.

But to not pay for like PFE or content made by people on here is pathetic. C'mon: it's $26 bucks, for cryin' out loud. And most content is less than that. In this case, you really are hurting other artists. Is any art worth that?

Monterey/Mint21.x/Win10 - Blender3.x - PP11.3(cm) - Musescore3.6.2

Wir sind gewohnt, daß die Menschen verhöhnen was sie nicht verstehen
[it is clear that humans have contempt for that which they do not understand] 

Metaphor of Chooks

 

Yeah.. happened to me way backa round poser 6 ish... thats how I got started in 3d.  A friend basically gave me a Rig and told me to check out this program...

It was a bit of a painfull process purging all the runtimes once I realised how things work with content creators vendors etc.  Made worse by the fact that I bough and installed a bunch of stuff before I started trying to purge.. plus freebies.. oh so many freebies... Sometimes I still go looking to see if I have this product that I remember using once... oh thats right... not mine shoot :(  and a lot of the time not available anymore.

Its tough to kiss goodbye a lot of content but when you consider that the people making the content are just ordinary folk and not 'some big company'  Its not hard to see the right thing to do

 

Quote - Just as a side-note: wonder how many over at CG Society actually Puchased their copy of 3DSMax or Maya or... :blink:

Again, doesn't make it right. If this person had been a true pirate, he would have kept quiet about his mode of acquiring the software, don't you think?

Go ahead: flame me if you want, but you'll have to agree that computer purchase with softare included happens a lot.

My statements were not meant to be rude but to help the OP understand the lay of the land.

Better the OP learn now how things work.  Simple as that.

Which making free stuff so great! I am a vendor on here and do sell products and even though I don't depend on this as an income, I know at least somewhat what it's like to pour heart and soul and spirit into your product and then offer it for !really! so little and still see it turn up on a Warez site (friends alerted me to this: I don't frequent warez sites, in case you're wondering :blink:). It's gut-wrenching. I can't really describe adequately how it made me feel. It was enough to put me off selling anything.

But it also made me respect all the more highly those who do continue to make content and software for us in the face of that. I took the chicken way out. I'm making stuff that's free. I don't think I can take that sort of horror again.

So, please respect the content makers here, Kaihean (if you're still reading this). They aren't corporations: they are people like you and me. And you using their work hurts them... it really does!

Monterey/Mint21.x/Win10 - Blender3.x - PP11.3(cm) - Musescore3.6.2

Wir sind gewohnt, daß die Menschen verhöhnen was sie nicht verstehen
[it is clear that humans have contempt for that which they do not understand] 

Metaphor of Chooks

This is an interesting read!  ;-)

Welcome to the world of 3d.  Some of the most interesting forums, and forumee's (?) that you will ever meet!  LOL!  You are joining at a very unstable (but exciting) time in this arena!

That's a cool to get an I5 at an estate sale!  I never even thought to look for computers, I always look for antiques and old stuff.

Poser 2012 offers a free 30 day trial.  Another option that could probably save a lot of time and trouble just seeing if you like this type of software by trying it for 30 days, and then, buy or delete.  You are sticking real close to the intent of the law then, and getting a little bonus by not having to download/install/hold your credit card hostage, etc. 

It will be hard to buy/delete when the time comes, but you'll be doing the right thing.  :)  A free piece of software, ain't worth a persons integrity.

In the meantime, doco and google are good, and there are 3 forums that are good help!  RDNA, here and Daz.  All 3 would give you good assitance with Poser, though this one and the RDNA are more Poser focused.  Daz has gotten a little dicey with the Poser followers lately...but it should iron out sometime, as SM and Daz seem to be working together.  There was even a way to get DS3 Advanced free at one point, and may still be a possible find. (though doco for DS is awful...)

Have fun!

Quote - My statements were not meant to be rude but to help the OP understand the lay of the land.

Better the OP learn now how things work.  Simple as that.

In retrospect I should have said: "please excuse the apparent rude tone..." no one was being deliberately rude, but were certainly operating from the same sentiment I am: protecting our own.

Can't help but wonder: do other sites tacitly condone software piracy by never addressing this with new members? you know, the "don't ask, don't tell" approach? or am I opening a can of worms?

BTW, I'm not condoning software piracy at any level... corporations price their software at corporate pricing levels for a reason, I guess. Personally, I simply won't use software that costs too much for my budget: there are much less expensive alternatives - sometimes even free! All software I have on my system is either no-cost (like Blender, which foundation I do donate to) or paid-for, licenced-to-me versions.

Same for content... particularly so!

Monterey/Mint21.x/Win10 - Blender3.x - PP11.3(cm) - Musescore3.6.2

Wir sind gewohnt, daß die Menschen verhöhnen was sie nicht verstehen
[it is clear that humans have contempt for that which they do not understand] 

Metaphor of Chooks

I've only been a vendor for a year, and a modeler for 18 months, so I'm still fortunate enough to not have any of my products on warez sites.

Many people don't realize the time it take to make any given product. From the modeling stage, to UV mapping, then you have texturing. That is the least abount of work involved in any poser prop/figure. IF it's a figure, you get to add rigging (and now weight mapping) your figure. And there's morphs, etc...

After all that, it gets sold for $10-$20(if it's REALLY good), and we hope mass sales will make up for the time spent. That would be nice if we could predict what sells, and what's going to be a big flop.

The least amount of time I've spent on one of my products was 1 week, and that was because I was having so much fun making it, I worked on it constantly, every day (see my Aubrey II figure ;o)

When I worked, remodeling houses, I made roughly $500-$800 a week, depending on the jobs. So, in theory, I should try and make that much from that model. The trick is, finding that 'perfect' price to charge.

It's a tough market, without the threat of piracy hovering over you constantly.

                                                                                                                    

Poser 10

Octane Render

Wings 3D

Quote - Again, doesn't make it right. If this person had been a true pirate, he would have kept quiet about his mode of acquiring the software, don't you think?

I agree, you also must take into consideration that Poser has problems and is not working properly. Any pirate can download any software that is working and without any problem

Stupidity also evolves!

[quote

Can't help but wonder: do other sites tacitly condone software piracy by never addressing this with new members? you know, the "don't ask, don't tell" approach? or am I opening a can of worms?

 

Yes, yes, and probably yes. There is one site and one "contributor" that constantly puts up vehicle models I've bought. De-rigged Poser Models he passes off as his own. He even puts his name on the license plates of the cars. I have no idea where he gets them all or even why he de-rigs them.... he averages about 10 a week.. and obviously I don't own every model he posts... but I have enough of them to know that the copywrite holder of the de-rigged model  is getting the shaft.

I just found the Digimation_ModelBank, VanishingPoint Otter out there... I'm going to buy it next week with my gift certificate Christmas Present present to myself.

Color me annoyed.

 

            “So, roll me further B_t__h!”

Quote - Just as a side-note: wonder how many over at CG Society actually Puchased their copy of 3DSMax or Maya or... :blink:

Again, doesn't make it right. If this person had been a true pirate, he would have kept quiet about his mode of acquiring the software, don't you think?

Go ahead: flame me if you want, but you'll have to agree that computer purchase with softare included happens a lot.

 

You would be surprised ;) 

Des. is helping out in a CG forum for 3DS Max.

Give modeling tips technical etc..   well sometimes he get so angry that he just shut down his browser.

The people come with the newest Max, Maya, Adobe and Plug ins in his Forum and ask for tips. Honestly when you count together, there comes an amont in € together you just sit there and :scared:

You can not tell me this all legal...:blink:

La vie est éternelle. L'amour est immortel.

“Dwell on the beauty of life. Watch the stars, and see yourself running with them.”
― Marcus Aurelius,

Much as I've expressed my concern for the vendors/content makers on here and elsewhere I have to admit that my concern extends to the developers of Poser as well. When I look at this product and all the hard work that's gone into making it what it is, I begrudge not one single penny of what I paid. One day, I will afford modo. That is the next step up. For the longest time I stayed with P7. It's what I could afford. Yes, PP was ever so appealing but I couldn't afford it. And I couldn't see myself facing this community (or look myself in the face) with greyware software. I doubt our young OP is going to be back but if he does read this: start small. P7 is only $40 at tiger software. You'll have the peace of mind knowing you're doing the right thing. And the support you can get in this group is amazing. Well worth doing it right.

Monterey/Mint21.x/Win10 - Blender3.x - PP11.3(cm) - Musescore3.6.2

Wir sind gewohnt, daß die Menschen verhöhnen was sie nicht verstehen
[it is clear that humans have contempt for that which they do not understand] 

Metaphor of Chooks

Piracy is becoming a very serious issue. It is not a question of money, it is turning into an ideology or already it is.

When a new software is released, many times a very expensive software, it is very soon available. From where did come this software? Someone had to purchase it first, someone that had the money, have purchased it and then put to share. To crack a software is not difficult, but even so it requires some effort and time and the person that do it did not get any profit doing it because is released for free.

I have seen full 80 GB BlueRay rips, imagine uploading 80 GigaBytes!!! Someone must have to purchase the BlueRay, rip it, have a very fast internet conection, pay a hosting site and spend one day or more uploading it and the person get no money for his effort, even he/she/it had to spend money to do this.

Once uploaded it reproduces and spreads, but even the matrix is for free the reproduction process requires effort, time and money. You have to download the matrix, upload it at several sites and every time is removed from the site due copyrights, you have to upload it again. Time, internet bandwidth, efforts and you get no money doing this.

 

As I said before, it is not a question of money, it is a question of ideology. Every day more and more people are revolted against copyright laws, patents and the exhorbitant profits of the companies. I know of musiciand, once very famous, that didn't get a single cent for his work, all the copyright money goes to the recording comapny and nothing to the artist. Even I, am revolted by this subversion of copyright laws that protect nothing the artists, the real creators;

Stupidity also evolves!

Quote - Much as I've expressed my concern for the vendors/content makers on here and elsewhere I have to admit that my concern extends to the developers of Poser as well. When I look at this product and all the hard work that's gone into making it what it is, I begrudge not one single penny of what I paid. One day, I will afford modo. That is the next step up. For the longest time I stayed with P7. It's what I could afford. Yes, PP was ever so appealing but I couldn't afford it. And I couldn't see myself facing this community (or look myself in the face) with greyware software. I doubt our young OP is going to be back but if he does read this: start small. P7 is only $40 at tiger software. You'll have the peace of mind knowing you're doing the right thing. And the support you can get in this group is amazing. Well worth doing it right.

 

:thumbupboth: 

Couldn't agree more. 

La vie est éternelle. L'amour est immortel.

“Dwell on the beauty of life. Watch the stars, and see yourself running with them.”
― Marcus Aurelius,

The first time when I see our Product's on a fileshare server...honestly, I was shocked.

Hurted. Yes, like Robinsveil said, It hurts.

Our Cloitre as example, we put more than 3 Months work in it. Just the modelling and texturing.

Without the rest, like researching, buy textures together, work out the concept etc...

See this building on a filesharing site is like your stuff is on a flea market . It hurts really.

 

Ideologie? I have no clue. But I think it is more. I know that many filesharing sites make a lot of profits with advertising etc..so for the owner not a big deal to buy stuff and upload it. And take after money for "High speed download" and other crap.

La vie est éternelle. L'amour est immortel.

“Dwell on the beauty of life. Watch the stars, and see yourself running with them.”
― Marcus Aurelius,

I don't think anyone here was rude to the OP; if you disagree I respectfully suggest you have led a very sheltered life.  Suspicious and mickey taking yes but nothing I'd say was outright rudeness.

In any event, the fact remains the software the OP obtained is not legitimate for use.  Nothing to say he/she can't contact SM and the relevant other parties to get fixed up with legal stuff.  It's the only way to go.

I don't use anything I haven't obtained legally; as a sometime vendor it's more trouble than it's worth to use hookey stuff, not to mention it'd be a stab in the back to fellow artists and vendors.

Coppula eam se non posit acceptera jocularum.

My Store

My Gallery

My only comment is that tarring someone based on the language they use really seems a bit much. Reach conclusions based on the other factors if you will, but throwing in the equivalent of 'boy, you don't sound like you're from around here,' is kinda gratituitous IMO - profile away.

 Kaihean, I don't know what they would say but it can't hurt to email or call Smith Micro with the serial number & if possible the name of the former owner and explain the situation.  Maybe they'll cut you a deal or maybe they'll tell you to p___ up a rope - nothing ventured, nothing gained :-) 

"Democracy is a pathetic belief in the collective wisdom of individual ignorance." - H. L. Mencken

Quote - Ideologie? I have no clue. But I think it is more. I know that many filesharing sites make a lot of profits with advertising etc..so for the owner not a big deal to buy stuff and upload it. And take after money for "High speed download" and other crap.

Filesharing sites are other part of the equation, they don't care of copyrights or copyrights laws do not exist for them. They only want to make money. When a war exists are the weapon makers/traders that make a lot of money while the parts are killing one each other

Quote - See this building on a filesharing site is like your stuff is on a flea market . It hurts really.

Is not so tragic, people that download will not buy from you, so it makes no difference in your income. What is tragic is to have few sales of a product and many times you spend so many days doing it

Stupidity also evolves!

kawecki, no it is not the money I talk about. I know those people who grab our stuff for free, would never buy one polygone from us.

It is more to see hard work make worthless in this kind of sites.

La vie est éternelle. L'amour est immortel.

“Dwell on the beauty of life. Watch the stars, and see yourself running with them.”
― Marcus Aurelius,

Quote - It is more to see hard work make worthless in this kind of sites.

If you worked on something it was because you wanted to do it, enjoyed doing it and you had satisfaction and are happy with the results you achieved. The value of your work doesn't change if someone updloaded it or not. Someone can say that your work is a crap, does it means that your work has no value? Or someone can say that your work is the most marvelous thing, does it mean that your work is so extraordinary divinity?

Stupidity also evolves!

Quote - > Quote - It is more to see hard work make worthless in this kind of sites.

If you worked on something it was because you wanted to do it, enjoyed doing it and you had satisfaction and are happy with the results you achieved. The value of your work doesn't change if someone updloaded it or not. Someone can say that your work is a crap, does it means that your work has no value? Or someone can say that your work is the most marvelous thing, does it mean that your work is so extraordinary divinity?

 

LOl, no of course not.

I can not exactly explain what I mean. Sorry my english is not that good.

It is simply when people don't care about how much passion you put in a work. They steal and even more worst, they rate the stolen work. ( Hope you understand me a bit what I mean) :)

La vie est éternelle. L'amour est immortel.

“Dwell on the beauty of life. Watch the stars, and see yourself running with them.”
― Marcus Aurelius,

Quote - It is simply when people don't care about how much passion you put in a work.

But people don't care on you. You can have a small group that loves you, other small group hates you and the most of people don't care about you and even don't know that you exist. If one day a train passes over me there will be a lot of people looking around, commenting, making jokes, telling stories and someone can say, "look where a leg has gone" and other will reply "Wow!!"

Stupidity also evolves!

I can't comment on the OPs situation, but I agree that all the piracy is very damaging and very wrong. Sadly it seems more and more people are basically stealing and think nothing of it.

We had riots here in the UK earlier in the year and people were smashing shop windows and helping themselves to anything they could carry. I can't help thinking that all the piracy of films, music, software, etc puts into peoples minds that it's ok to steal, so long as you don't get caught. ;-(

I suppose there have always been outlaws/pirates going back centuries but the romatic view that these are all Robin Hoods, good, honest people stealing from the rich and giving to the poor to fight injustice, is about as far from the truth as you can get.

Two plagues created in the XIX century, Capitalism and Communism, have destroyed and corrupted the society turning people into savage animals worshiping the only one god: Money. Money is all the most important thing and the only thing that these "animals" must care.

Capitalism only wants to take your money and all you have, Communism only wants to take your money and all you have and you stupid slave you must work, accumulate money and give all you have to them. Nothing else matters, human values are only past history.

Stupidity also evolves!

Kawecki, did human ever had a value? When I look at our whole history, i have daubts.

La vie est éternelle. L'amour est immortel.

“Dwell on the beauty of life. Watch the stars, and see yourself running with them.”
― Marcus Aurelius,

This thread has been a good read for me and I am plesantly surprise to find that I am not alone after all.   Ever since I started using computers I have purchased all of my software and today every program I have was purchased or free because the creator deemed that it should be.  Worrying part of this though is I was beginning to think I was unique as pirating appears to have become the norm.  Some people have become upset with me in the past because I would not give them a copy of a program or a CD/DVD.

As for pirates trying to justify their actions on the high cost of software, well I still cannot believe what Poser Pro 2012 can do considering the program cost me around £90 in the UK thanks to an early adopter special price.  I have purchased every update since Poser 6 and went to 8 and then Pro 2010 for the 64 bit processing.  I do not regreat any one of the purchases as I felt they were great value for money considering the complexity, let alone the fun I have had over the years.  The cost of the items here at Rendo are also unbelieveable considering I am paying $10 - $20 for most for something that I could not create myself even if I had the many hours it would take to create.

I know many of the pirates would not have paid for a product so no revenue is lost but this is not the point.  My dis-like of pirates (I make no assumption of such for the OP of this thread) is not the money they save but the fact that it deters some very skilled people from creating anything.  That is a loss to the whole 3D community.  I admire the vendors that stuggle on and always support the work that I like with hard earned cash.  

 

 

I use Poser 13 on Windows 11 - For Scene set up I use a Geekcom A5 -  Ryzen 9 5900HX, with 64 gig ram and 3 TB  storage, mini PC with final rendering done on normal sized desktop using an AMD Ryzen Threadipper 1950X CPU, Corsair Hydro H100i CPU cooler, 3XS EVGA GTX 1080i SC with 11g Ram, 4 X 16gig Corsair DDR4 Ram and a Corsair RM 100 PSU .   The desktop is in a remote location with rendering done via Queue Manager which gives me a clearer desktop and quieter computer room.

Quote - As for pirates trying to justify their actions on the high cost of software, well I still cannot believe what Poser Pro 2012 can do considering the program cost me around £90 in the UK

As I said before, piracy goes beyond the monetary value. Poser is not expensive software that is worth its value and even it comes full of content. You cannot say that a music CD is something so expensive that only elected people can afford. Trying to understand or justivy piracy based on the absolute monetary value you will never be able to understand the scope of this problem.

For a simplified analysis you can divide the world in two: Capitalism and Communism. In Communism copyrights and intelectual property do not exist. In Capitalism a pirate is a criminal, in Communism depending on the case he can become a hero. The world is divided and people do not share the same values.

You cannot ignore Communism, there billions of people living in Communist countries or have been educated under a Communist regime. You cannot ignore the importance and influence of these people. China is the first real economical power and is becoming the second military power after Russia. Russia and the countries belonging to the former URSS, even not more Communists, its population was born and educated under a Commumist system.

It is a very simple analysis, because there are billions of people that don't belong to Communism or Capitalism, or flip-flop from one side to another and have other values.

 

Stupidity also evolves!

Quote -
My only comment is that tarring someone based on the language they use really seems a bit much. Reach conclusions based on the other factors if you will, but throwing in the equivalent of 'boy, you don't sound like you're from around here,' is kinda gratituitous IMO - profile away.

I'll assume you are addressing me with this one. And I'm not basing my opinion on "Boy... you don't sound like you are from around here".

Maybe I'm jaded from working with a few hundred 16 to 28 year old "workers" over 4 years, talking to my colleagues (and accounting for the fact that English isn't everyone's native language here on the "intertubes").... but:

Unfortunately my comments based on spelling, vernacular, grammar et al ARE most often valid.

There is an entire Generation out there, most of whom (at least here in the USA) think Music is free, Movies/video are free etc. etc.

This group doesn't understand why companies don't want to pay them 80 grand to surf the web,  might have a problem with Pink and Green hair, 61 piercing's, teardrop tattoos, 2" ear gauges, or a gold bone in their nose.

They don't understand why any one of a thousand combinations of Spandex, flannel, Purple Light up sneakers, tee shirts, Army Boots, neon paisley clothing, trench coats, flip flops, jeans, tank tops advertising wee wee flavored American Beer, roller skates, skater duds, smelly leather wrist bands, hood ornaments on chains, dog collars, top hats, and neon tutus might not be welcome in the work place.

They are baffled, after years of being rewarded both for successes and for failures, why a company might not give them an "awe... you tried" or "thanks for showing up" trophy instead of holding them accountable for some colossal screw up. Most can't spell, use punctuation, construct grammatically correct sentences, or read anything but text speak. They list emoticons and texting as skill sets on their resumes.

The "dumb kid" in most of my classes growing up seems like a word smith or a literary genius by comparison.

It seems to be changing "a bit" with the current economy... but they feel that they don't have to work somewhere that doesn't give them "Thanks for showing up" awards and don't understand that the workplace may not be as "advanced" in it's thinking as they are.

 

            “So, roll me further B_t__h!”

It's not changing fast enough.  I'm really getting tired of writing the children up for dress code violations, confiscating cell phones, suspending them for inappropriate language and tardiness (not that any of them know what the word means although I did have one ask me why I was writing him up for watching Dr. Who).

Quote - They don't understand why any one of a thousand combinations of Spandex, flannel, Purple Light up sneakers, tee shirts, Army Boots, neon paisley clothing, trench coats, flip flops, jeans, tank tops advertising wee wee flavored American Beer, roller skates, skater duds, smelly leather wrist bands, hood ornaments on chains, dog collars, top hats, and neon tutus might not be welcome in the work place.

WoW!!, Now we can understand in real time how was the process of decadence and collapse of Rome

Stupidity also evolves!

Sorry Mac. I'm sure your experience has led you to your methods. I mean no disrespect when I say that the same process is at work in police departments. Pretty soon, everyone who looks , talks, dresses or acts a certain way is automatically a bad guy. It's lazy and it breeds hostility among the very people they're supposed to be serving. If you really want to educate someone about piracy, it strikes me that calling them out is perhaps not the best first step, but YMMV.

I think a better example is PhilC. On several occasions, I've seen him deal with people here who he pretty much knew had ripped off his software by the questions they were asking. He is always the perfect gentleman (not saying you arent :-) He makes it obvious what is going on with openly being accusatory. The guy could probably slit your throat and you'ld never even know you were bleeding. But that's his way.

NB. I can only wish I were the age you might judge by my occasional use of dude, fanboi, pr0n and yes, I have to admit even sk8r once or twice. :-)

"Democracy is a pathetic belief in the collective wisdom of individual ignorance." - H. L. Mencken

Heh Imkenzie...... bad news. The corporate world has been "profiling" for as long as the Police Depts... if not longer. So have you whether or not you want to admit it. Remember that hairy douchenozzle with the dirty tee shirt and the "Love Hate" tattoos on his knuckles last time you were at Wally World? Or that non hairy, clean suited, no ink douchenozzle in front of you?

I grew up in the "Save the whales, end the war, tye die, I'd love to teach the world to sing, feed the hungry" generation. I had long hair,  a beard, some ink, and an earing back when, if you weren't a Pirate, you damn well better be ready to defend yourself. I could get away with it because I owned half of the Business.

I'm not saying that being illiterate and wearing spandex wrapped around your fat, green haired, saggy man boobed fanny.... while playing "Batman Arkem City" or napping at your desk makes you a bad person..... but it does make you a lousy employee. And someone who would have gotten the fecal matter beat out of them everyday back in 1976.

I'm not really "profiling anyone"... I'm just telling you how it is in the real world. Most of my "Feed the World" Friends are now "I got mine, you get yours, lets bomb some brown people, I'm voting for Newtie because the TV told me to" types..... and with the exception of Google... you won't find many living wage jobs where "individuality" is encouraged. Unless it's the talent to make money for the company that you work for.

If you are Kat Von D, Mike Tyson or a Trust Fund kid... then go ahead and express your individuality. Otherwise.... you'll need a job. 

 

P.S. I'm 52 and have been calling other dudes "dude and bitch" since the early 70's. I've been on the Intertubes since 1981 and was actually around to see the invention of emoticons and the use of words like teh, pron, pwned.

It's kind of like the new car commercial with the cool start buttons and gear shifters in the dash... they started that in 1920 and stopped in the late 50's. What's old becomes new again.

"Up in here"..."(insert anything here) yo", and Snoop Dog's Hizzouse nonsense are new. For now.

For Shizzle my nizzle.

 

            “So, roll me further B_t__h!”

"fo shizzle ma nizzle" is a bastardization of "fo' sheezy mah neezy" which is a bastardization of "for sure mah nigga" which is a bastdardization of "I concur with you whole heartedly my African american brother"

If you concur whole heartedly.... you get a decent Job.

 

            “So, roll me further B_t__h!”

WOW First post on a new forum and I spawned 2 pages.You have successfully   made me feel like the most important person in all of your lives And at the same time made me feel like a first class DUMB ASS for asking for a lil help .Dam you artsy type get me every time.

You make me feel like I single handily HACK the 3D software world. came to each one of your houses and took food out of your hand and kicked your dog. DRAMA MUCH HEAR???

I do appreciate  the HARD work that go’s into the pieces you create and marvel on how its done.

I don’t know what happens to your art after you produce it .I my self would love to see something I worked hard one be spread out for all to see FOR FREE. I don’t want or need anyone to buy my work for me to feel good about it.

Frankly and not to seen RUDE how and where one obtains  ones software is none of MY Business   !!

One would think other artist would embrace a fledgling artist looking for a lil advice from what he would think to be pros?

And for the record  young  ?    ,Hardly       I’m 48 years old with 6 kids

My wife and I are avid gamers. 6 years in (WOW and the sims ) I love building and creating and am ready to make the next step into 3D modeling.

So now if we can move on from how and why I have what I have and on to, lets see what he can do with it,?

Attached Link: Wings 3D

Even though you can assemble some things in Poser using primitive shapes, it's technically not a modeling program, and takes a little more effort to get something to look right than it would to do it in a modeling program.

In the image here, I made a model of my PC using nothing but Poser and primitive shapes. It was before I knew how to model, and hell, was kinda fun.

Now, I use Wings 3D (see attached link). It's a free modeling program that's extrememly easy to learn. You can always try Blender if you're feeling frisky as well :o)

... and...

Welcome to renderosity :o)

                                                                                                                    

Poser 10

Octane Render

Wings 3D

Just another "lay of the land" thing... 

As BionicRooster says, Poser is not a modeling program.  Generally speaking, Poser models cannot be legally exported to games like the Sims (though I realize many people do it, even selling them for a profit).  We've had people show up here asking for help in pirating Poser content to Second Life, the Sims, etc.  Don't do that.  You may think it's silly, but copyright is very important to us here at Renderosity.

If you learn a real modeling program like Blender or Wings3D, then using the models made in them in games is fine.

Wow, I stand corrected. I gave you the benefit of the doubt. Thanks for bringing me up short, Kaihean. Won't happen again.

My judgment about your age was that your level of spelling skill. And that you appeared ignorant of copyright law. I guess ICPrincess and OKCRandy and others that were supposedly rude to you were right.

Get a legal copy of Poser.  Or you will remain the first-class dumb-ass you described yourself as. Piracy is piracy. Ignorance does not exonerate you.Nor does arrogance.

I'm subscribing to the lay-of-the-land myself, now...

Monterey/Mint21.x/Win10 - Blender3.x - PP11.3(cm) - Musescore3.6.2

Wir sind gewohnt, daß die Menschen verhöhnen was sie nicht verstehen
[it is clear that humans have contempt for that which they do not understand] 

Metaphor of Chooks

Well Kaihean, it's nice to see that you learned to communicate via the written word (even if it was by using a spell checker... though it can't check words like "Hear" instead of "here"), aged 32 years, and aquired a Family that allowed you to start gaming, over night. It's gratifying to know that a little elbow grease and a "can do" attitude still pays off.

And you are not the focus of, nor much of a concern in my life....drama or not. I just have lots of time ;-O

No matter, your software is still illegal. You'll do what you do of course... but your options have been pretty well covered.

And Damn is not spelled Dam. Shoot me a PM and I'll help you spell the other words needed to get you started in a not at all lucrative creative career in Profanity. It is my medium. I'm the BagginsBill of Profanity.... ProfanityDude if you will.

 

            “So, roll me further B_t__h!”

I usually refer to a well thumbed copy of Roger Mellie's Profanisaurus, as and when occasion dictates ;-)

Quote - I'm the BagginsBill of Profanity.... ProfanityDude if you will.

Hate to burst your bubble, mate. If anyone deserves that particular accolade it's me. :)

Coppula eam se non posit acceptera jocularum.

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Oh, boys and girls, do I feel lonely here in this group.

Posering since Poser1, yeah an old oldtimer, I "only" bought 3 extra items ever.
I regret all 3, so buying? Well, my hair in my neck tells me ontherwise.
And I never made anything to sell.

When I need something, I make it.
Well, I try, and mostly succeed.
Using Poser, anim8or, uvmapper free, and Picture Publisher 10.

Exept for Poser, all old timers, so I am in good company :-)

I love the creative part way more then the financial part.
Poser is my hobby, my passion.
I love the experimenting, the testing, the; "How Grr Grr Grr can I get there?"

How to get to 90% of the quality using 10% of the effort, and at NO extra cost but time.
It is my hobby, so time is not a relevant factor.

"Time" is what I have for free.

On the copyright issue?
There HAS to be a legal way to get these Warez sites of the net.
How can it be soo difficult to get those sites offline and convicted?

I like the open way of life.
I like freedom more then anything else.

But I hate criminals, thiefs and pirates.

Happy Posering to ya all, and keep it legal please.
Thanks,
Tony

Poser 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 7, P8 and PPro2010, P9 and PP2012, P10 and PP2014 Game Dev
"Do not drive faster then your angel can fly"!

Quote - the BagginsBill of Profanity

LOL!  I love this thread! :)

This is a joke.  Just for fun!

Lol … I love threads like this because they make my head spin.  Let us take a look at the bottom line of what we have said here:

If you own software (license for Poser, etc.)  it has no value because you can not sell it and you can not give it away legally.  Value is determined in the world of courts and lawyers by what a “Willing Buyer” and a “Willing Seller” would exchange for the property.

Now, let us talk divorce.  Some guy (or girl) knows he is getting a divorce and goes out and buys $100,000.00 in software (license for Poser, etc.) with all the cash the couple has. (this is not crazy … it could be done fairly easily and people getting a divorce will do crazy things)

What happens?

Poser Pro 2012 SR3

Windows 7 Professional 64 bit

Intel Core I7 990x 3.46G 6 core

24G RAM

EVGA GTX580 R Video Card

Single HP LP2475 1920x1200 monitor

______________________________

http://www.toxicwolf.com

Quote - No matter, your software is still illegal.

Unless this software was downloaded by someone, it was purchased by someone, so it is not illegal. If other person that is not whom purchased is using this software and it was not stolen from whom purchased, it doesn't turn it illegal. You must know a little more about laws.

Stupidity also evolves!

Quote - .... ProfanityDude if you will.

Are you related to the PostalDude?

I'm not a gamer but I did have to go out and buy the game that Joe Lieberman called the most violent game ever. 

Quote - There HAS to be a legal way to get these Warez sites of the net.
How can it be soo difficult to get those sites offline and convicted?

Really? How difficult? Impossible. Here's why... Most, if not all, are hosted in Russia, or a country friendly to Russia, or at least, as equally lawless, such as Ukraine. They may pay lip service to international law but in reality, copyrights are way, way down on their list of things to do. In any event, copyright laws are in general, civil instruments, not criminal. As for torrent sites, they are still something of a grey area. Some have been convicted but the convictions have by and large been either dubious/for political intent/unconstitutional. Like it or not, they're both probably here to stay.

Coppula eam se non posit acceptera jocularum.

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Quote - > Quote - No matter, your software is still illegal.

Unless this software was downloaded by someone, it was purchased by someone, so it is not illegal. If other person that is not whom purchased is using this software and it was not stolen from whom purchased, it doesn't turn it illegal. You must know a little more about laws.

So should you. If the terms are "non-transferable", the software is not legal for use.

Coppula eam se non posit acceptera jocularum.

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Quote - So should you. If the terms are "non-transferable", the software is not legal for use.

The EULA is not the law, you can put anything you want in the EULA, but this doesn't make it a law.

You purchased a knife and the EULA states: "SicoKnivesCorp grants you the right to use the purchased knife to kill your wife"

Does it mean that it will be legal to kill your wife using this knife?

It is funny to see people living in a Capitalist system trying to apply Communist laws. As I know private property do exist in Capitalism and if you purchased something this becomes your property and you can do anything you want with something you own and it is a Constitutional right that no EULA can deprive you from this right.

Stupidity also evolves!

Quote - > Quote - So should you. If the terms are "non-transferable", the software is not legal for use.

The EULA is not the law, you can put anything you want in the EULA, but this doesn't make it a law.

You purchased a knife and the EULA states: "SicoKnivesCorp grants you the right to use the purchased knife to kill your wife"

Does it mean that it will be legal to kill your wife using this knife?

It is funny to see people living in a Capitalist system trying to apply Communist laws. As I know private property do exist in Capitalism and if you purchased something this becomes your property and you can do anything you want with something you own and it is a Constitutional right that no EULA can deprive you from this right.

Hmmm, I think Microsoft would find your point of view very interesting. Very interesting, indeed.

Monterey/Mint21.x/Win10 - Blender3.x - PP11.3(cm) - Musescore3.6.2

Wir sind gewohnt, daß die Menschen verhöhnen was sie nicht verstehen
[it is clear that humans have contempt for that which they do not understand] 

Metaphor of Chooks

I find your lack of legal knowledge...disturbing.

That's true if you were an owner, and not just a licensee, but in this case, we are licensee's of the software, and not owners. ...but what do I know, I'm just a communist...  :lol:

Here is similar "Legal" case:  LINK

I'm not a lawyer, but I think , if you purchase something like software and agree to an EULA, then you are bound by the terms of that as a contract between the seller and yourself. If you then break the terms of the EULA you open yourself to the risk of civil proceedings ( aka whoever can hire the most expensive lawyer wins ).

The Eula is the Law. It is a binding Contract that YOU agree to abide by when you install the software.

 

            “So, roll me further B_t__h!”

So there... neener neener.

 

            “So, roll me further B_t__h!”

People keep saying: "buy the software". You don't buy software: you buy a licence to use the software. That licence comes with an agreement (End User Licence Agreement). You are bound to the terms of that agreement (in any civilised part of the world where the courts can take you to task for breaking the terms of that agreement - wouldn't know about certain 3rd-world countries, of course)...

Monterey/Mint21.x/Win10 - Blender3.x - PP11.3(cm) - Musescore3.6.2

Wir sind gewohnt, daß die Menschen verhöhnen was sie nicht verstehen
[it is clear that humans have contempt for that which they do not understand] 

Metaphor of Chooks

I think I live in a 3rd World State.

 

            “So, roll me further B_t__h!”

Quote - > Quote - So should you. If the terms are "non-transferable", the software is not legal for use.

The EULA is not the law, you can put anything you want in the EULA, but this doesn't make it a law.

You purchased a knife and the EULA states: "SicoKnivesCorp grants you the right to use the purchased knife to kill your wife"

Does it mean that it will be legal to kill your wife using this knife?

It is funny to see people living in a Capitalist system trying to apply Communist laws. As I know private property do exist in Capitalism and if you purchased something this becomes your property and you can do anything you want with something you own and it is a Constitutional right that no EULA can deprive you from this right.

Specifically, in English law at least, a EULA cannot grant rights to commit an illegal act, (in your example, murder) nor can it enforce an illegal condition on the purchaser. Since contracts can be challenged in court, and to this date a standard EULA for software has never been successfully challenged, your comparison is invalid, not a fair comparison and quite a bit silly. I would also bet most (note, I said "most" countries will have a similar set of laws in place.

Coppula eam se non posit acceptera jocularum.

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Quote - People keep saying: "buy the software". You don't buy software: you buy a licence to use the software.

This varies; you actually can buy software, you can license software, and you can buy a copy of software to use, depending on what you actually buy. You probably rather seldomly buy software, but often buy a copy (this is what you do if you get a dvd, for example).

Quote - That licence comes with an agreement (End User Licence Agreement). You are bound to the terms of that agreement (in any civilised part of the world where the courts can take you to task for breaking the terms of that agreement - wouldn't know about certain 3rd-world countries, of course)...

Especially the EULAs of software bought from international operating software companies are formulated in a way, that they try to cover most of the countries this software is shipped to. This often means, that parts of these EULAs do not apply in one or the other country (this has nothing to do with 3rd world), it is simply because the companies do not want to make a seperate license agreement for each country they want to sell their software to. So you always have to look at each case and part of the EULA seperately. Take for example amazon. I have got my Poser from amazon. Is this legal? Amazon probably did not agree to Posers license agreement, because the license says "not transferable", but somehow amazon transfered this license to me, do you think they are fences and i am a criminal? What if you buy Poser as a gift for your spouse? Should this be allowed? Most EULAs do not allow that, yet it is legal in most countries (western world included). The USA have the first sale doctrine for these cases, but it varies from state to state and most other countries do not have an equivalent at all.

Quote - Kawecki: The EULA is not the law, ...

RobinsVeil: Hmmm, I think Microsoft would find your point of view very interesting. Very interesting, indeed

I do not exactly understand what that should mean, but for the innocent bystander: Microsoft is a company not only known for it's operating systems, but also known for products such as Internet Explorer and Office. And with these (among other things) they made themselves quite a name for their systematic infringements of patent laws (a specialization of copyright law). Judging from the sheer number of cases Microsoft is sued for infringement each year, BionicRooster's suggestion of erasing your hard disk and installing windows is probably the easiest way to install a big amount of unlicensed  software without actually getting sued (after losing a case they usually spent large amounts of money to avoid being forced to take back their software from their customers).

Quote - MacMyers: The Eula is the Law. It is a binding Contract that YOU agree to abide by when you install the software...
I think I live in a 3rd World State.

Even though directly opposing Kawecki's statement, i think the distinction is not to be made among 3rd world or not, but rather by a distinction between democratic or absolutistic regimes. Democratic regimes obey the principles of separation of power, meaning you can write in your EULAs what you want, but if someone violates them, it is still up to the judges to decide if it was illegal or not. Not to the one writing the EULAs and even less to some crazy forum posters, like me, so perhaps you live in an absolutistic country rather than 3rd world.

All this is pure speculation.

OK, I make some Poser Utility to sell.
I go to a Belgian Loyer and let him write me an EULA.
I include this in every purchase.
Now someone, "saturdays over square sundays", meaning in another country, many moons and even more miles away, violates my EULA.

And then? Do I go to court?

Will I invest thousands and thousands of my own hard earned euro-dollar-yens-gold-diamonds?
For what?

He broke my Belgian EULA on a 5 to 20 dollar item? 

For a Dazzie-DAZ or Posy-Poser item, this is not likely to happen.

A Company like Microsoft could take legal action, yes.
Perhaps even SM could.

And the SH*T is, they know that.

And as SamT said here above; They are here to stay.

---

All that licence and Eula stuff is only for people who behave and try to respect the rules..
A criminal could not care less.
(If he /she can read the Eula in the first place)

Pointless discussion.

Poser 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 7, P8 and PPro2010, P9 and PP2012, P10 and PP2014 Game Dev
"Do not drive faster then your angel can fly"!

Quote - Hmmm, I think Microsoft would find your point of view very interesting. Very interesting, indeed.

Microsoft is above the Law and above the Constitution, after all is not Billy Gates God ?

Stupidity also evolves!

Quote - People keep saying: "buy the software". You don't buy software: you buy a licence to use the software.

It would be if it was a leasing contract or a lending contract, but is not. It is a sale and you are the only and legitime owner of what you purchased, unless you live under Communist laws where you own nothing.

Stupidity also evolves!

Quote - The Eula is the Law. It is a binding Contract that YOU agree to abide by when you install the software.

It is not in this way. The EULA or any contract cannot have clauses that are against the State and Federal Laws and the Constitution.

The EULA or any contract cannot deny you rights granted by the Constitution or the Laws.

If an EULA or contract have illegal clauses the legal value of the EULA or contract is nill, so beware what do you put when you write an EULA, because it can have no legal value.

If you signed a contract doesn't mean that you are lost and must obbey even when you was cheated. The Law doesn't work in this way, you must only obbey what is legal. If it was in this way as you stated, people with vision problems, with little education or even educated people that don't have knowledge of legal words and terms could be cheated without any possiblity of defense.

Contracts use to have texts written in tiny letters that few people are able to read and full of legal words and term that only a lawyer knows waht it mean. Many words have a popular or common meaning, but this same word has a different meaning in legal language. Have you ever read a contract ? Do you understand all the words and terms that are written ? Do you know what it means ? Probably not, unless you are a lawyer or have enough experience in contracts. You read the contract, understand something or think that you understand and the most of the contract you have no idea of what it is. You sign it and does it means that you are damned if you was cheated ?

Lawyers can put anything in tiny letters full of legal words and terms, you can sign it without knowing that you just sold your wife, your mother and your dog. Does it mean that you lost your wife, your mother and your dog just because you signed the contract ?

The Law is not in this way, you don't lost your wife, your mother and your dog, because this contract had illegal clauses and has no legal value and it doesn't matter if you have signed it 100 times, it have no legal value.

This is the theory, in practice cheating works very well. You sign a contract without knowing what you have signed, some days later comes someone of the comapny to take your wife, your mother and your dog. You ask what it is and they reply that you sined the contract, show you your signature in the contract and a letter from a lwayer full of legal words and terms telling you if you don't give your wife, your mother and your dog you will go to jail. You give up because you believe if you have signed you cannot do anything else that obbey what you have signed. You have a false view of what is the Law and you do not your rights.

Of course, if you defend your rights, you will know that what you have signed has no legal value, you continue to have your wife, your mother and your dog and the company will not be able to do anything against you. Even you can sue the company and get some money.

But all work fine for companies, in 10,000 people only one knows the Law and his rights and 9,999 believes that the EULA is the law. The company won 9,999 wifes, mothers and dog and only in one case it didn't work. Good business.

You have a profit of billions and time time you have to pay only some millions whenthe scheme failed.

Stupidity also evolves!

Quote - > Quote - People keep saying: "buy the software". You don't buy software: you buy a licence to use the software.

It would be if it was a leasing contract or a lending contract, but is not. It is a sale and you are the only and legitime owner of what you purchased, unless you live under Communist laws where you own nothing.

Complete and utter bollocks.

Coppula eam se non posit acceptera jocularum.

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Quote - Specifically, in English law at least, a EULA cannot grant rights to commit an illegal act, (in your example, murder) nor can it enforce an illegal condition on the purchaser. Since contracts can be challenged in court, and to this date a standard EULA for software has never been successfully challenged, your comparison is invalid, not a fair comparison and quite a bit silly.

I shall change a little my EULA:

"You cannot use a knife from SicoKnivesCorp to kill people"

Now you are in your home and a bandit invade your home and attack your wife, you take the purchased knife and kill the bandit. You have violated the EULA and so, you are a criminal.

The Constitution grants you the right of self defense, and you have used your Constitutional right. But the EULA denies you this right. As the Constitution is above any EULA, this EULA clause has no legal value and you are not a criminal.

Stupidity also evolves!

And one more:

The begining of all this story and analyzing only wwhat was written, Kaihean bought in auction a computer and the computer came with Poser, other softwares and all the disks.

Someone purchased Poser, installed it and the lost his computer ending in auction, Poser changed hands, this violates the EULA and then it was sold, one more EULA violation. Who took away Poser from the licensed user commit a crime, who was encharged of the auction commit a crime again and who has purchased is also a criminal. One word: RIDICULOUS

Stupidity also evolves!

Wrong Kaweki...

 

Actually... under those circumstances it wou.....zZZZZZZZZZZZZzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz.......snyx...zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

 

            “So, roll me further B_t__h!”

Quote - > Quote - Specifically, in English law at least, a EULA cannot grant rights to commit an illegal act, (in your example, murder) nor can it enforce an illegal condition on the purchaser. Since contracts can be challenged in court, and to this date a standard EULA for software has never been successfully challenged, your comparison is invalid, not a fair comparison and quite a bit silly.

I shall change a little my EULA:

"You cannot use a knife from SicoKnivesCorp to kill people"

Now you are in your home and a bandit invade your home and attack your wife, you take the purchased knife and kill the bandit. You have violated the EULA and so, you are a criminal.

The Constitution grants you the right of self defense, and you have used your Constitutional right. But the EULA denies you this right. As the Constitution is above any EULA, this EULA clause has no legal value and you are not a criminal.

What constitution? The US one doesn't apply in my country. In any case, a violation of a EULA is not a criminal act, it's a civil matter. You should also consider a EULA wouldn't apply to a physical object such as a kitchen knife. That is a sale of a genuine, physical object as opposed to the license to use a piece of software. Any rights you have regarding the knife would be covered in the warranty but would not supercede rights in law. Likewise, no EULA can take away your rights in law, nor make you liable for any actions beyond the scope of its original intent. Anyhow, I'm done discussing this matter with you because you wheel out this old crap every time the matter of copyright comes up and hey, you're always wrong. Since I know you're an intelligent guy, the only conclusion I can come to is you're trolling and, as per the TOS here, I ain't feeding the trolls.

Coppula eam se non posit acceptera jocularum.

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Quote - What constitution? The US one doesn't apply in my country.

Well, well, well, it's only a theoretical discussion plenty of abstractions and exagerated examples. In practice know reading in Russian can help in what you click and of course, not the EULA

Stupidity also evolves!

Quote - know you're an intelligent guy, the only conclusion I can come to is you're trolling

Can you reach to an agreement ? Is supposed that trolls are stupid, so am I intelligent or stupid ? I cannot be both at the same time.

Stupidity also evolves!

Thats about enough.

_____________________
.::That which does not kill us makes us stronger::.
-- Friedrich Nietzsche